US troops open fire on Iraq wedding

[Guest thebigjig]

kind of reminds me of Demi Moore's character in a Few Good Men... except not nearly as cold on the surface

 

of course, Anne Coulter also has a sort of sexy side to her

[Ripper 0]

I can't say I'm overly surprised this happened, with the celebrants firing guns in the air and all, not to mention the occasion habit soldiers have of firing on their on troops....

 

And no I'm not going to look for a source. we all know friendly fire happens.

So do double post.

 

*cries*

[Guest SP-1]

I pretty much agree with Marney.

 

*seeks cover because the sky suddenly started raining blood and frogs*

[Guest Ram]

I'm hearing conflicting reports about this. Some are saying someone shot in the air, others are saying nobody shot anything. Hmm..

 

You've got...

 

The U.S. Army said Thursday it killed around 40 people in an attack on suspected foreign fighters in Iraq near the Syrian border, but disputed reports that the victims were members of a wedding party.

Brigadier General Mark Kimmitt, deputy director of operations for the U.S. military in Iraq, told Reuters the attack early Wednesday was within the military's rules of engagement.

 

"We conducted an operation about 85 kilometers (53 miles) southwest of al-Qaim...against suspected foreign fighters in a safe house," Kimmitt said. "We took ground fire and we returned fire."

 

Kimmitt said there were no indications that the victims of the attack were part of a wedding party. He said a large amount of money, Syrian passports and satellite communications equipment had been found at the site after the attack.

 

...but then you also have...

 

But Dubai-based Al Arabiya television, quoting eyewitnesses, said the raid on the village of Makr al-Deeb before dawn had targeted people celebrating a wedding and had killed at least 41 civilians.

 

"We received about 40 martyrs today, mainly women and children below the age of 12," Hamdy al-Lousy, the director of Qaim hospital, told Al Arabiya. "We also have 11 people wounded, most of them in critical condition."

 

Arabiya showed pictures of several shrouded bodies lined up on a dirt road. Men were shown digging graves and lowering bodies, one of a child, into the pits while relatives wept.

 

"The U.S. planes dropped more than 100 bombs on us," an unidentified man who said he was from the village said on Al Arabiya. "They hit two homes where the wedding was being held and then they leveled the whole village. No bullets were fired by us, nothing was happening," he added.

 

So, yeah, I have no idea.

 

http://www.reuters.com/newsArticle.jhtml;j...storyID=5197140

[Dr. Tyler; Captain America 0]

It's not uh, beyond the realm of possibility that they could've been like, exaggerating, y'know?

 

Come on.

 

This is a tragedy, but as Marney said, you've gotta be a little smarter than to start rattling off shots with an automatic rifle in the middle of a fucking war zone. Come on, people.

[Guest Ram]

It's not uh, beyond the realm of possibility that they could've been like, exaggerating, y'know?

 

Come on.

 

This is a tragedy, but as Marney said, you've gotta be a little smarter than to start rattling off shots with an automatic rifle in the middle of a fucking war zone. Come on, people.

Of course.

 

I'm more curious of whether it was a wedding group or foreign fighters.

[Guest Brian]

How'd they get from the investigation to firing? We're they still firing when they got there? Why did they leave after the first look?

[Guest INXS]

Well, it must be said again that any civilians firing guns in Iraq have to be really, really stupid.

 

Obviously we didn't bomb the place just for the fun of it and there was a communication error somewhere along the line.

 

The bottom line is that it doesn't matter whether we thought it was a legit threat or not - it's how the Iraqi people see it as we are still a long way from gaining their hearts and minds.

[Jobber of the Week 0]

Everyone is agreeing with Marney. Wow.

 

Good thing Unger isn't here to spoil the moment for us.

[Spaceman Spiff 0]

of course, Anne Coulter also has a sort of sexy side to her

::shudders::

[Guest SideFXs]

Somehow the media will spin this as President Bush's and Rumsfeld's fault.

[Slickster 0]

The last thing we need right now is people firing weapons for trivial reasons, and distracting our soldiers from going after terrorists. Image is important but secondary, and frankly, our image amongst Iraqis hasn't been affected very much by the prison abuse. It won't be affected by this either.

But aren't you supposed to be instituting a culture of normality in Iraq?

 

That seems to be one of the key points Bush, et al. point out as a positive from the invasion: things are returning to normal, people should go about their daily business, etc.

 

Firing guns in celebration of a wedding is (apparently) a common custom in the Middle East. You'd think that the troops would know that by now and at least send someone to check on what's happening.

 

Not go walking blindly into the area, mind you, but at least check it out from a distance instead of making a potentially disastrous assumption.

 

Whether this report is true or not, it seems to me that this invasion has had a lot of moments where the coalition says "Go about your daily lives.....WAIT! NOT THAT!" I get the impression that the coalition needs more people in tune with the Arab world so they clarify their intentions and don't make more mistakes like the (alleged) one described above.

[Guest Cerebus]

Update:

 

Initial reports suggested that a wedding party near the Syrian border was the target of a US air strike.

 

A US military spokesman confirmed that about 40 people had been killed in the area - but said US forces had targeted a safe house used by foreign fighters.

 

He said coalition forces had retaliated after coming under attack.

 

The incident occurred late on Tuesday at the village of Makr al-Deeb, near the border town of Qaim.

 

"We took hostile fire and we returned fire," said Brigadier General Mark Kimmitt, deputy director of operations for the US military in Iraq.

 

He said there were no indications that the victims of the attack were part of a wedding party.

 

He added that a large amount of money, Syrian passports and satellite communications equipment had been found at the site of the attack.

[Slayer 0]

You mean the press misreported something and rushed to judgement?

 

Nah, that couldn't happen...

[Guest Brian]

They reported what the witnesses said, and based on the fact they were pulling out bodies of dead children. And the military issued a retort. Two sides to the argument, neither proven false as of yet.

[NoCalMike 0]

It may just be the beer talking(in loo of the Kings loss tonight), so don't hold me to this later/tommorow, but quite frankly the way this war is going, I kind of wish we would would pull out every single troop, give all Iraqi citizens 48 hour notice to get the hell out of there, and then just start bringing in the aircraft and unloading..........yeah I am drunk.

[Vern Gagne 0]

Good thing Unger isn't here to spoil the moment for us.

*Interesting how this happened right after Rummy visited the country.*

[Jobber of the Week 0]

It may just be the beer talking(in loo of the Kings loss tonight), so don't hold me to this later/tommorow, but quite frankly the way this war is going, I kind of wish we would would pull out every single troop, give all Iraqi citizens 48 hour notice to get the hell out of there, and then just start bringing in the aircraft and unloading..........yeah I am drunk.

No dude you're not drunk enough this is what happened.

 

Racist Democrats threw away their vote on Nader, then aborted an outsourced Israeli pistol out of Anne Coulter's lesbian uterus. Then Rush Limbaugh put his tiny fat penis in Michael Moore's fat face, and all the WWE Divas who are actually attractive posted naked PNG images (better compression) of themselves because they all want Cancer Marney. This is definitive proof that God doesn't exist and you can break the lightspeed barrier, and also that Communism could work in theory except it just hasn't ever been done properly. And Americans are all self-serving consumers who do nothing but kick the poor in the face and watch nothing but reality TV, and the rest of the world is just jealous of how awesome America is, because it's the only true democracy (except for France which is lame).

 

When you get drunk enough to notice all this then you will know the truth.

[kkktookmybabyaway 0]

If you want to randomly flame me rather than taking issue with anything I've actually said, take it to NHB. This isn't the place.

Isn't this folder already NHB-Lite?

Not unless you agree with everything I say.

 

Good thing Unger isn't here to spoil the moment for us.

 

*Interesting how this happened right after Rummy visited the country.*

 

Isn't it also interesting how this happened just months after Bush visited the country, too.

 

But don't get me wrong -- I hate terrorism...

[Guest Agent of Oblivion]

..so I'm the only American who has participated in celebratory gunfire? C'mon people, live a little.

[Guest MikeSC]

I mean Americans do it at New years and it would be kinda messed up if they were gunned down for doing it.

 

 

But at the same time maybe firing a gun in the air because Jimmy passed his math test or Fi Fi finally became potty trained probably isn't the best action.

 

*finishes post*

 

 

*Fires gun in the air to celebrate*

People fire automatic guns in the air at New Year's where you live?

 

You are hardcore!

-=Mike

[kkktookmybabyaway 0]

..so I'm the only American who has participated in celebratory gunfire? C'mon people, live a little.

Do Supersoakers count?...

[Guest Agent of Oblivion]

No, a shotgun. If you lived here, it'd make sense, but there's really no sense trying to explain it. New Years Eve, going into 1999, this one dipshit I know was cracking a few shots off into the air..drunker than hell, mind you, and he shot the electrical transformer to this one trailer park down the road. All the porchlights, tvs, EVERYTHING went black three seconds til midnight for the trailer court. I ran. I didn't do it, but I ran anyway. I also have never fired or fucked with a gun while drinking, personally. Even I'm not that nuts. If other people are doing it though, I'll be damned if I'm going to try to take a shotgun away from a drunk.

[2GOLD 0]

All I say is this

 

Fire gun into the air in the middle of a war: You are stupid and if you die oh well. Sucks to be you.

 

Culture or not, when the soldiers hear gunfire and confirm it's not other US soldiers then kill. Too much crap going on to be playing around now.

[Secret Agent 0]

What the hell? If we as United States citizens can't carry guns around while strolling through the streets, why the hell are these people allowed too?

 

It'd be far better if we instituted some kind of no-gun policy to Iraq until they can get this nation under control.

[Guest MikeSC]

What the hell? If we as United States citizens can't carry guns around while strolling through the streets, why the hell are these people allowed too?

 

It'd be far better if we instituted some kind of no-gun policy to Iraq until they can get this nation under control.

Agreed. I'm not allowed to carry automatic weaponry --- why are these idiots that fire it off discriminately in "celebration" allowed to?

 

Heck, how ingrained in the culture can this idiotic custom possibly be? It's not like automatic guns have been around for THAT long.

-=Mike

[Guest MikeSC]

UPDATE:

No evidence of wedding at air strike, U.S. military says

 

By ROBERT MORAN

 

Knight Ridder Newspapers

 

BAGHDAD, Iraq — At the site where a U.S. air strike killed 40 persons Wednesday, troops found “terrorist manuals,” machines for making fake IDs, and battery packs rigged for homemade bombs.

 

They found nothing to indicate a wedding party, as some witnesses have said, a senior military official said Saturday.

 

Brig. Gen. Mark Kimmitt, chief military spokesman for the U.S.-led coalition, said evidence at the location about 15 miles from the Syrian border suggested that there had been a secret meeting of anti-occupation forces.

 

However, Kimmitt left open the possibility that there also may have been some kind of celebration.

 

“Bad people have parties, too,” he said.

 

The incident has stirred further anger among Iraqis already bitter about the American occupation, and U.S. military officials have moved swiftly to counter the allegation that they may have slaughtered innocent persons.

 

A videotape emerged late Wednesday allegedly showing the bodies of the dead, including children. Purported witnesses said the air strike hit a wedding party.

 

At a briefing Saturday, Kimmitt showed photographs of the interior of the targeted building that showed stacks of bedding — more than 300 sets — a table used for medical examinations, and medical supplies, including syringes with residue suspected of being cocaine. There were assorted firearms and a large number of packed sets of clothing.

 

He said the setup appeared to be a way station where foreign fighters slipping through the border could get bogus identification documents and clothes that would help them blend in with the Iraqi population.

 

“There was no evidence of a wedding,” Kimmitt said. “There was no decorations, no music instruments found, no large quantities of food or leftover servings one would expect from a wedding celebration. No gifts.”

http://www.kansascity.com/mld/kansascity/n.../8736486.htm?1c

[Jobber of the Week 0]

It might not have been a wedding, but what the hell kind of enemy stronghold do you pull children's bodies out of?

[justsoyouknow 0]

Maybe it was take your child to work day?

 

That's all I've got.

[Superstring 0]

(Yet another) UPDATE:

 

'Wedding video' clouds US denials

 

A videotape has been broadcast which purports to show before-and-after footage of a wedding which Iraqis say the US bombed, killing about 40.

The film released by a US news agency combines a wedding home movie with video of the aftermath of the attack, which the US says targeted militants.

 

Some victims and survivors appear to be present in the wedding video.

 

The US and UK are due to release on Monday a new draft resolution on Iraq to fellow UN Security Council members.

 

President George W Bush is to make a speech after the document is circulated later on Monday in which he is expected to outline how power will be transferred from the coalition to an interim Iraqi government at the end of June.

 

The BBC's Justin Webb reports from Washington that the speech at an army college in Pennsylvania is the first of six designed to regain the initiative on Iraq.

 

With his poll figures at all time lows, they are also aimed at rescuing Mr Bush's chances of winning a second term in office.

 

Ribbons and salutes

 

The US has insisted its target was not a wedding but foreign fighters and that its forces were responding to fire.

 

Associated Press Television News says it cannot confirm the authenticity of the video of the celebrations, which purportedly relate to a wedding last week at the village of Makr al-Deeb, in desert near the Syrian border.

 

The agency says the material broadcast was taken from several hours of footage said to have been filmed by Yasser Shawkat Abdullah, hired to record the festivities. He was among those killed, it says.

 

 

The film opens with gleaming pick-up trucks - some decorated with ribbons - speeding through the desert apparently en route to the wedding.

 

They arrive at the celebrations to the sounds of guns being fired in the air - a traditional celebration - and ululating.

 

The film then shows men dancing along to the music of Hussein al-Ali, a popular wedding singer also hired for the occasion.

 

Ali and his brother Mohamed were buried in Baghdad on Thursday, mourners said.

 

Clearly visible on the wedding footage is a man playing electric organ.

 

The aftermath

 

The footage is spliced with APTN film of the face of a corpse after the attack. It appears to be the same man, wearing the same shirt.

 

AP says a reporter and a photographer who interviewed more than a dozen survivors a day after the bombing were able to identify many of them on the wedding party video.

 

It also says its footage of the scene following the attack shows remnants of musical instruments, pots and pans, and brightly coloured beddings used for celebrations, scattered around a bombed-out tent.

 

Survivors of the attack have told journalists the wedding party had ended and guests were in bed when bombing began in the early hours of Wednesday.

 

When people ran out of their homes, they allege they were shot at by Americans.

 

They say over 40 people died, including at least 10 children.

 

But these allegations have been vehemently and repeatedly denied by US forces in Iraq.

 

'No evidence'

 

"There was no evidence of a wedding: no decorations, no musical instruments found, no large quantities of food or leftover servings one would expect from a wedding celebration," Brigadier General Mark Kimmitt, the chief US military spokesman in Iraq, said on Saturday.

 

"The men were almost all military-aged, no family elders that one would expect to see at an event of this type," he said.

 

He has denied any children were killed in the attack.

 

Gen Kimmitt said the site looked "somewhat of a dormitory. There were more than 300 sets of bedding gear in it and about 100 sets of pre-packaged clothing.

 

"It's suspected that when foreign fighters come in from other countries they change their clothes into typical Iraqi clothing sets."

 

He said ID-making machines and "the capability to make exit visas for Iraq" were among suspicious items found.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/3741223.stm