2005-06 MLB Offseason Thread

[ISportsFan 0]

Something that hasn't been said yet is that the White Sox swapped Damaso Marte to Pittsburgh for Rob Mackowiak. This fills the White Sox's need for Crede insurance and gets rid of Marte, who gave me more heart attacks than anyone over the past 2 years, back to where he came from.

[MarvinisaLunatic 0]

I dont know about the Manny for Tejada trade, but the Orioles might as well trade Tejada now that he's publicly stated he doesn't want to stay in Baltimore. The fans will definitely turn on him and theres nothing worse than a disgruntled player who doesn't want to play for a team being forced to hang around.. And the Orioles have no one to blame but their own front office for screwing up and sitting on their asses and not making any moves that could help the team and the ones they do end up backfiring (Palmeiro, Sosa, Kline, Ponson resigned). They could probably get a decent package back for him.

 

Orioles fans have spent the last 8 years watching a crappy team play in a beautiful ballpark, whats another 5?

[Styles 0]

I dont know about the Manny for Tejada trade, but the Orioles might as well trade Tejada now that he's publicly stated he doesn't want to stay in Baltimore. The fans will definitely turn on him and theres nothing worse than a disgruntled player who doesn't want to play for a team being forced to hang around.. And the Orioles have no one to blame but their own front office for screwing up and sitting on their asses and not making any moves that could help the team and the ones they do end up backfiring (Palmeiro, Sosa, Kline, Ponson resigned). They could probably get a decent package back for him.

 

Orioles fans have spent the last 8 years watching a crappy team play in a beautiful ballpark, whats another 5?

 

I've already stated I'd turn on the team. Trading him is admitting that yes, this owner and this front office have no intention of improving the team and are spitting on their fans and their superstar player. They should respond by making some big signings and a dynamic trade or 2 (not Tejada). I know better though.

[Kahran Ramsus 0]

Best - Toronto. Going into the off-season they needed a 1B, closer, SP and corner OF. They managed three of those. They may have overpaid, but they needed to if they were going to improve.

 

Worst - Florida. Does anything need to be said? Loria's a permanent member on my scumbag list.

Edited December 9, 2005 by Kahran Ramsus

[MarvinisaLunatic 0]

I dont know about the Manny for Tejada trade, but the Orioles might as well trade Tejada now that he's publicly stated he doesn't want to stay in Baltimore. The fans will definitely turn on him and theres nothing worse than a disgruntled player who doesn't want to play for a team being forced to hang around.. And the Orioles have no one to blame but their own front office for screwing up and sitting on their asses and not making any moves that could help the team and the ones they do end up backfiring (Palmeiro, Sosa, Kline, Ponson resigned). They could probably get a decent package back for him.

 

Orioles fans have spent the last 8 years watching a crappy team play in a beautiful ballpark, whats another 5?

 

I've already stated I'd turn on the team. Trading him is admitting that yes, this owner and this front office have no intention of improving the team and are spitting on their fans and their superstar player. They should respond by making some big signings and a dynamic trade or 2 (not Tejada). I know better though.

The only problem is, now that teams know the Orioles would be desperate to make some big deals to appease Tejada, they will try and rob them blind in the process and if Angelos hasn't gone for those trades prior, he sure wont do it now when it will be even worse. And we already know that FAs will take less money (see Konerko) to play somewhere besides Baltimore, so it would be rather hard for them to land any of the remaing free agents as well.

[Boon 0]

I dont know about the Manny for Tejada trade....

I would mark out hard for that.

[The Czech Republic 0]

FUCK, White Sox got Mackowiak. He's a local guy; I wanted him on the Cubs. I had him on the Cubs in MVP and everything

[EVIL~! alkeiper 0]

Throw all the stats around you want, but you can't just plug AAA players into a major league lineup and expect them all to produce and excell at the next level. It just seems that everyone expects every prospect to work out, which I can guarentee is not going to happen. It's not that I don't think everyone knows that, it just seems that way.

Projecting players at all levels is a risk. The same way it would be difficult to say what Johnny Damon will produce in 3-4 years, you also have trouble projecting career paths of players in A ball and Rookie system. All projection systems have their inaccuracies, and players will often not turn out the way you expect.

 

That said, statistical analysis has grown to the point where we can adjust the level of competition and gain a more accurate read on the talent level of minor league players. Using minor league stats, we can predict performance with roughly the same accuracy of an MLB player. One projection system pegs Andy Marte for a .255/.350/.469 line at Fenway. Given Marte's excellent performance the last two years that is entirely reasonable, and a team can compare that against Kevin Youkilis and Mike Lowell and make a decision.

 

AAA players do come up and fail occasionally in the Majors. It also happens to established players. Look at Mike Lowell. If he had played in AAA in 2004, it would be an example of a prospect not panning out. But since he's established, it's a bad year. Many AAA players could turn around poor performances in brief trials, but since they are not established, they are on a short leash.

 

Now if you have several AAA players coming into the lineup at once, it's a different scenario. The problem is not that you can't expect AAA players to come to the majors, but that those players were generally in AAA for a reason. You can't expect a group of players to improve all at once obviously. That's the problem with the Marlins. Individually they have some players that could take a step forward. But to collect a whole team of them is suicide.

 

Any projection has its problems. I can say Andy Marte will excel. He might not. But you could also be wrong on any number of MLB players.

[Vern Gagne 0]

FUCK, White Sox got Mackowiak. He's a local guy; I wanted him on the Cubs. I had him on the Cubs in MVP and everything

 

 

Sorry he's under 30.

 

Born June 20, 1976

[Guest OSIcon]

The Orioles shouldn't go with the mindset that they will trade Tejada for the "best deal" no matter what it is. This is one comment in a phone interview so it is way too early to say that things can't be worked out. Tejada is an ultra-competitive guy so it doesn't surprise me he feels this way. It is a little surprising that he would come out in public and say this, but isn't surprising he feels this way. He feels the same way most O's fans feel after they didn't do anything last offseason, had all the problems in 2005, and have yet to make a "big" move this offseason. I do think there is a chance that he is just speaking out of frustration and isn't in a "trade me or else" frame of mind.

 

I'm going to be optimistic and hope they can talk to Tejada, smooth things out, and make at least a couple of more moves to show that they are heading in a positive direction. If not and both parties decide a trade is best, they need to take their time and find the best possible trade for a good group of talented (and young) players.

[Mik 0]

At this very moment - only two Marlins are making more than $1M next year, Brian Moehler and Ron Villone. Moehler just signed the deal yesterday, so that will stick, but Villone is gonna be gone.

 

So after D-Train goes through arbitration, he and Moehler will be the only two players making over $1M on the entire team, barring any FA signings. Crazy.

[mike546 0]

Jason Stark just reported on ESPN Radio that the Yanks are in serious talks with Texas for Wilkerson or Nix, Philly for Michaels or Victorino, and Seattle for Jeremey Reed. All these deals being disscused involve Pavano.

[Fartsauce 0]

Ricciardi had only a few discussions yesterday. What he did not do, contrary to a report on ESPN, was put a deal on the table that would see Miguel Batista traded for Milton Bradley.

 

"We talked, but we're not going to do that," Ricciardi said.

 

Neither did discussions with the Orioles about Javier Lopez joining the Blue Jays for Batista and Eric Hinske reach the level of seriousness that former Blue Jays manager Buck Martinez seemed to indicate on the radio in Baltimore.

 

"They approached us about something … not interested," Ricciardi said.

 

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/serv.../BNStory/Sports

Edited December 9, 2005 by Corpse

[the pinjockey 0]

Philly for Michaels or Victorino......All these deals being disscused involve Pavano.

 

Unless either a boatload of cash and/or a choice player or two (Eric Duncan looks nice inthis spot) comes with him I am hoping they pass. Pavano isn't any better than what they already have and costs a lot more money.

[mike546 0]

I'm guessing we'll be paying atleast half of his contract if hes dealt.

[Styles 0]

For any Bay Area fans, a question, do you all have any information on the relationship of Miguel Tejada and Ramon Hernandez when they played together in Oakland? Were they known to not like each other? Thanks.

[The Man in Blak 0]

Maybe it's a Cindy Sandberg situation? It is a little suspicious that Tejada makes those comments right after they announce the Ramon Hernandez signing.

Edited December 9, 2005 by The Man in Blak

[the pinjockey 0]

I would say maybe he wonders why they have money tied up in 2 catchers now when they have some other holes to fill, but players typically seem to be of the "oooh they signed a big name, me likey shiny" mindset. So I doubt he thought that far into it.

[Styles 0]

Well, I'm more asking because at an O's board some guy is being all cryptic saying Tejada and Hernandez hate each other but won't expound so I wanted to confirm it or debunk it for any A's fans who might have known something.

[the pinjockey 0]

Is there a reason that if a team that needs pitching, makes a deal that doesn't bring back a pitcher it is automatically a bad deal?

 

From Stark's Winners/Losers column (honorable mention losers section):

Rangers (Host-City Division): There might have been more grumbling about new Texas GM Jon Daniels from his fellow GMs than we've heard since Chuck LaMar ran the show in Tampa Bay. Daniels overpriced his most attractive commodity. And then, when he dealt his other big chip, Alfonso Soriano, he got a package back that included no big league-ready starting pitchers. There was immediate talk that Texas would deal away Brad Wilkerson, obtained in that deal, for pitching. But the price tag on him might scare more clubs away. "Unless they can flip those guys for pitching, that deal makes no sense," said one assistant GM. "And I wouldn't trade Soriano in the first place. Wilkerson [and the second player] Terrmel Sledge could play for a lonnngggg time and never put up the numbers Soriano does. He's an underrated guy for me."

 

So he got no starting pitcher back for Soriano. Who cares? They got a better, cheaper player back in return and still have Mench to deal. If you have a tradable player, are you supposed to trade him for a middling SP if you get the chance just to say you got a SP back?

 

And god I hope the assist. GM in the quote isn't AmarBuckle. Is Soriano underrated to anyone in the game? I've never heard any "analyst" call out his weaknesses.

And career numbers:

Wilkerson: .256/.365/.452/.817

Soriano: .280/.320/.500/.820

Yes, obviously Wilkerson could never put up Soriano like numbers.

 

.......

 

Well that was kind of angry sounding wasn't it.

 

And Soriano is really 45 years old.

Edited December 9, 2005 by the pinjockey

[Sass 0]

Until Peter Angelos takes his head out of his ass and quits acting like a shithead, no one's going to want to play for the O's, no matter how much money the team throws out. Angelos getting a personality transplant or booted as owner would be a start towards some productive O seasons.

[EVIL~! alkeiper 0]

One thing bothers me about Starks' column. In one paragraph, he chides the Toronto Blue Jays for offering too much money to AJ Burnett. In another, he criticizes the Cardinals for not offering enough money to sign AJ Burnett.

 

The Cardinals are going to be fine. They retained their four best players from last season, including the reigning Cy Young and MVP award winners. They're bringing back four of their five starters and their closer. If they get a minimum of production out of the corners and second base, they can win 90 games easily. Especially if they get Scott Rolen healthy.

[The Man in Blak 0]

Well, they're trying to bring back all five starters now - they just proposed a three year deal to Matt Morris. If Morris is that "big pitcher we need" that Jocketty is willing to punt 2B and COF for, then we're in some serious trouble. Maybe not as much this year (though I'm certainly not as enthusiastic as you, Al - 2003 wasn't that long ago), but probably next year, especially if it's in the range of the 3/25-ish deals that Morris has been receiving from other teams.

[EVIL~! alkeiper 0]

Well, they're trying to bring back all five starters now - they just proposed a three year deal to Matt Morris. If Morris is that "big pitcher we need" that Jocketty is willing to punt 2B and COF for, then we're in some serious trouble. Maybe not as much this year (though I'm certainly not as enthusiastic as you, Al - 2003 wasn't that long ago), but probably next year, especially if it's in the range of the 3/25-ish deals that Morris has been receiving from other teams.

I don't think Jocketty is likely to ignore the lineup altogether. Just remember this is a team that has won 90+ games five of the last six years. I don't think that's likely to end until they start losing their big pieces.

[Bored 0]

If Tejada and Hernandez hated each other it was never made public while they were Oakland so it's news to me.

[EVIL~! alkeiper 0]

Same here. But this is not the only place I've heard it.

[mike546 0]

Post says Sturtze is going to be involved if a trade for Jason Michaels happens. Sturtze really doesn't fit in that park, hes a HR machine.

[Guest Monty Burns]

The Tigers are continuing to do what they do best: signing washed-up veterans. Todd Jones and Kenny Rogers each signed two-year deals (Jones $11M and Rogers $16M).

[Mik 0]

I wouldn't call Todd Jones washed up. He had one of his better years last year.

[Brett Favre 0]

Come on Brad Wilkerson....