Hurricane Katrina

[Fökai 0]

To add to CC's post, from a new post (2 hours ago) on CNN.com.

 

# The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention said Tuesday that five people have died in the area hit by Hurricane Katrina after becoming infected with Vibrio vulnificus, typically a more benign relative of the bacteria that cause cholera. One of the fatalities occurred in Texas; the other four were in Mississippi, CDC spokesman Tom Skinner said.

 

# The Louisiana Superdome was so heavily damaged during Hurricane Katrina and its aftermath that it likely will have to be torn down, a disaster official working with the governor's office told CNN. The Superdome is the home of the New Orleans Saints professional football team. The Saints will play their home opener in New Jersey Monday against the Giants, but it is unclear where they will play the rest of their games. (Full storyexternal link)

 

# A majority of Americans believe the city of New Orleans will never completely recover from the disaster, according to results of a CNN/USA Today/Gallup poll released Tuesday. Fifty-six percent of 609 adults polled by telephone September 5-6 said they believe the hurricane devastated the city beyond repair. (Full story)

 

# FEMA has set up a temporary morgue in the town of St. Gabriel, about 70 miles west of New Orleans. Officials at St. Gabriel would not disclose how many bodies they had handled so far. (Watch video on St. Gabriel's "warehouse morgue" -- 2:56)

 

# In Washington, White House and congressional sources said Tuesday that the Bush administration plans to ask Congress for $30 billion to $50 billion to aid in the next phase of the recovery effort. The request, which would add to the $10.5 billion already approved, will be made as early as Wednesday, they said. (Watch a report on the storm's political fallout -- 2:09)

 

# Republican leaders canceled a scheduled House hearing to examine the response to Katrina and plan to hold a still unspecified "congressional review" by a joint House and Senate panel, Majority Leader Tom DeLay, a Texas Republican, said late Tuesday. (Full story)

 

# Public schools in New Orleans and neighboring St. Bernard Parish may be shut down for the entire school year because of damage from Hurricane Katrina, Louisiana's Superintendent of Education Cecil Picard said Tuesday. Many students whose families evacuated have begun to register for schools in other states or other parts of Louisiana, he said.

 

# With the National Flood Insurance Program expected to pay out billions of dollars in claims to cover the flood damage in Louisiana and other hard-hit states, homeowners who are suddenly interested in the extra protection may be forced to pay more for coverage. (Full story)

[Ripper 0]

and the people who couldn't be bothered/find a way to leave after given enough warning to pack up some water, non perishables and bust ass up the road a bit. And no, I won't feel guilty about feeling this way so stop trying.

 

You are a fucking idiot. 26% of the WORKING population there didn't have cars. The average income amoung the blacks was 11,000 dollars a goddamn year. The bus stations closed the saturday before the storm. What the fuck were they supposed to do? Walk? They had no money. Before anyone says that stupid "Pawn some stuff" bullshit, WHAT PAWN SHOP WOULD BE OPEN BEFORE A HURRICANE?

 

No one expects you to feel guilty but I do expect you to not be fucking retarded and use common sense. The state said "Pack up your stuff get in your cars and evacuate" to a bunch of people without cars. They had just as much chance to get away as the people in the WTC had to get away from the planes coming. They simply COULDN'T go anywhere.

 

If you don't want to contribute to the relief, then fine, but trying to bust on someone for doing so is your mother smoking crack, diped in crystal meth and vodka and sumo wrestling while pregnant with you stupid.

[Red Hot Thumbtack In The Eye 0]

WHAT PAWN SHOP WOULD BE OPEN BEFORE A HURRICANE?

 

This is a stupid thing to do anyway, as it would take away valuable time from filling a back pack or shopping bag/s with a few water bottles and some non perishables and walking or getting on a bicycle. This of course goes into the whole fuckup on the local leadership level that's been covered everywhere a 100 times now about not mobilizing. Better to spend a few dollars on a false alarm then a few billion on cleanup hindered by thousands of corpses. Fault is not the sole possession of the citizens of the city(that are able to leave. Of course there are many circumstances that could take away the possibility) alone, but if they don't even try, how much of a victim are they, really?

 

They had just as much chance to get away as the people in the WTC had to get away from the planes coming.

 

I really don't like this comparison because the people of WTC truly had no warning about an impending disaster. Certainly not enough warning to facilitate evacuation of the building an neighbouring area.

 

If you don't want to contribute to the relief, then fine, but trying to bust on someone for doing so is your mother smoking crack, diped in crystal meth and vodka and sumo wrestling while pregnant with you stupid.

 

I have little problem with people feeling strongly that they need to do something for the people in NOLA, unless they are doing it for reasons like CheesalaIsGood. If you're going to help the people, do it for them/your community, not so that you can hold a 'good deed' over everyone elses head. Now is the time for thinking on a community level, not more selfishness in that area, and heaping on a bunch of phony goodwill from outside areas is DAMN SURE not going to make things better. Reduce the long term environmental damage as much as possible, get the survivors lives back to normal as much as possible, and move on with life hopefully with a big lesson learned as soon as possible. I pray they don't rebuild a city there out of some kind of egotistical contempt, in the guise of 'human spirit'.

[Ripper 0]

Because dying people are going to care what the reasoning was behind a person getting them food? Who gives a fuck why anyone is giving. That is a waste of time. The fact of the matter is that the city is going to have to be rebuilt and i don't care if a person is doing it because they believe that it bring JFK back from the dead, the important thing is that itis getting done.

 

And the WTC comparison ends with there was NOTHING that the people could do themselves to prevent what happend to them. As fesible as taking a family of kids hundreds of miles away with supplies strapped to your back on a BIKE might seem to you, that is not even a slightly realistic option for, oh say, 99% of the people stuck there.

 

So you admit that it was alot of the goverment's fault then you ask why should you help these people? The goverment screwed them, so fuckem, let them die...that will show the government. Sticking it to local government and discovering people true motivation for giving is not more important than human lives.

[BX 0]

Seriously, how do you suppose a family with two or three kids who go about escaping a city the size of New Orleans with supplies in two days time? Ride a bike? Ridiculous.

[Lord of The Curry 0]

"Hurricane Katrina is George Bush's Monica Lewinsky. The only difference is that 10,000 people weren't trapped in Lewinsky's vagina, though it still had the nickname of The Superdome."

- Jon Stewart, 9/06/05

[bob_barron 0]

Not one of Stewart's best

[2GOLD 0]

Seriously, how do you suppose a family with two or three kids who go about escaping a city the size of New Orleans with supplies in two days time? Ride a bike? Ridiculous.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Swim?

Magic carpet?

Construct their asses into a crude rocket system with their farts as fuel?

[Big Ol' Smitty 0]

"Hurricane Katrina is George Bush's Monica Lewinsky. The only difference is that 10,000 people weren't trapped in Lewinsky's vagina, though it still had the nickname of The Superdome."

                                                - Jon Stewart, 9/06/05

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

I thought the idea of building a dam in Arkansas was pretty good.

[Red Hot Thumbtack In The Eye 0]

Because dying people are going to care what the reasoning was behind a person getting them food? Who gives a fuck why anyone is giving. That is a waste of time. The fact of the matter is that the city is going to have to be rebuilt and i don't care if a person is doing it because they believe that it bring JFK back from the dead, the important thing is that itis getting done.

 

Why does the city have to be rebuilt? So it can be buried in water and shit again the next time a hurricane comes? It's a fairly glib thing to say but nature always wins.

 

I have no interest in the behaviour I mentioned above being celebrated. People will show this sick form of pity while placing themselves above those they perceive as lower than them. Insanity. I don't think I'd have half the problem with it if the person indeed had a sense of community and actually cared about them. I see it as an all too familiar behaviour. Great praise to those who are not afflicted with this sickness.

 

And the WTC comparison ends with there was NOTHING that the people could do themselves to prevent what happend to them. As fesible as taking a family of kids hundreds of miles away with supplies strapped to your back on a BIKE might seem to you, that is not even a slightly realistic option for, oh say, 99% of the people stuck there.

 

They don't have to go hundreds of miles, just find higher ground and whatever shelter you can find/create from what's around you. The discussion seems to be stuck on the feasibility of using a bike to get out, but obviously that's just one option. Let's not stick to that point, because I have thought this over a bit and I know it's not possible for everyone. There can be no perfect plan to move that many people in that time frame, given all the various physical and mental conditions of the residents. I'm looking at limiting the human damage.

 

So you admit that it was alot of the goverment's fault then you ask why should you help these people? The goverment screwed them, so fuckem, let them die...that will show the government. Sticking it to local government and discovering people true motivation for giving is not more important than human lives.

 

I'm not sure where all the cute remarks about the government are coming from, as I'm certainly not making such an immature point about getting back at the beauracracy in such a way.

[2GOLD 0]

How far are you going to get from a hurricane on a bike in one day?

I'm not good with the math on that one.

[Ripper 0]

Well, you suggested that these people do not deserve charity because a: Local goverment fucked things up and should have done a better job

b: They were too stupid to leave when they got the warning.

 

You gradually stopped blaming the people without the ability to leave, so what does that leave? A.

 

And you were arguring reasons NOT to give carity to the people...now if you reasoning behind that is the goverment fucked up...well....there you go.

[The Czech Republic 0]

Why does the city have to be rebuilt? So it can be buried in water and shit again the next time a hurricane comes? It's a fairly glib thing to say but nature always wins.

We have to show how America is strong and can always rebuild itself. Dennis Hastert took a lot of shit for saying that it was patently ridiculous to rebuild on the existing site, because a floodplain like that would never be built on today. Save the French Quarter, and some of the necessary stuff for shipping, but no, you can't restore New Orleans completely. That's stupid.

[Big Ol' Smitty 0]

Also, it's just a really important site strategically and economically. America's largest port, at the delta of the Mississippi, etc.

[The Czech Republic 0]

Correct, it is very important. That's why all the "Bush let it happen" crap doesn't work. But honestly, I don't think it's ever going to be the same again. There's going to be a presence for the shipping, maybe a naval base, but it's not going to be a major city again.

[CheesalaIsGood 0]

I don't know where Thumb Tack guy got the idea that I am looking down on people simply because I want to help them out. Or that I would want him to feel guilty that I AM doing something and HE is not. Don't want to help? Fuck it then. Don't. There are PLENTY who will regardless of their judgement on whether or not they could, would, or should have got out of the fucking city. It's something folks call "the right thing to do". Cuz you never know when it might happen to you.

 

Look, I have a real motivation for going there. My girlfriend was down there visiting family and after the storm I lost contact with her for a couple days. It's been a rollar coaster ride so like it or not I am involved in some ways. Hearing her first hand reports after the fact, moved me to want to do something about it. I don't see what Thumb Tacks problem is. Should we leave anyone left down there to die? I say no.

 

As far as the story of this storm, the rescue and eventual rebuilding of lives is what is left to do. So best to get to it.

[BX 0]

They don't have to go hundreds of miles, just find higher ground and whatever shelter you can find/create from what's around you. The discussion seems to be stuck on the feasibility of using a bike to get out, but obviously that's just one option. Let's not stick to that point, because I have thought this over a bit and I know it's not possible for everyone. There can be no perfect plan to move that many people in that time frame, given all the various physical and mental conditions of the residents. I'm looking at limiting the human damage.

 

Many of the people in New Orleans found "higher ground" in the form of multi-story buildings. Many people in New Orleans found other forms of shelter, such as the Superdome or ahem... their attics. Many people in New Orleans are dead because they were cornered in their "shelters" and "higher grounds" with little to no sustenance by infectious waters that in many places were too high to walk through. This is exactly the reason that it was imperative to get these people out of the city as soon as possible, but due to economic conditions and criminal negligence on the part of the government, this didn’t happen. So these people have died a horrific, senseless death.

[Red Hot Thumbtack In The Eye 0]

Well, you suggested that these people do not deserve charity because a: Local goverment fucked things up and should have done a better job

b: They were too stupid to leave when they got the warning.

 

You gradually stopped blaming the people without the ability to leave, so what does that leave? A.

 

And you were arguring reasons NOT to give carity to the people...now if you reasoning behind that is the goverment fucked up...well....there you go.

 

No, I didn't stop blaming the people when our conversation switched a little more to the topic of the government. I'll leave the ratio of blame assignment to interest groups and those who have exhausted all their words on the actual event.

 

Correct, it is very important. That's why all the "Bush let it happen" crap doesn't work. But honestly, I don't think it's ever going to be the same again. There's going to be a presence for the shipping, maybe a naval base, but it's not going to be a major city again.

 

This would seem like the most reasonable course to take in the area now.

 

I don't know where Thumb Tack guy got the idea that I am looking down on people simply because I want to help them out. Or that I would want him to feel guilty that I AM doing something and HE is not.

 

Again you emphasize boldly that YOU are doing something and I am not.

 

Don't want to help? Fuck it then. Don't. There are PLENTY who will regardless of their judgement on whether or not they could, would, or should have got out of the fucking city. It's something folks call "the right thing to do". Cuz you never know when it might happen to you.

 

Again, this just comes off as appealing to my sense of right and wrong in a Christian sense, and it's offensive.

 

Look, I have a real motivation for going there. My girlfriend was down there visiting family and after the storm I lost contact with her for a couple days. It's been a rollar coaster ride so like it or not I am involved in some ways.

 

I never denied that you have personal involvement in this at all. The fact that you are going to help your girlfriend and her family is very admirable and I applaud you for your dedication to the people you hold dear. This doesn't kill off the outright insanity that I see from your posts to me.

 

Many of the people in New Orleans found "higher ground" in the form of multi-story buildings. Many people in New Orleans found other forms of shelter, such as the Superdome or ahem... their attics. Many people in New Orleans are dead because they were cornered in their "shelters" and "higher grounds" with little to no sustenance by infectious waters that in many places were too high to walk through. This is exactly the reason that it was imperative to get these people out of the city as soon as possible, but due to economic conditions and criminal negligence on the part of the government, this didn’t happen. So these people have died a horrific, senseless death.

 

Not exactly what I was thinking of in terms of higher ground. I would say that it would be more prudent to move to higher elevations either within the city or in the nearest possible place otherwise.

 

Yes the people died horribly, but again, they are not without blame in this to, in many cases. And yes, the government is a spectacular failure aswell. Disgusting and very sad.

 

A related question I have now...with all the things going on in the Superdome or other largely populated 'safe' areas that the people are now stuck in, what will the decontamination protocols be after they people can be moved out of there? From what little I've seen of it, it seems that the restrooms and other parts of the building have become open sewers

[Edwin MacPhisto 0]

Ragging on people for donating money to help provide relief in the wake of a massive natural disaster is SO METAL.

 

Dumbass.

[The Czech Republic 0]

Tack's no fool.

[Big Ol' Smitty 0]

Within the goofy talking point box of Republican and Democrat, I wish to be addressed as neither of them, as neither of them apply to me.

 

He's so *above* us!

 

Well, shit is a vital part of reality so yes, I suppose I am talking shit.

 

How insightful! A modern day Lao-Tzu!

[EricMM 0]

I'm going to go out on a limb and agree with Tack that anyone who had the means to move easily on their own power should have gotten out and WALKED. You can get very very far on foot in two days, certainly far enough to get to another city that's above sea level.

 

Now, on the other hand, and this is signifigant, if someone told me that I ahd to leave maryland in two days and go somewhere else, I wouldn't know WHERE to go.

 

But uphill would have been a good idea for them. UPSTAIRS, to answer a previous (silly) comment, was not good enough. Obviously.

[Red Hot Thumbtack In The Eye 0]

He's so *above* us!

 

No need to be defensive. I just see so many people wasting talent by creating an identity based on what political side they choose for themselves. This is terribly counterproductive and does no good for anyone. They're pretty much the same team nowadays anyway, only difference is which talking points are printed in bold in their speeches.

 

And I am above a lot of people.

[Big Ol' Smitty 0]

lol

[Perfxion 0]

Well, when a person is dirt poor with 3 kids, where do you go and how do you get there? Walking to where? Over two HIGHWAY bridges out of town seems retarded. Plus the only thing the city of done was to tell people to get on the city buses out. But that is it. TELL people to get out. They can't force people. Force is only done by the gun.

 

The problem with this whole thing is that people are telling Americans not to complain about faults they see with the government. I just can't agree to that logic because "we need to worry more about saving people and blame later". This whole country is built on the idea of questioning the government at every turn. If this country was about waiting later to question government we wouldn't be Amrericans, we would still be Britians.

[Red Baron 0]

How can you go to a higher ground in New Orleans when that area is below sea level.

[Guest Agent of Oblivion]

How can you go to a higher ground in New Orleans when that area is below sea level.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Not all of it is. The surrounding area to the north definitely isn't. Walking over the Lake Ponchatrain causeway in a hurricane is a pretty silly idea, though. Especially with thousands fleeing quickly in vehicles.

[Stephen Joseph 0]

Again, the city of New Orleans had 350 schoolbuses 1 mile from the superdome that oculd have been used to evacuate people..

[2GOLD 0]

Again, the city of New Orleans had 350 schoolbuses 1 mile from the superdome that oculd have been used to evacuate people..

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

 

Hey, stop expecting the city of New Orleans to have done something smart.

They never have so I don't know why people were expecting them to now.

[dubq 0]

I think he's just illustrating that this problem is the City's problem first and foremost. Then State. Then Federal.