Renegade 0 Report post Posted December 23, 2005 Alex Luther with Superboy prime as his lackey. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Steviekick 0 Report post Posted December 23, 2005 Pretty interesting, although I did believe them when they said that IC wouldn't necessarily be a sequel to the original Crisis. I bet there are a lot of people happy that E-2 Supes hasn't gone psycho. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Vyce 0 Report post Posted December 23, 2005 Alex may not be the real big bad. Read the Villains United miniseries, where Pariah tells Lex Luthor (which was the Alex Luthor version of Lex, if I'm not mistaken) that he is "not the Apex Predator", which has led many to believe that there is another, 'true' Big Bad still out there waiting, most likely to be found at or near the 'center of the universe' where Donna Troy & others are gathering. Who that could be, well, many guesses are out there. Personally, I'm enjoying Crisis, but I have to say, with each episode I become a little more disappointed, because there was two years (or more) of AWESOME buildup where it was the villains of the D.C. universe ready to kill the heroes for what was done to them (mind-wiping), but we see now that it was all a swerve, and the real focus is on the original Crisis. That's disappointing to me. I haven't been waiting in anticipation for two years for them to tell me one story, and then when the Infinite Crisis mini finally appears, come to discover that they've changed the direction & plot of the storyline COMPLETELY. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Renegade 0 Report post Posted December 23, 2005 My favorite part of this issue was Bats first asking about what happens to Dick in Earth 2 and telling Supes to stick it, it was a great non Batdick moment. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JasonX 0 Report post Posted December 23, 2005 Alex may not be the real big bad. Read the Villains United miniseries, where Pariah tells Lex Luthor (which was the Alex Luthor version of Lex, if I'm not mistaken) that he is "not the Apex Predator", which has led many to believe that there is another, 'true' Big Bad still out there waiting, most likely to be found at or near the 'center of the universe' where Donna Troy & others are gathering. Who that could be, well, many guesses are out there. It should be noted that the Apex Predator line came BEFORE Pariah was told that the Luthor he was captured by was the second Luthor later tried to warn regular Lex about. So Alex=Apex Predator still applies as a possibility.... As for Donna and company in space, the rumor going right now is that Geoff and company decided that the pay-off to that whole storyline won't take place in Infinite Crisis at all, and instead will not get resolved/climaxed in Infinite Crisis and the storyline will take place in "52" instead. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SuperJerk 0 Report post Posted December 24, 2005 How the hell could Alex Luthor be orchestrating Villians United if he was trapped in the pocket dimension with Superman-2, Superboy, and Lois Kent the entire time Villians United was going on? Did he fucking sneak out while nobody was looking? This makes no sense! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
algrim 0 Report post Posted December 24, 2005 How the hell could Alex Luthor be orchestrating Villians United if he was trapped in the pocket dimension with Superman-2, Superboy, and Lois Kent the entire time Villians United was going on? Did he fucking sneak out while nobody was looking? This makes no sense! In an in terview with Didio, he said that everything would be explained in the Infinite Crisis Secret Files Special. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ZGangsta 0 Report post Posted December 30, 2005 How the hell could Alex Luthor be orchestrating Villians United if he was trapped in the pocket dimension with Superman-2, Superboy, and Lois Kent the entire time Villians United was going on? Did he fucking sneak out while nobody was looking? This makes no sense! I'm guessing that since Alex Luthor was the one who constructed the place the 4 of them went to , he had the ability to get in and out at his will. The part of that issue that confuses me was the 'Dick Grayson' line in the conversation between Superman and Batman. It could be interpreted many different ways, none of which make any sense. Otherwise, another solid issue with some very interesting developments. We better start getting some answers to the whole space war/cataclysm soon because it's starting to feel dragged out. Any theories as to what the rebuilt demensional tuning fork will be used for, and why each of the people are strapped in to it? Assuming he puts Power Girl in there and they get NightShade, they have representatives of all 5 of the Earths that were absorbed (if you count the Ray as his predecessor) plus Lady Quark and Breach. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Renegade 0 Report post Posted December 30, 2005 (edited) My theory is the machine is to filter out all the other earths. Like using Powergirl will eradicate all Earth 2 elements and Black Adam will eradicate all Earth S and so on. So you are left with Earth Prime and Earth 3, Luthor and SBP's homeworlds. Edited December 30, 2005 by Renegade Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kurt Angle Mark 0 Report post Posted December 30, 2005 The part of that issue that confuses me was the 'Dick Grayson' line in the conversation between Superman and Batman. It could be interpreted many different ways, none of which make any sense. Batman thinks the world of Dick Grayson so what he was basically telling E-2 Superman was that as long as people like Dick exist on Earth there is no acceptable reason for replacing it. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Vampiro69 0 Report post Posted December 31, 2005 The part of that issue that confuses me was the 'Dick Grayson' line in the conversation between Superman and Batman. It could be interpreted many different ways, none of which make any sense. Batman thinks the world of Dick Grayson so what he was basically telling E-2 Superman was that as long as people like Dick exist on Earth there is no acceptable reason for replacing it. That is how I took that line as well. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JasonX 0 Report post Posted December 31, 2005 My theory is the machine is to filter out all the other earths. Like using Powergirl will eradicate all Earth 2 elements and Black Adam will eradicate all Earth S and so on. So you are left with Earth Prime and Earth 3, Luthor and SBP's homeworlds. Won't happen since Earth Prime and 3 were both destroyed by the Anti-Monitor and not merged into the Post-Crisis DCU. As for the Dick Grayson line, the Golden Age/Earth-2 Dick Grayson was a spineless and complete useless pussy who never once backtalked Batman or tried to make his own way in the world as his own person like the Earth 1 Dick Grayson did; he clung to Batman's cape like a baby 24-7 and later the Huntress's cape due to his being ball-less and impotent..... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Vampiro69 0 Report post Posted December 31, 2005 Man, that was harsh but funny. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Sass 0 Report post Posted December 31, 2005 I hope to see another Alan Moore FU from DC. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Steviekick 0 Report post Posted December 31, 2005 I hope to see another Alan Moore FU from DC. Where was the first one? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SuperJerk 0 Report post Posted January 1, 2006 How the hell could Alex Luthor be orchestrating Villians United if he was trapped in the pocket dimension with Superman-2, Superboy, and Lois Kent the entire time Villians United was going on? Did he fucking sneak out while nobody was looking? This makes no sense! I'm guessing that since Alex Luthor was the one who constructed the place the 4 of them went to , he had the ability to get in and out at his will. I forgot about that. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Renegade 0 Report post Posted January 19, 2006 Guys, read issue 4. I'm not spoiling anything but it was by far the best issue yet. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ZGangsta 0 Report post Posted January 19, 2006 Just got through issue 4 and yeah, it was amazing! The centerpiece of the issue was a massive fight with Superboy (both of them) that was just brutal. And Batman seems to finally be realizing that he's been becoming less and less heroic over that past years and has paid a price for that. Actually I think one of the best parts of this series was last issue where he just breaks down in the Batcave actually starts crying. He had a great scene with Nightwing in this issue as well. The part with all the Flashes was so great too. I also really liked the one page exposition that explained the orchestration behind each of the Countdown mini-series, as well as the reason for collecting all the people on the machine. Man, this series is delivering on all counts. It's totally paying off the last 2 years of buildup and hasn't disappointed yet. This Crisis isn't meant to be a huge continuity alteration, but rather an 'attitude adjustment' (as someone at DC put it) for the DCU. The conflict in this series is about the actions and attitudes of the characters, but it's also an editorial comment on how the characters have gotten continuously less heroic and inspiring over the last 20 years. And, to me, it shows that the higher ups at DC actually 'get it' as to what should make superhero comics great. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Justice 0 Report post Posted January 19, 2006 DC, while not always having the greatest or most original characters/gimmicks, deliver so far above Marvel that it just isn't even funny. I'm utterly amazed at how good some of this stuff is. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SuperJerk 0 Report post Posted January 20, 2006 The conflict in this series is about the actions and attitudes of the characters, but it's also an editorial comment on how the characters have gotten continuously less heroic and inspiring over the last 20 years. And, to me, it shows that the higher ups at DC actually 'get it' as to what should make superhero comics great. Eventually the pendelum will swing the other direction, and people will begin favoring "realistic" over "heroic" characters once again. Put out too much of anything for too long and people will get sick of it. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Special K 0 Report post Posted January 20, 2006 Wow. Superboy-2 was pretty much Kid Miracleman there. Who was the Max in the big Flash group hug? And was that Wally in his Kid Flash getup in the black mask? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ZGangsta 0 Report post Posted January 20, 2006 The conflict in this series is about the actions and attitudes of the characters, but it's also an editorial comment on how the characters have gotten continuously less heroic and inspiring over the last 20 years. And, to me, it shows that the higher ups at DC actually 'get it' as to what should make superhero comics great. Eventually the pendelum will swing the other direction, and people will begin favoring "realistic" over "heroic" characters once again. Put out too much of anything for too long and people will get sick of it. I don't think that they should go all the way to one-dimensional do-no-wrong heroes like there have been in the past. I just think that after Watchmen and DKR, and then the (short lived) success of the Image Comics characters, this realistic 'grim and gritty' style has gradually become the backbone of the comics universe. Watchmen was excellent and brilliant and showed how characters could be written. However, it doesn't mean that they should always be written in that style. I think that the superheroes just need to be portrayed in a manner that makes you excited to read them, but still be written in a realistic manner (in terms of their characterizations). They shouldn't be characatures of themselves like Batman's been for the past few years. And I'm not even going to touch All Star Batman and Robin. That comic is exactly the problem I'm talking about. I think Infinite Crisis 1 put it best: "Let's face it 'Superman', the last time you inspired anyone... was when you were dead." Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Special K 0 Report post Posted January 20, 2006 If you don't mind, touch on AS Batman & Robin. Haven't read it, is it way too sappy, or something? Fuck, after this last ish, I don't see Ted Kord coming back. That sucks. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SuperJerk 0 Report post Posted January 20, 2006 If you don't mind, touch on AS Batman & Robin. Haven't read it, is it way too sappy, or something? Not sappy. A total asshole Batman exiled into a bad Sin City parody would be a good way of putting it. All-Star Batman and Robin thread Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Renegade 0 Report post Posted January 20, 2006 One thing I don't get How did Jay block heat vision with his hat/helmet? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JasonX 0 Report post Posted January 21, 2006 One thing I don't get How did Jay block heat vision with his hat/helmet? It's been established in the past that Jay's helmet is virtually indistructable and can reflect any type of energy blast via it's reflective properties. Who was the Max in the big Flash group hug? And was that Wally in his Kid Flash getup in the black mask? Max Mercury and Johnny Quick. Max was Impulse's mentor in his own comic while Johnny Quick was a character from All Star Squadron who could gain super-speed via reciting a math equation and who was the resident super-speed character in the DCU during the 40s, when Jay Garrick (GA Flash) wasn't available. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Renegade 0 Report post Posted January 21, 2006 Thanks for the info Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest ChikoDemono Report post Posted January 21, 2006 Now that's a goddamn cliffhanger! With that big, silly grin on Big Supes face, I'm glad the son of a bitch is back home. The Superboy vs. Superboy "talk" required a few extra readings to soak in what was going on. I can see the Kid Miracleman reference except with Superboy representing both identities all at once. My god that was brutal. I also greatly enjoyed the scene with the West family. 'Tis an interesting twist to the "a Flash must disappear during a big Crisis" tradition. "I have learned that no matter where they are, or what reality they come from, when a Luthor stands next to a Superman-- they will always be at odds." - Alex Luthor to Power Girl explaining his "friendship with Kal-L" PG. 6, Panel 7 and "Wait. I know who you are. You're that... guy. The dude on my toothpaste. 'A smile as bright as gold' or somethin', right?" - Jaime Reyes, Blue Beetle III(?) to Booster Gold PG. 11, Panel 5 are among my favorite quotes. It's just an awesome issue and I apologize for the spastic spoiler tags. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Vampiro69 0 Report post Posted January 25, 2006 This issue was a home run for me as well. Thanks for explaining above about the Flash situation, makes up for the lame ass shit that has gone down in his title since Geoff Johns left the title. It is sad to say but I marked out when I saw Max Mercury again. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dr. Zaius 0 Report post Posted January 26, 2006 Can somebody post a list of everybody that Superboy either killed or dismembered ? I recognized most of them, but had a hard time remembering their names. "I'm not stupid!" "You're ruining me!" That was pretty messed up. 2006 already has a most shocking moment. I guess KNOWING you're supposed to grow up to be Superman would be enough to screw with anyone's head. I mean, damn. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
