Ultimate Put Over.....

[haws bah gawd 0]

Didn't Khali basically accomplish that? He made his debut and destroyed Taker, and the match from Judgement Day (?) was nothing short of an extended squash.

[benn 0]

Khali is useless and shouldn't count.

[The Niggardly King 0]

I actually think you can still run a respect angle and help put someone over in this day and age. I'm not talking about Cena like respect that he showed Triple H during their build towards Wrestlemania... but sort of what they did with the first match Benjamin/Michaels had. That was perfect for one night... just the way it was built. This was when the crowd was into Benjamin pretty well. The problem though... is that they followed this up by having Shelton job to nearly everyone.

 

It wasn't a put over by Shawn... but it's the closest thing to one we'll ever see from him.

[Just John 0]

Shawn did a good put over for Angle at WM 21. You could argue that Angle didn't need it and was already a main eventer, but he seldom got clean wins and getting Shawn to tap clean was arguably his most credible victory since beating Lesnar at Summer Slam 03. Of course the bookers capitalized on Angle's momentum by:

 

1. Running the "gutterslut" program with Booker and Sharmell

2. Sending him to Raw to feud with Eugene

3. Jobbing him to Cena repeatedly

 

And of course, Shawn got his job back somewhere in there.

[alfdogg 0]

hogan did the ultimate put-over at wm6, lolz

[TheInsane 0]

I actually think you can still run a respect angle and help put someone over in this day and age. I'm not talking about Cena like respect that he showed Triple H during their build towards Wrestlemania... but sort of what they did with the first match Benjamin/Michaels had. That was perfect for one night... just the way it was built. This was when the crowd was into Benjamin pretty well. The problem though... is that they followed this up by having Shelton job to nearly everyone.

 

It wasn't a put over by Shawn... but it's the closest thing to one we'll ever see from him.

 

On the same note, HHH did a pretty good job at putting Shelton benjamin over. Shelton just came over from SD. It was his forst singles run in WWE and also his first time as a face in said company. He got new music and some pyro for his entrance and within the first month I believe he beat HHH. And he didnt beat him once but 3 times. I cant remember how clean the wins were but I remember Shelton getting over with the audience after that. However WWE couldnt capitalize on it and we all know what happened after that.

[foleyfanforever88 0]

I actually think you can still run a respect angle and help put someone over in this day and age. I'm not talking about Cena like respect that he showed Triple H during their build towards Wrestlemania... but sort of what they did with the first match Benjamin/Michaels had. That was perfect for one night... just the way it was built. This was when the crowd was into Benjamin pretty well. The problem though... is that they followed this up by having Shelton job to nearly everyone.

 

It wasn't a put over by Shawn... but it's the closest thing to one we'll ever see from him.

 

On the same note, HHH did a pretty good job at putting Shelton benjamin over. Shelton just came over from SD. It was his forst singles run in WWE and also his first time as a face in said company. He got new music and some pyro for his entrance and within the first month I believe he beat HHH. And he didnt beat him once but 3 times. I cant remember how clean the wins were but I remember Shelton getting over with the audience after that. However WWE couldnt capitalize on it and we all know what happened after that.

 

He beat Triple H on his RAW debut.

[USC Wuz Robbed! 0]

On the same note, HHH did a pretty good job at putting Shelton benjamin over. Shelton just came over from SD. It was his forst singles run in WWE and also his first time as a face in said company. He got new music and some pyro for his entrance and within the first month I believe he beat HHH. And he didnt beat him once but 3 times. I cant remember how clean the wins were but I remember Shelton getting over with the audience after that. However WWE couldnt capitalize on it and we all know what happened after that.

 

Yeah the WWE couldn't capitalize on Benjamin because HHH brushed off the losses and refused to face him again, citing him to be "not in his league". Great job by HHH there.

[Guest DRH 502]

It's called doing what's right for business

 

Yeah...assuming there are still morons in the crowd who believe that Hogan really did "lose" as opposed to laying down for them. Kayfabe is dead, and Hogan doing the job to a younger dude might help for say...the 2 days the fans will remember it...

[USC Wuz Robbed! 0]

I don't think Hogan has any more "ultimate" put-overs left in him. Hogan was basically destroyed by Brock Lesnar. What more can be done with Hogan? He's already lost clean at Mania, tapped out clean, got destroyed...

[Guest wildpegasus]

Hogan's ultimate put-over was the Warrior. One of the biggest put-overs of all time. He's still got put-overs left in him but not ultimate ones. The only one left that he could possiby do would be Austin and that wouldn't make sense (despite what some smark fanboys think) since if Hogan and Austin go head to head it should be Hogan prevailing.

[Hunter's Torn Quad 0]

It's called doing what's right for business

 

Yeah...assuming there are still morons in the crowd who believe that Hogan really did "lose" as opposed to laying down for them. Kayfabe is dead, and Hogan doing the job to a younger dude might help for say...the 2 days the fans will remember it...

You make it sound like jobs don't matter anymore simply because kayfabe is dead. Hogan doing a job in the right circumstances and with the right presentation could literally make a career. I don't know if those circumstances are ever likely to happen, simply because the business is so down right now that by the time they do happen Hogan may be a cripple or dead, but if they do occur it would be a nice for Hogan to do what's right for business. I'd like to think that Terry Funk and Mick Foley aren't the only HoF wrestlers willing to give back to the business that made them. Then again, wrestling is a business that rewards selfishness and tends so shit on those who put the business ahead of their own interests.

[Kahran Ramsus 0]

The only guy I remember Hogan truly putting over is Yokozuna. Yoko basically crushed him at KOTR 93 (despite a cheap finish). Hogan couldn't slam him. He kicked out of the legdrop. He beat Hogan with Hogan's own finisher. He then destroyed Hogan afterwards, and basically kicked him out of the company starting off the longest heel title reign in the WWF since Billy Graham.

[Jericholic82 0]

Didn't Brock start using another move called the Brock Lock? I'd never seen that move used, so I remember him using it (against Benoit in particular, cause it looked badass and Benoit sold it like crazy), but I don't know if anyone else has used that move or what it is really called or anything.

yep, it was just that his bearhug was dubbed the brock lock by cole first in 2002, it didnt last long.

 

then again at least cole always remembers the names all of Matt hardys semi-finishers (like the side effect)

 

 

come on, JR is still calling Edges ddt the Impaler, when it was clearly established in 2001 that it is called the "Edge-cution" then again no one remembers that Edges reverse x-factor type of move (that JR just says "he dropped the bottom out on them") is actually called "The Edge-OMatic" as dubbed by edge and christian in late 2000

 

 

oops sorry I started ranting on finisher names.

 

back to topic, clearly most of the big names over the years have refused to accept that their time is over , and this will never change until Vince forces them to (I mean he screwed Bret didnt he, isnt it time he did it to someone like Hogan?)

[Lil' Bitch 0]

I'd never seen that move used, so I remember him using it (against Benoit in particular, cause it looked badass and Benoit sold it like crazy), but I don't know if anyone else has used that move or what it is really called or anything.

 

He got it from Japan. Its the Yamada Legbreaker.

[Guest DRH 502]

and Hogan doing the job to a younger dude might help for say...the 2 days the fans will remember it...

[Promoter 0]

I love how people think Hogan put Goldberg and Rock over.

 

Hogan did a job for Goldberg, but where were they both after that? Goldberg was stuck in the semi-main, and sometimes not even on a PPV, while Hogan was still in the main event and the focal point of virtually everything.

 

The idea that Hogan put Rock over at WM 18 is laughable though I’m not surprised that some people either cannot or will not see through it. Hogan did the job, but where was all the focus in the post-match? It wasn’t on Rock for beating Hogan. It was on Hogan for being such a gracious and humble loser and being all respectful. Hogan did the job but once again masterfully stole the spotlight in such a way that some people still can’t see it.

 

People are, again, confusing doing a job for someone with putting them over. They are not always the same thing. Rock did a job for Hurricane, but Hurricane wasn’t put over a lick from that. Nash did a clean job for Rey Mysterio, but I defy anyone to say that Mysterio got anything from it. Doing a job for someone that actually puts them over means they get the spotlight, they get the focus and they get elevated. It isn’t losing to someone and keeping the spotlight, staying the main focus and the winner staying on the same level they were before. Hogan’s jobs for Goldberg and Rock were classic examples; Hogan kept the spotlight, Hogan remained the focus, and neither guy got elevated from the win because of where the spotlight and focus remained.

 

 

Correct, putting someone over involves so much more then a simple loss. Guys like Hogan, Austin, Rock, Triple H, UT, Flair....have their status cemented right now. Even when they lose, there is usually a circumstance or a burial the next night on Raw or something in the near future that renders their losses meaningless. Truly putting someone over takes more then a simple job.

 

This is somewhat true, BUT and a big BUT is that for all we know The Rock/Hogan match could have been an audible with the way it played out. In front of another crowd maybe the way the match ended would have made Rock the spotlight, but in TORONTO that just wasn't going to happen. The Rock was getting booed just from his intertview. The crowd WANTED Hogan to win the match. They WANTED Hogan to be the spotlight. If they didn't they would have simply booed the hell out of him. They did it in the mid 90's when they thought he didn't deserve the spotlight as the top dog. I bet the reactions would have been different if Austin was in the match billed as "Seeing who is the greatest ever". Vince should have seen that response coming a mile away with the way the match was built. It was clear what the intent was in that year. Rock gets put over by Hogan and in turn he puts over The next big thing in Brock Lesnar. Lesnar went over Hogan last in terms of legends enroute to facing Rock as champion at SummerSlam. Rock became undisputed champion after Hogan fluked it against HHH the month after jobbing to Rock at Mania. The way the match ended at Mania had to happen imo because fans wanted Hogan a face and he clearly outgrown the nWo stuff at that point(although I would have stretched that story out much longer). The Rock just simply beating Hogan and Hogan leaving would have left the crowd dissappointed and anticlimatic being Mania.

 

Goldberg was OVER when Hogan jobbed to him and was the pinnacle of his career just as it was for Warrior defeating him. He had nowhere to go, but down imo. Goldberg still had the streak of all streaks going. It's funny as ratings dropped when Goldberg was champion which is forgotten. Anyways, Nash is soley responsible for Goldberg's demise for ending the streak for no reason and then doing the finger poke of doom with Hogan. Hogan never took the heat from Goldberg after his loss as he usually did like HHH in 20003/04 with opponents. I know exactly where you are coming from, but in these two instances Hogan did put them over.

[Hunter's Torn Quad 0]

It's funny as ratings dropped when Goldberg was champion which is forgotten.

Goldberg was champion, but who was still in the main events and in the most pushed programs? That's what some people really forget.

[USC Wuz Robbed! 0]

Yeah, it's not like Hogan/Warrior II was going to bring in viewers.

[bob_barron 0]

and Hogan doing the job to a younger dude might help for say...the 2 days the fans will remember it...

 

Not if they play it up correctly

[Jingus 0]

Exactly. Look at how Foley jobbing to Orton helped get him over as a serious main eventer. Yeah, kayfabe's dead, but the marks still tend to respect a guy a lot more if he's a winner rather than a loser.

[Promoter 0]

It's funny as ratings dropped when Goldberg was champion which is forgotten.

Goldberg was champion, but who was still in the main events and in the most pushed programs? That's what some people really forget.

 

Nah, Goldberg was still main eventing against guys like DDP. Hogan even disappeared a bit with that whole retirement crap for presidency. They should have given people what they wanted and that was Hogan vs. Nash and the whole nWO break up, but as promotions always do they run things into the ground and don't know when to stop when they have a good thing going.

[USC Wuz Robbed! 0]

It's funny as ratings dropped when Goldberg was champion which is forgotten.

Goldberg was champion, but who was still in the main events and in the most pushed programs? That's what some people really forget.

 

Nah, Goldberg was still main eventing against guys like DDP. Hogan even disappeared a bit with that whole retirement crap for presidency. They should have given people what they wanted and that was Hogan vs. Nash and the whole nWO break up, but as promotions always do they run things into the ground and don't know when to stop when they have a good thing going.

 

Wrong.

 

July: Goldberg wins the belt from Hogan. Hogan main events Bash at the Beach with DDP, Rodman and Karl Malone.

 

August: Bill Goldberg is in a forgotten battle royal while Hogan, once again, main events Road Wild, this time teaming with Eric Bischoff against DDP and Jay Leno.

 

September: Goldberg, once again, doesn't wrestle at Fall Brawl. Main event is a War Games that involved Hogan, and the main event angle was Hogan vs Warrior.

 

October: Halloween Havoc, Goldberg has a match here, but his match is cut off by PPV companies, so essentially the final match of HH was Hogan vs Warrior.

 

November: Neither Goldberg nor Hogan wrestles on the WW3 card.

 

December: Goldberg loses his belt to Kevin Nash at Starrcade.

[Jingus 0]

Goldberg wasn't main eventing. Let's take a look:

 

Bash at the Beach 1999: Goldberg vs. Curt Hennig underneath, Hogan/Rodman vs. DDP/Mailman was the main.

 

Road Wild 1999: Goldberg was in a meaningless battle royale underneath Hogan/Bischoff vs. Leno/DDP.

 

Fall Brawl 1999: Goldberg in the worst wargames match ever along with five hundred other guys.

 

Halloween Havoc: now THIS was a neat trick. Goldberg/DDP was the main... but Hogan/Warrior II and the rest of the show went so long that the PPV feed got cut and nobody saw it!

 

So no, Goldberg was NOT pushed as the biggest star when he had the belt.

[USC Wuz Robbed! 0]

Goldberg wasn't main eventing. Let's take a look:

 

Bash at the Beach 1999: Goldberg vs. Curt Hennig underneath, Hogan/Rodman vs. DDP/Mailman was the main.

 

Road Wild 1999: Goldberg was in a meaningless battle royale underneath Hogan/Bischoff vs. Leno/DDP.

 

Fall Brawl 1999: Goldberg in the worst wargames match ever along with five hundred other guys.

 

Halloween Havoc: now THIS was a neat trick. Goldberg/DDP was the main... but Hogan/Warrior II and the rest of the show went so long that the PPV feed got cut and nobody saw it!

 

So no, Goldberg was NOT pushed as the biggest star when he had the belt.

 

So my detailing was more accurate.

[Kahran Ramsus 0]

Fall Brawl 1999: Goldberg in the worst wargames match ever along with five hundred other guys.

 

It was 1998, and Goldberg wasn't in the match. Actually the winner of the match was going to get a Title Shot at Goldberg at Halloween Havoc, which is why DDP is fighting him there. "Goldberg" wrestled Chris Jericho at Fall Brawl, but that's as close as we got.

[Just call me Dan 0]

I have to give Hogan credit for MAKING Angle's AnkleLock. Angle had been using it for a while to no avail and hogan tapped clean to it at KOTR 2002 in thier only match together with Anlge in his stupid wig. From then on, angle started actuAlly tapping people with the move and it was sold as a legit finisher (except by Taker).

[Guest Human Highlight Reel]

Angle had made plenty of people tap with the Ankle Lock before that. Angle won the WWF championship with the Ankle Lock well before that.

[haws bah gawd 0]

I thought Angle won the WWF title after HHH did a run-in during his title match and hit the Rock with the Pedigree? Is this a different match Im thinking of?

[Guest Human Highlight Reel]

I was referring to his second WWF Championship, but I don't recall him ever winning it in the way you described. His victory over the Rock was due to botched interference by Rikishi