The latest twist in the Schiavo case.......

[Guest Agent of Oblivion]

And a fraction of what was done in Texas. If she lived in Texas, she'd have been in the ground for 14 years and 11 months already.

[Kahran Ramsus 0]

More than likely false news report:

That's quite an accomplishment for someone who's so far gone that even involuntary relfex actions don't work anymore. Not to mention that to determine that she wants to live, she would have to figure out what's going on anyway.

 

The husband isn't a saint, but the lifers are really blowing this well out of proportion. I guess because they managed to get the story so much attention that it will be somewhat embarassing if they "lose."

The burden of proof shouldn't have to be on the life side of the argument. They should have to prove that she wants to die, and they can't because they don't have a living will.

[kkktookmybabyaway 0]

Florida's done about 60 executions in the past 20 years, which is well more than California... *confused*

Wasn't directed at a particular state, just those that are anti-death penalty and pro-death Terri S. It's just one of my many stupid comments that I spend a fraction of a second thinking about...

[Guest Crazy Dan]

I would be more inclined to side with the parents on this if Terry still had her mind or was only recently gone into her state. However, she has not improved in fifteen years. Who in their right mind would ever want to be in her state. I know that I have not made a living will, but I have told plenty of people that I would want the plug pulled, because if the mind is gone, you really are no longer the person you once were. Terry's reactions are comming from her brain stem, which controls primitive functions like her blinking and such. From my understanding of this case, she has always made noises, blinked and moved her mouth and this by no means is a sign that she will ever make a recovery. Her brain is mush, she is a vegetable and once the brain is damaged it never recover, hence the term brain damage. It is never a good thing to bury your children, but it is time to let go of these illusions of grandeur. Terry is gone, even with rehab, she still will not make a recovery, IMO. Who can honestly say, by looking at her, that you would want to live life like that? Life is a precious thing, but when you are reduced to a vegetable, it is time to let her die with dignity and move on. To keep her alive with a hope that she "might" make is only going to bring the parents more heartache when she will never make a recovery. That is life sometimes.

[Kahran Ramsus 0]

You have a point, but I can't see putting someone to death if you can't prove that she wanted to die in this situation. What if she didn't want to? Then you are committing murder instead of euthanasia. The conduct of the husband definitely has me questioning his motives, and his word is the only evidence we have. If we knew conclusively that she wanted to die, then it would be a different situation entirely, but that isn't the case. We dont know.

[Guest Salacious Crumb]

I find it funny that a lot of people that bitch and moan over someone getting a lethal injection have no problem with this woman being starved to death.

[2GOLD 0]

I find it funny that a lot of people that bitch and moan over someone getting a lethal injection have no problem with this woman being starved to death.

 

I want them to give her a shot like she is a kitty that can go on no more. Starving her to death just feels wrong on so many levels.

[Hunter's Torn Quad 0]

Congress Announces Deal in Schiavo Case

 

24 minutes ago  Politics - U. S. Congress

 

By SIOBHAN McDONOUGH, Associated Press Writer

 

WASHINGTON - Congressional leaders hoped a deal reached Saturday would clear the way for a brain-damaged woman to resume being fed while a federal court reviews the right-to-die battle between her parents and her husband.

 

"We think we have found a solution" to the Terri Schiavo case, House Majority Leader Tom DeLay, R-Texas, said at a Capitol Hill news conference.

 

"I'm pleased to announce that House and Senate Republican leadership have reached an agreement on a legislative solution," Senate Majority Leader Bill Frist of Tennessee said a few hours later at the start of a brief Senate session.

 

"Under the legisltion we sill soon consider Terry Schiavo will have another chance," said Frist.

 

"We are confident this compromise addresses everyone's concerns, we are confident it will provide Mrs. Schiavo a clear and appropriate avenue for appeal in federal court, and most importantly, we are confident this compromise will restore nutrition and hydration to Mrs. Schiavo as long as that appeal endures," DeLay said.

 

Final approval was hoped for Sunday when the House planned to meet in a special session, he said.

 

President Bush (news - web sites) was expected to sign the bill as soon as it gets to him.

 

A White House spokesman, Jeanie Mamo, said the president, who was at his Texas ranch "was supportive of the efforts by congressional leaders. We remain in contact with Congress and the president is being kept apprised."

 

The compromise was similar to a Senate bill passed Thursday that would let a federal court review the state judge's decision in the Schiavo case. House Republicans had favored broader legislation that applied similar cases that questioned the legality of withholding food or medical treatment from people who are incapacitated.

 

Schiavo's feeding tube was disconnected Friday afternoon. Schiavo, 41, could linger for one to two weeks if no one intercedes and gets the tube reinserted.

 

GOP Rep. James Sensenbrenner of Wisconsin, chairman of the House Judiciary Committee (news - web sites), said the measure was "narrowly targeted" and did not set a precedent.

 

For a decade, a feud has raged between Schiavo's husband, Michael, and her parents, Bob and Mary Schindler, who have tried to oust Michael Schiavo as their daughter's guardian and keep in place the tube that has kept her alive for more than 15 years.

 

Michael Schiavo says his wife told him she would not want to be kept alive artificially. Her parents dispute that, saying she could get better and that their daughter has laughed, cried, smiled and responded to their voices.

 

On Friday, Republicans used their subpoena power to demand that Schiavo be brought before a congressional hearing, with lawmakers saying that removing the tube amounted to "barbarism."

 

The Florida judge presiding over the case rejected the request from House lawyers to delay the tube's removal. Late Friday, the U.S. Supreme Court (news - web sites), without comment, denied an emergency request from the House committee that issued the subpoenas to reinsert Schiavo's feeding tube while the committee filed appeals in the lower courts to have its subpoenas recognized.

 

It's not over yet.

[Jobber of the Week 0]

they can't because they don't have a living will.

Then intelligent decision-making is what should be happening. She has no cerebral cortex, and cannot accomplish involuntary actions like swallowing (hence the feeding tube.) Anyone who thinks she's just going to come out of this isn't operating in any sense of reality.

 

And now our one-party political system is trying to intervene because the result without their interference didn't come out to something they want, possibly overstepping their boundaries. Hope everybody who voted this government in got what they wanted.

[kkktookmybabyaway 0]

And now our one-party political system is trying to intervene because the result without their interference didn't come out to something they want

Substiute "judical" for "political" and I swear you're talking about gay marriage...

[Jobber of the Week 0]

The judicial branch is meant to make decisions that aren't liked, even if over 50% of the voting populace doesn't like them. That's their job.

 

Congress, on the other hand, doesn't have that role in our checks & balances system. But I sure hope they enjoy making what's left that this woman can experience a prolonged hell. Not that I approve of starvation, either, but it would have gotten the job done.

[kkktookmybabyaway 0]

The judicial branch is meant to intrepret the law, not play God. That's their job.

 

I also heard on RIGHT-WING radio today that there are a few other members of the family saying she said she would want the plug pulled. If that's the case then I'd be more sympathetic to ending her life. However, I still think the "husband" is a piece of shit...

[Slickster 0]

Do I have to keep reposting the part of the interview showing that Mr. Schiavo wouldn't be profiting if Terri kicks the bucket? Or are you just going to keep ignoring things like the truth that just don't fit into your argument?

 

(BTW, everything that Schiavo said in that interview is backed up by the State of Florida's non-objective report on the case.)

[Kahran Ramsus 0]

Then intelligent decision-making is what should be happening. She has no cerebral cortex, and cannot accomplish involuntary actions like swallowing (hence the feeding tube.) Anyone who thinks she's just going to come out of this isn't operating in any sense of reality.

 

I'm not saying that she will come out of this. I'm saying maybe she wants/wanted to live with it.

[Jobber of the Week 0]

The judicial branch is meant to intrepret the law, not play God. That's their job.

Well, I don't want to totally sidetrack this thread, but you're fighting a tide that was already fought once before with interracial marraiges, and look where that went.

 

I'm not saying that she will come out of this.  I'm saying maybe she wants/wanted to live with it.

 

I'm curious to know how much this counts for even if she did. Obviously, someone else must pay to keep her alive.

[Guest MikeSC]

The judicial branch is meant to intrepret the law, not play God. That's their job.

Well, I don't want to totally sidetrack this thread, but you're fighting a tide that was already fought once before with interracial marraiges, and look where that went.

He's also fighting a tide where welfare was viewed as a property right, where campaign finance reform was viewed as not being inconsistent with the First Amendment, where illegal immigrants were viewed as legitimate beneficiaries of government largesse...

 

Let's not pretend the courts haven't simply invented law out of nothing with no benefit to the country.

I'm not saying that she will come out of this.  I'm saying maybe she wants/wanted to live with it.

I'm curious to know how much this counts for even if she did. Obviously, someone else must pay to keep her alive.

If her family is willing to pay --- which they clearly are --- then there is no argument here. It's better to take the chance that she wanted to live than to assume that she didn't.

-=Mike

[kkktookmybabyaway 0]

I think I heard that Medicaid is paying for some, or maybe all, of Terri's medical care...

[Guest MikeSC]

I just find it odd that the idea of putting women's underwear on the head of a terrorist makes libs go nuts --- but starving a woman to death over the span of 2 weeks is not really that big a deal for them.

-=Mike

[CheesalaIsGood 0]

Maybe the media and everyone else trying to stick their nose into this should mind their own fucking busines cuz it has nothing to do with them. This is a private matter, not a struggle in political points of view. This should NOT be on the news.

[Guest MikeSC]

Maybe the media and everyone else trying to stick their nose into this should mind their own fucking busines cuz it has nothing to do with them. This is a private matter, not a struggle in political points of view. This should NOT be on the news.

It's only a woman being starved to death despite her family's pleading.

 

Yup, no news there.

 

Again, making terrorists wear women's underwear on their head is torture. A woman starving to death because her husband wants her to shouldn't even be news?

 

Got it.

-=Mike

...Doesn't it make more sense to, in the absence of a living will expressly stating a desire to die, to assume she wants to live?...

[Edwin MacPhisto 0]

More than likely false news report:

That's quite an accomplishment for someone who's so far gone that even involuntary relfex actions don't work anymore. Not to mention that to determine that she wants to live, she would have to figure out what's going on anyway.

 

The husband isn't a saint, but the lifers are really blowing this well out of proportion. I guess because they managed to get the story so much attention that it will be somewhat embarassing if they "lose."

The burden of proof shouldn't have to be on the life side of the argument. They should have to prove that she wants to die, and they can't because they don't have a living will.

False. The chain of guardianship is clear: husband, adult children, parents.

 

All the people who are saying "I don't like this Michael Schiavo guy, he's a jerk!" need to get over themselves. Not a single one of the criminal inquiries or accusations the parents have raised against him have yielded anything in a court of law. Your opinion that he just seems like a bad dude isn't justification when our criminal courts have said that he's done nothing wrong.

 

In short: everyone should make up a living will, and the innovations being taken to turn this into a political spectacle (Governor Bush's unconstitutional laws, this ridiculous subpoena) are pretty abhorrent.

[CheesalaIsGood 0]

Maybe the media and everyone else trying to stick their nose into this should mind their own fucking busines cuz it has nothing to do with them. This is a private matter, not a struggle in political points of view. This should NOT be on the news.

It's only a woman being starved to death despite her family's pleading.

 

Yup, no news there.

 

Again, making terrorists wear women's underwear on their head is torture. A woman starving to death because her husband wants her to shouldn't even be news?

 

Got it.

-=Mike

...Doesn't it make more sense to, in the absence of a living will expressly stating a desire to die, to assume she wants to live?...

No, there is NO NEWS here because it is a PRIVATE matter between the husband and the family. Comparing this case to how we treat detainees is just foolish. Apples and oranges. Got it? Assume nothing.

[Guest CronoT]

Maybe the media and everyone else trying to stick their nose into this should mind their own fucking busines cuz it has nothing to do with them. This is a private matter, not a struggle in political points of view. This should NOT be on the news.

It's only a woman being starved to death despite her family's pleading.

 

Yup, no news there.

 

Again, making terrorists wear women's underwear on their head is torture. A woman starving to death because her husband wants her to shouldn't even be news?

 

Got it.

-=Mike

...Doesn't it make more sense to, in the absence of a living will expressly stating a desire to die, to assume she wants to live?...

No, there is NO NEWS here because it is a PRIVATE matter between the husband and the family. Comparing this case to how we treat detainees is just foolish. Apples and oranges. Got it? Assume nothing.

Cheesa, this country has NO legal form of euthanasia for human beings. What her husband is trying to do is back-door euthanasia, plain and simple. If he didn't already have a "live-in girlfriend," and a kid with her, I MIGHT be more sympathetic to his position. Since that is the situation, he can go sit and spin, for all I care.

[Kahran Ramsus 0]

False. The chain of guardianship is clear: husband, adult children, parents.

 

Using that logic he could just shoot her in the head because she's his property. You still can't perform criminal acts on them.

[CheesalaIsGood 0]

Maybe the media and everyone else trying to stick their nose into this should mind their own fucking busines cuz it has nothing to do with them. This is a private matter, not a struggle in political points of view. This should NOT be on the news.

It's only a woman being starved to death despite her family's pleading.

 

Yup, no news there.

 

Again, making terrorists wear women's underwear on their head is torture. A woman starving to death because her husband wants her to shouldn't even be news?

 

Got it.

-=Mike

...Doesn't it make more sense to, in the absence of a living will expressly stating a desire to die, to assume she wants to live?...

No, there is NO NEWS here because it is a PRIVATE matter between the husband and the family. Comparing this case to how we treat detainees is just foolish. Apples and oranges. Got it? Assume nothing.

Cheesa, this country has NO legal form of euthanasia for human beings. What her husband is trying to do is back-door euthanasia, plain and simple. If he didn't already have a "live-in girlfriend," and a kid with her, I MIGHT be more sympathetic to his position. Since that is the situation, he can go sit and spin, for all I care.

I recognise that Chrono. However, since I believe that everyone has a right to die if they want to. If there is a conflict between husband and family it should be kept private and out of the scrutiny of the media. If the husband has moved on with his life I won't hold it against him. If they decide to let her live I'm fine with that too. It's none of MY business. But one thing that IS for sure is that that poor woman can't decide for herself at this point. I don't know what to tell you about what she may or may not have said before she ended up how she did.

[Slickster 0]

1. They *were* fighting over the $1 million settlement. All that money has been spent on Terri's medical care; she is currently being pade for by Florida taxpayers.

 

2. Her condition is due to a cardiac arrest brought on by an eating disorder.

 

3. Terri moves, smiles, blinks, and makes noise because her brainstem (controlling involuntary actions) is still functional. However, every other part of her brain has died and rotted away. The cranial cavity is filled with cerebrospinal fluid. EEG scans have picked up no sign of activity. The short videos of Terri moving and smiling are edited together from over five hours of footage.

 

4. Terri is fed with a feeding tube because she is incapable of swallowing. The chances of her condition improving are literally zero, since that would require her brain to spontaneously regrow itself (unprecedented in the history of medicine).

 

5. Her husband Michael has cared for Terri over the last 15 years and claims that before she was in this state she had expressed her disapproval of people being artifically kept alive. His evidence? A comment she made while watching a news special (on a case similar to what she would become). His witnesses? Two of his relatives who were there with them watching this program.

 

6. Michael Schiavo does not stand to make any money from Terri's death. He has rejected offers of $10,000, $1 million, and $10 million to surrender guardianship and has refused them all. He stays with Terri, he says, because he is afraid of what Terri's parents will do to keep her alive against her wishes. In his 2003 testimony, Terri's father admitted that if Terri's limbs were to become gangrenous he would have them amputated; if she developed heart disease he would demand she receive open-heart surgery.

 

7. Michael Schiavo does indeed have a girlfriend and has fathered a child with her. However, he has not sought divorce from Terri because he wants to have a say in what happens to her. Having a girlfriend and daughter has not kept Michael Schiavo away from his wife, however. In the first thirteen years of Terri's bedridden state, nurse's reports show that she did not receive a single bedsore. In fact, one medical staff member called Michael a "nightmare" because of his exacting demands for optimum treatment for Terri.

 

The above can be verified by the nonbiased court report created by the State of Florida.

[Kahran Ramsus 0]

His evidence? A comment she made while watching a news special (on a case similar to what she would become). His witnesses? Two of his relatives who were there with them watching this program.

 

I'm going to need more than a single comment, and the other points are irrelevent.

[Edwin MacPhisto 0]

False. The chain of guardianship is clear: husband, adult children, parents.

 

Using that logic he could just shoot her in the head because she's his property. You still can't perform criminal acts on them.

No, you can't, because carrying out her wishes isn't a criminal act. We don't force Jehovah's witnesses to use life-support systems; American citizens have no obligation to accept artificial survival. The feeding tube is the only thing keeping her alive. Removing it doesn't violate the doctor's credo of "first do no harm."

 

If you believe that Michael Schiavo is lying or, as CronoT flaccidly asserts, trying "backdoor euthanasia," then obviously you don't care about the criminality of the act. But the courts haven't found him negligent in any way, and there is no reason to take her parents' word over that of her legal guardian. If a court strips him of guardianship for negligence or fault, then you have a different story, but that hasn't happened and I don't expect it to happen.

[Slickster 0]

Disturbing image warning: Terri's brain scan

[Hogan Made Wrestling 0]

Disturbing image warning: Terri's brain scan

Anyone with a qualified level of expertise or knowledge want to explain what that bright spot in the center-right is about, or any other abnormal characteristics of this scan?