Lockdown (4/13/2008)

[iggymcfly 0]

Oh god, you people are so negative. What does it take to satisfy you? If I said two months ago that Joe and Angle would have a completely serious competitive build, would have an excellent 25 minute main event on PPV where Joe won cleanly, and that people would still be complaining, you all would have said that I was crazy.

[The Ghost of bps21 0]

We made Leena complain about TNA getting attention today.

 

...

 

I'm...just...so...proud...

[ANKLELOCK 0]

Main event was okay, mainly because of the MMA stuff that eventually disintigrated into standard Angle reversal formula stuff that killed it for me, but the right guy went over. Trigg needs to take West's place. Period.

[MillenniumMan831 0]

I thought the whole spectacle of the main event was fantastic. Kudos to TNA on this one. One thing I noticed was how loud the buzz of the crowd was during the entire match. Fans in Lowell were geeked the entire time.

[garfieldsnose 0]

Did Karen Angle have her "mystery guest"?

[The Ghost of bps21 0]

Joe became the third triple crown winner in TNA. Of course...AJ's done it 3 times.

[CubbyBr 0]

THe main event was a well-worked match but I had several issues with it. What they did by working an MMA match was take away all the stuff that make Samoa Joe cool. THe Kicks, the brawling, the suplexes, etc. Joe's entire aura is the way he moves for a guy his size. Without It he basically looked like a fat guy rolling around and applying weak, worked submission holds. I watched the PPV with a first time TNA fan who who likes WWE and has been watching them since the mid 90's, is also a fan of UFC and that's exactly how he reacted to it (after laughing about the name "Samoe Joe). You can't have that type of real match with a guy with a fake name like that, an unimpressive look and not even show some of the cool looking stuff he can do. Can you imagine this being a UFC event with a main event buildup like that but instead of a chuck liddel you put in an out-of-shape guy named Samoe Joe? I just don't think the match served Joe's strengths and there were several boring chants throughout.

[MillenniumMan831 0]

I must have missed those boring chants.

[CubbyBr 0]

They were there at the beginning. THe crowd was into the match at the end but it took a while.

[The Truthiness 0]

I must have missed those boring chants.

 

There was a few, it also was a "we want wrestling" chant. The match itself was ok, I guess. Like some one said earlier the build to it was great, and the right guy went over

[The Dames 0]

As someone who watched a SHITLOAD of MMA today, ranging from WEC, UFC, Yamma & some of the original UFC's, I actually really enjoyed the main event today. Even though the crowd probably didn't get a lot of the MMA stuff that they were doing, it was actually worked closer to an MMA fight from the late 90's than one of today with the shitty transitions and such. I don't think it would have been believable if these two guys pulled off the MMA moves crisply and smoothly since that's not how MMA is. To me, it seems that almost every move was worked for and came across as believable as they can in a worked match, so I have no complaints.

 

Frank Trigg needs a permanent spot at the announce table now.

 

Dames

[CubbyBr 0]

Personally, I enjoyed the match. I think saying that it's the best match of the last five years is crazy. IT was well worked but it didn't attract any new fans which is what TNA was trying to do. It basically wasn't a real MMA match for fans of MMA. ANd it wasn't a traditional pro wrestling match for strictly pro wrestling fans who don't watch too much MMA.

[The Ghost of bps21 0]

it wasn't supposed to be either.

 

It was supposed to be what it was.

 

A fusing of different popular ring sports.

[cabbageboy 0]

I was glad to see Joe get the belt but I don't even think it was the best match these guys have had. Best booked? Of course. But to me MMA and pro wrestling are two separate genres and I might enjoy the occasional move or nod to it during a match, but I'd rather not see two wrestlers emulate a worked MMA fight.

 

Pretty good show overall tonight...might have wanted to see more brutality in the Lockdown match. There was the nice crazy Styles spot on top, but otherwise there wasn't enough blood in it for what is supposed to be an intense brawl.

 

One thing to note: TNA almost needs to watch it with all the women's matches on PPV. I draw the line at 2 on a show (champion match, maybe #1 contender match). But stuff like Sharmell and Payton Banks being in another match is overkill, especially when it added nothing. Booker and Roode need to move on. This feud has lasted a long time and hasn't produced a good match that I can recall.

[The Truthiness 0]

I can't wait for the build to Steiner/Joe, mainly for the Steiner promos.

[PILLS! PILLS! PILLS! 0]

One thing to note: TNA almost needs to watch it with all the women's matches on PPV. I draw the line at 2 on a show (champion match, maybe #1 contender match). But stuff like Sharmell and Payton Banks being in another match is overkill, especially when it added nothing.

 

How about fuck that idea? The Knockouts are one of the best things about that company right now. There's no need to "watch it" when it comes to showcasing them.

 

I say that with much love, of course.

[The Dames 0]

What they should do is at the very least, give Raesha Saeed just a mask covering her face if they want her to wrestle in this gimmick. She's a great worker, but it was clear that her outfit was causing her some trouble, including botching a submission hold because it got caught in her loose clothing.

 

The fact that she's even under a mask is mind boggling by itself, but this IS TNA.

 

Dames

[cameron chaos 0]

I was glad to see Joe get the belt but I don't even think it was the best match these guys have had. Best booked? Of course. But to me MMA and pro wrestling are two separate genres and I might enjoy the occasional move or nod to it during a match, but I'd rather not see two wrestlers emulate a worked MMA fight.

So I take it you hate all UWFI/NJPW/AJPW/NOAH matches after about 1995 then? Because Pancrase/Shooto fucked the formula up way back in the day before TNA tried to straddle the barrier between the two. The idea of worked shoots is two decades old at this point, let the shit breathe and move on. Fact and fiction don't have to be opponents all the time.

[SamoaRowe 0]

I just got home from the show and I had a blast. All around fun show, and you know something, I enjoyed all of the women's matches. That Kong/Saeed vs. Gail/OBD was a definite highlight. Lethal Lockdown was great and Angle/Joe ended up being what I hoped it would be (and I got to mark the fuck out for Joe's title win). I'd go on, but I'm tired and must get some sleep before work in the morning.

 

Also picked up the Global Impact DVD from the merch table, which was icing on the cake.

[TheBostonStrangler 0]

I just got back from the show as well. A very well-done effort, albeit a show that didn't seem to have one insane highlight to remember it by. Based on what I saw live, basically every match was good, but every ending felt just a bit rushed. Still, the crowd was wicked into it the entire time. Very nice show, and getting to see Joe win the title was a great moment.

[frostdude1 0]

Gotta be honest, I was kinda bored with the main event. It was obvious from the video package before the match that Joe would win and with the crappy TNA commentators who kept saying "Joe's gonna tap", they made the ending way too obvious. And I gotta be honest, didn't like the full out MMA match. If I wanna watch MMA I can go turn UFC on, there's a reason I watch wrestling. All in all, the entire ppv was good but the main event was not spectacular and people who are calling it MOTY are overreacting because of the moment and will realize it wasn't, after watching it more than once.

[Scroby 0]

I was glad to see Joe get the belt but I don't even think it was the best match these guys have had. Best booked? Of course. But to me MMA and pro wrestling are two separate genres and I might enjoy the occasional move or nod to it during a match, but I'd rather not see two wrestlers emulate a worked MMA fight.

I don't understand why the complaining about the MMA stuff. According to the storyline, both of them have been recently training with MMA fighters, so why wouldn't MMA moves be used in the match? It would make no sense if TNA said that both Angle and Joe were being trained for the match by MMA fighters and MMA moves or the MMA fighting style wasn't used in the match.

[Mike wanna be 0]

I was glad to see Joe get the belt but I don't even think it was the best match these guys have had. Best booked? Of course. But to me MMA and pro wrestling are two separate genres and I might enjoy the occasional move or nod to it during a match, but I'd rather not see two wrestlers emulate a worked MMA fight.

I don't understand why the complaining about the MMA stuff. According to the storyline, both of them have been recently training with MMA fighters, so why wouldn't MMA moves be used in the match? It would make no sense if TNA said that both Angle and Joe were being trained for the match by MMA fighters and MMA moves or the MMA fighting style wasn't used in the match.

MMA and wrestling aren't mutually exclusive; off the top of my head chokes are the only thing "illegal" in wrestling that's legal in MMA, so the hype of an "MMA match" is lost when you realize they could have just called it No Holds Barred, or No Disqualifications and achieved the same ruleset.

 

Every hype interview and video went over how much MMA training they did, how they were learning this and that and practicing their submissions and all that BS...they got into a cage for an "MMA fight"...the match included rope breaks, a Figure Four leglock, and ended with a Muscle Buster leading to a pinfall.

 

In summary, they hyped it as an MMA/wrestling crossover bout, and then proceeded to just have a wrestling match. Hence, complaints.

[King Cucaracha 0]

One thing to note: TNA almost needs to watch it with all the women's matches on PPV. I draw the line at 2 on a show (champion match, maybe #1 contender match). But stuff like Sharmell and Payton Banks being in another match is overkill, especially when it added nothing.

 

How about fuck that idea? The Knockouts are one of the best things about that company right now. There's no need to "watch it" when it comes to showcasing them.

 

I say that with much love, of course.

 

There is the danger of having too much of a good thing though. If the women are getting over, great, but that shouldn't neccessarily be the signal to sign 10 more of them and stick them all on the show. You don't want to risk going overkill to the point people get too much of it too soon.

 

Not that I think they're at that stage now. But I see cabbageboy's point.

[cabbageboy 0]

Yeah that's what I meant. The Knockouts division has been quite good thus far but keep it to a match or 2 on a PPV.

 

I wouldn't really mind the MMA influence if it wasn't so overdone. For instance the way UT is now using his submission move is a nod to MMA, but it's not like UT was asking UFC fighters to train him to face Edge. Guys rolling around on the mat or doing strikes isn't dull in MMA since these guys are actually hurting each other. There are two different endgames with MMA and pro wrestling. MMA is about legit beating someone's ass, wrestling is about entertaining the viewer.

[dubq 0]

Honestly, I think the only reason that the MMA influenece was there (aside from the Fighters as trainers) was the whole cage thing. They wanted it to seem like a hybrid of UFC/TNA. I thought it was fine, personally. I loved that the Main Event was also completely devoid of any overdone storylines/gimmicks aside from the necessary Angle/Joe rivalry. Even Karen's presence and departure before the match didn't fuck with how serious this ME was supposed to be.

 

I thought the entire PPV was worth the $30 for sure. There were a few matches I could've done without (BG/Kip, thank god it was short).

 

X-Scape was the usual fun X-Div stuff, though I was really hoping for Curry Man to come out with the title.

 

Queen of the Cage was nice and short and wasn't offensive at all. I really like Roxxi and that finisher is sweet.

 

BG/Kip - already commented on that.

 

Cuffed in the Cage was fun too and it got Super Eric over with me. I was hating the gimmick (admittedly I'd only seen backstage interviews) but the ending was great. Loved the fact that Eric and Rellik were wearing the same coloured wristtape, leading to Reign cuffing Rellik by mistake. Kaz is great too. I wish they had an upper-midcard title for him to go after.

 

Mixed Tag - this was alright. The ending was telegraphed, as this usually happens in these matches. Either that or the male face finishes off the male heel and let's the woman get the pin. Either way I'm interested to see where Roode goes next. Booker T, meh. I mean it's inevitable that he's going to get the title one day, but he's so stale to me doing his same old same old. I wish there was a way we could get King Booker back.

 

Lethal Lockdown was very reminiscent of War Games. I'd never seen a Lethal Lockdown match before. The ending came out of nowhere though. I was expecting one of the captains to get the fall. Does this mean Rhino is getting a bigger push?

 

Main event - comments above. Loved it. Congrats to Joe, he fucking deserves this title and hopefully it's a long run. I'm kind of sick of people picking on his weight. Clearly some people don't understand that you don't have to be ripped to be in shape. I know a few of big guys (not unlike Joe's physique) who are in great cardiovascular shape.

 

That said, Kurt did look smaller. There was a remarkable difference between him in the ME and some of the older videos they were running throughout the show. I'm glad, and hope this means that he is taking better care of himself.

[Lil' Bitch 0]

Glad to hear Joe finally won the title.

[Jericholic82 0]

Had fun at the show. Got there and we parked in the aren alot which only cost 10 bucks! (better then my Rumble experience at MSG which cost upwards of 40) Lots of fans out there and I notice immediately that indeed we are in the Boston area, cuz every other person-literallly- had some sort of Red Sox paraphernalia on. Weird feeling to be around that, made me want to scream and start bashing skulls (just kidding) I gotta admire that kind of loyalty though, especially the dudes with boston tats on their arms. Glad I didn't wear any Yankee or Giants gear cuz those who did were gettting some flack (I was there to enjoy a wrestling show, if I wanted a fight I'd be at the game ) Though I did have my Yankee logo earring on as I typically do.

 

when I got inside, Lethal,Dutt, and Val were taking pics with fans. My friend's son got a pic with them. I coulda got one too , but for some reason, didn't feel like it. The x title belt looked huge up close, though, bigger than the world belt. finally they were to let us in but the dude's scanner wasnt working and he thought are tickets were messed up, but the guy next to him was working. I felt some sort of Boston-NY conspiracy for a sec lol. Everyone ran upstairs to the merch tables. I got A Lockdown shirt (I had to get something, I don't have any TNA shirts so I didn't even wear a wrestling shirt to the show) for 20 bucks, kinda pissed cuz it just has a logo on front and small one on back (which puts the event in "Boston" though technically we were in Lowell ) as opposed to any kind of pictures or card rundown like WWE typically has. SO I ran in the restroom and changed into my new shirt.

 

I was sitting in the third row to the side of the barricade, facing the ring and entrance stage, but down the aisle so my line of sight was not direct to the ring, so I had to slightly turn to see (which is dumb they should have angled the seats or something). Before the show Dixie Carter came out to shake everyone's hand and thank us for coming, which caught me off-guard cuz I was checking my phone. She even joked to me to "stop texting and pay attention" or something like that. most people didnt seem to know who she was, but when informed they crowded around her. Then the new backstage interview girl with th super-bleached blonde hair came out with all the title belts and let fans take pics with them, but I declined, cuz I didn't feel like standing in another line. The arena was pretty nice, if a bit small, but that is good cuz there wasn't a bad seat in the house really. Wish I did get cheaper seats upstairs, cuz of course the people infront and next to me insisted on standing throughout the show despite being 10 feet from the ring or so. Penzer introduced some local dj to get the crowd riled up. They claimed to have backstage passes for "the loudest fans" Nice way to bribe the audience into being loud huh? Then Borash came out to namedrop NYC and the webster hall show to encourage the crowd to be louder. The Yankees sucks and NY sucks chants nearly had me ready to go to war but I sat back and just insulted Borash for being an annoying fool. Though later on I just flat on chanted for the Yanks and The G-Men, as well as for the "914".

 

The show started and the pyro was damn loud. I still can't hear. But the smoke never seemed to clear from that. That's why I hate pyro at indoor wrestling shows. It's hard to say what I thought of the show, cuz being live, you just mark out

for the experience and not really pay attention to the match and how good it is (especially with morons standing up the whole show, I paid 125 for this seat after all) The x division match was fun, I tried to get a fallen angel chant going but the crowd seemed clueless around me.

 

Best match: I'd say live, the lethal lockdown, good brutal fun with nice insane highspots thrown in. When Storm broke the bottle, the pieces flew right into us and a piece even bounced off my shoulder, but I didn't catch it like the guy in front of me. The blocked view of the people standing, and the cameramen standing in front of the ring, made almost miss the finish what so much going on. But I did see the gore. Crowd was way into the match and especially for Christian (and I give props for the kid who homemade a Team Cage shirt, and the little kid with a green mohawk and TNA written on the side of his head, though that was a bit strange to see)

 

Worst Match: Obviously Queen of the Cage, though the crowd was way into it (though that may have something to do with how the girls were dressed, and Velvet shaking her ass from the top of the cage)

 

The crowd was way into the show obviously, and my section seemed to have more Angle fans too, but It was nice to see Joe finally win the big one, despite the match coming off as a bit slow at times, and a little bit of a mess. Nice touch for Angle to be in MMA gear though. The MMA style early on had a man yell "we want WRESTLING" It was a good mark out moment for me to see Joe's progression, remembering him as a young rookie in a samoan tag team to now main eventing a huge ppv vs Angle and winning a major title.

 

You should have see the announcers during the show, Tenay looked like he was having a seizure at time commentating and West was sweating near to death.

 

After the show I high-fived the dudes in yankees jerseys and pissed off some locals in the process. Of course I had to scream "Boston Sucks!" as we drove off into the night (for GP of course)

 

I'd have to see it back on tape to get a better opinion but I enjoyed the experience. Worth the 3 hour drive for sure and it was neat to see a new place. Lots of insane high flying jumps and action made for a solid show.

[Hawkius Maximus 0]

I just finished the show...Overall thoughts:

 

Opening X-Division Cage match ~ Fun, but forgettable. The storyline with Dutt & Lethal was actually pretty good here, and helped to make me forget the horrible videos for weeks. Curry Man shoulda won.

 

Reverse Cage Women Thingy ~ Stupid. Not much to say about it. Stupid.

 

BG vs. Kip ~ Neither are great workers, but they made this work to the extent they were capable of. Perfectly acceptable.

 

Cuffs match ~ Traaaaaaaainwreck. When the hyperactive Don West is apologizing because there's too much going on in the ring for him to notice it all? Way too much going on. Super Eric is a cute gimmick, if stupid, but it kind of made everyone else look bad when he could take out four people on his own at the end.

 

Women's Tag ~ This might be my favorite match of the show. Very simple. Very well worked. This had everything you need for a good tag match. The only downside is Melissa's gear held her back, but she showed ample skill in what basically was set up to show her off. I think Kong did all of...five things. Fun as hell.

 

Mixed Tag ~ I missed most of this. I don't care enough to go re-watch it. Many people love Robert Roode, he personally bores me in the ring, and Booker T hasn't been great in the ring for years. Add in two women who aren't that good, and you have something that I didn't feel bad about taking a rest room break during.

 

Lethal Lockdown ~ I really enjoyed this match...Until the top came down. The addition of weapons only took away from what was going on. The set up for AJ & Cage's fall looked FAR more impressive then their actual fall (Due to the fact that they could have DIED), so it made it a really stupid stunt as the payoff to it failed to deliver. After the top came down, any hint of storyline was thrown out for random weapon bashing. Good ending though.

 

Joe/Angle ~ I'm still thinking about this one...I got what they were going for. Worker Shoot > Submission Grappling > High Spurt wrestling. I think I actually liked the opening worked shoot format more then the other segments. It didn't seem to have any of the "Oh, I'll just change positions here on the ground without you trying to stop me at all!" bits from worked shoot fights, and the striking looked pretty decent. This should have been a great moment, but the way they've built Joe up for months now kind of made this a fish in the water deal. Still, an interesting match that could lead to a change in how main events work in this country...Or be forgotten.

 

Overall...A decent, maybe good PPV. I wasn't really blown away by anything ,but I wasn't really disappointed either. The big surprise was the woman's tag, which only made me more sure that TNA's got a damn fine collection of women, and it's the best booked division in wrestling right now.

[tekcop 0]

So I take it you hate all UWFI/NJPW/AJPW/NOAH matches after about 1995 then? Because Pancrase/Shooto fucked the formula up way back in the day before TNA tried to straddle the barrier between the two.

Wait, wait, wait... what? Since when does NOAH or AJPW have any matwork, much less MMA-style?