NBA Roundtable Discussion

[alfdogg 0]

The few mocks I've seen so far have Yi as the projected pick for the Celts.

[alfdogg 0]

OK, actually it's just RealGM. HoopsHype has Noah in that spot, and InsideHoops has Conley. Although I read that Ainge said he wasn't drafting a point, because he sees Rondo as being better than any of the points in this draft.

[Guest George's Box]

All this talk about Rondo makes me wonder if Danny Ainge has a great idea for a remake of McHale's Navy starring Kevin McHale.

[Brett Favre 0]

I wouldn't look into the Mock Drafts right now. Most of them just have them in order of player rankings. And workouts have yet to take place.

[Ripper 0]

I think the Cetlics would be insane to take a point. Rondo is obviously the guy that should be running the show there.

 

They need a defenseive pressence inside. Hell, they can trade that pick and go after Tiago Splitter no offense but solid on defense ass.

[Guest]

I can't believe that nobody has mentioned this current ESPN whirlwind of fucking LIES about Kobe Bryant trade demands.

[Boon 0]

I would be pretty surprised if the Cs kept the #5 pick- Wyc & Ainge came out the day after the lottery and talked about how displeased they were and they'd be shopping it around aggressively. It wouldn't be the worst idea to keep it; they've drafted well, but Rip's right- Rondo's the guy, and they need defense badly.

[Boon 0]

I can't believe that nobody has mentioned this current ESPN whirlwind of fucking LIES about Kobe Bryant trade demands.

 

The story lines that have engulfed the Los Angeles Lakers in the last week hit a crescendo Wednesday when Kobe Bryant said he would welcome a trade.

 

"I would like to be traded, yeah," Bryant said on 1050 ESPN Radio in New York. "Tough as it is to come to that conclusion there's no other alternative, you know?"

 

Bryant, interviewed by Stephen A. Smith, was asked if there was anything the Lakers could do to change his mind?

 

"No," Bryan said. "I just want them to do the right thing."

 

Earlier in the day, Bryant said team owner Jerry Buss masterminded the trade of Shaquille O'Neal -- and Shaq later confirming Kobe's account.

 

The issues between Bryant and the Lakers have reached a boil, beginning with Bryant voicing his displeasure with the club's direction, his suggestion that Jerry West should return to fix things, West's statement that he has no intention of undermining GM/good friend Mitch Kupchak, and, unrelated but bizarre in its timing, Buss' arrest early Tuesday for investigation of driving under the influence of alcohol.

Bryant was left "beyond furious" by a report in Tuesday's Los Angeles Times that read, "as a Lakers insider notes, it was Bryant's insistence on getting away from Shaquille O'Neal that got them in this mess."

 

O'Neal was traded to the Miami Heat after the 2003-04 season, and the long-held belief has been that the deteriorating relationship between O'Neal and Bryant was a factor in O'Neal's departure.

 

In response to the Times' story, Bryant, interviewed by Smith for a Philadelphia Inquirer column, said Buss "called a meeting with me after he spoke with Jim Gray [of ESPN] to talk with him about Shaq's future in the middle of the 2004 season.

 

"He met with me at the Four Seasons Hotel here [in Los Angeles] across from Fashion Island, which is now the Island Hotel," Bryant told Smith. "I went up to his penthouse suite. [buss] looks me dead in the face and says: 'Kobe, I am not going to re-sign Shaq. I am not about to pay him $30 million a year or $80 million over three years. No way in hell. I feel like he's getting older. His body is breaking down, and I don't want to pay that money to him when I can get value for him right now rather than wait.

 

"This is my decision. It's independent of you. My mind is made up. It doesn't matter to me what you do in free agency because I do not want to pay [shaq], period.' "

 

"Dr. Buss said that," Bryant told Smith. "And I haven't said anything for years because I've always felt like folks were just looking to create controversy. Now I know. I realize what extent [the Lakers] will go to, to cover themselves."

 

Reached afterward, O'Neal told Smith that be believed his former teammate beyond reproach.

"I believe Kobe 100 percent," O'Neal said when reached in Los Angeles. "Absolutely. There's no doubt in my mind Kobe is telling the truth. I believe him a thousand percent.

 

"I would have respected Dr. Buss more as a man if he would have told me that himself, because I know he said it. But he didn't [tell me]. He never said a damn word to me."

 

Buss was unavailable for comment Tuesday, as was Kupchak. Buss, 74, was booked early Tuesday for investigation of drunken driving and driving with a blood alcohol content of 0.08 or above.

 

The Lakers missed the playoffs in the first season after O'Neal was dealt for Lamar Odom, Caron Butler, Brian Grant, and a first-round pick, and have been eliminated in the first round the last two seasons. O'Neal and the Heat won the NBA championship last season.

 

"Sure, Shaq and I had our issues," Bryant told Smith. "So what! We always did and we won three titles. That doesn't change what was told to me. It doesn't change the fact I never, ever, said to get rid of him."

 

While Bryant re-signed for $136 million for seven years the day after O'Neal was traded, he has pushed for trades -- he wanted Carlos Boozer, then Jason Kidd, then Ron Artest -- that the Lakers were unable to pull off. Meanwhile, Odom has undergone shoulder surgery but is expected to be ready for training camp in October, Kwame Brown has undergone reconstructive surgery on his left ankle and might not be ready for the start of camp.

 

And now Bryant, who reportedly has made it clear to the Lakers that he may see fit to terminate his contract in two years, told Smith he wouldn't continue to wait for Buss to build the roster around him.

 

"Promises made to make this team better have not been kept," Bryant told Smith. "So where does that leave me?"

[Cheech Tremendous 0]

That pretty much seals it right there. He's as good as gone.

 

I've never much cared for Bryant, but I think he's handled this situation well. He took the fall for all the Shaq stuff and the construction of the team since. If it's really not his fault, he has every right to be outraged.

[JohnnyBlaze 0]

That pretty much seals it right there. He's as good as gone.

 

I've never much cared for Bryant, but I think he's handled this situation well. He took the fall for all the Shaq stuff and the construction of the team since. If it's really not his fault, he has every right to be outraged.

 

Nothing like going to ESPN.com and seeing "Kobe: Trade Me" as the headline. Great stuff. I'm going to start a thread for Kobe trade talk if that makes sense with everyone else.

[Failed Bridge 0]

Bulls seem to be the only team I could think of that could make a deal for him. They have a fairly high draft pick and some good young movable pieces and are in need of a good scorer.

[alfdogg 0]

The Grizzlies have reportedly come to terms with Marc Iavaroni to be their new head coach, with the announcement to be made tommorrow.

[Cheech Tremendous 0]

Billy Donovan has been offered the head coaching position with the Orlando Magic. The contract offer is 6 years/$36 million and sources seem to indicate that he will accept before the end of the week.

 

Good or bad decision?

[Ripper 0]

Bad. To many experienced proven coaches out there than to give that much money to a upproven college coach.

[Cheech Tremendous 0]

Jim O'Brien is the new head coach of the Indiana Pacers.

[iggymcfly 0]

Billy Donovan is retarded. He had the best job in college basketball and he gives it up for a rebuilding project that shows no signs of contending in the near future? I could see if he got some great offer, say to coach Oden in Portland or to coach Cleveland if they ever realize that Mike Brown's retarded, but I don't see why he'd take a job with such a low probability of success when he could be a legend in Gainesville.

[Guest]

36 million. Tell me that you would turn that shit down.

[Fökai 0]

Orlando has Grant Hill possibly retiring or returning for cheap and $8 million in player options, which could add up to a lot of cap room. Imagine the Magic adding Rashard Lewis, Gerald Wallace or Mo Williams? They may not be contenders now, but they can hold their own in the Southeast. And with three picks in the draft (all 2nd round), a few of them are bound to replace the scrubs they have on the bench.

 

With a franchise player in Howard, it won't take long for them to "rebuild". And now with a $27.5 million commitment to a head coach, I'd have to guess that they will act quickly to surround Donovan with talent.

[Precious Roy 0]

Billy Donovan is retarded. He had the best job in college basketball and he gives it up for a rebuilding project that shows no signs of contending in the near future? I could see if he got some great offer, say to coach Oden in Portland or to coach Cleveland if they ever realize that Mike Brown's retarded, but I don't see why he'd take a job with such a low probability of success when he could be a legend in Gainesville.

 

1) They were in the playoffs this year, have some promising young players and a potentially dominant young big, and have the cap room to add an all-star caliber player. They're a developing young team, not a rebuilding project.

 

2) Donovan doesn't have to uproot his family, which I'm sure is part of what attracted him to the job

 

3) He's already a legend at UF

[iggymcfly 0]

They only made the playoffs because the Eastern conference was way down this year. They finished the regular season with a losing record and then they were completely noncompetive against Detroit. And that was with Grant Hill staying healthy enough to play 65 games which probably has about a 5% chance of repeating itself next year. The Magic right now are just good enough to sneak into the playoffs every other year, but I can't see them contending for a championship in the next five years barring a huge trade or free agent signing.

 

Again, it's just not worth it, for something that has such a huge risk of failure considering the program he had built at UF. Maybe three years down the line, Riley will get sick of coaching again and the Miami job will come open. That's the kind of job that would be worth leaving a sure thing for with Dwayne Wade entering his prime and the end of Shaq's contract freeing up a ton of cap room. Orlando kind of seems stuck in no-man's land though where they'll always be decent, but never be great.

[Guest George's Box]

I'm completely unenthused by the college game, so I don't really give a flying fuck what Billy Donovan does, but what he'll probably do is make a big splash in the offseason, aimlessly sputter around for two years, then quit or get fired when he realizes he's in over his head. That's usually how it works for these guys.

[Fökai 0]

They only made the playoffs because the Eastern conference was way down this year. They finished the regular season with a losing record and then they were completely noncompetive against Detroit.

Once again, their most expensive player, one who struggled to stay healthy, is now off the books. With his injury history, a cheap offer by Orlando would be enough to nab him if he doesn't retire. That's already enough cash to sign any of the three aforementioned players, most importantly Rashard Lewis. Not to mention Dooling possibly opting out, the Magic not being sure on what to do with Darko and moving any of the point guards to draft a new one.

 

Again, you don't have to rebuild if you have a superstar player and a bunch of cap room.

 

Again, it's just not worth it, for something that has such a huge risk of failure considering the program he had built at UF. Maybe three years down the line, Riley will get sick of coaching again and the Miami job will come open. That's the kind of job that would be worth leaving a sure thing for with Dwayne Wade entering his prime and the end of Shaq's contract freeing up a ton of cap room. Orlando kind of seems stuck in no-man's land though where they'll always be decent, but never be great.

 

Why is Miami in three years a desirable job? They'll always be decent enough with Wade to never draft an impact player, will return each season with Antoine Walker and O'Neal on the books so they can't afford to bring in anybody decent, and he'll be constantly second-guessed in the media compared to Riley.

 

If you want to talk about a total rebuilding year, look at Miami in 2010 with Walker and Wade under contract. Hmm, three years down the line.

[iggymcfly 0]

Why is Miami such a desirable job.

 

To start with, they have the player who will in all likelihood be the 2nd best player in the league 3 years from now locked up through 2012 in D-Wade. The only thing weighing them down right is Shaq's giant contract that he's too old and out-of-shape to give anyone proper value on. Shaq's currently getting $20 million a year which was over 1/3 of Miami's payroll last season. Take Shaq off the team and the Heat have more cap room than anyone in the league except for Charlotte. In 2010, when that contract finally expires, it seems extremely likely that the Heat will be able to get a big free agent signing with an elite player being able to enjoy the warm weather and the chance to win a championship alongside D-Wade. So yes, I think that would be an excellent coaching opportunity.

[Fökai 0]

Except that DWIGHT HOWARD is playing on the Magic right now.

 

Why pass up the opportunity to coach the Magic, who have a legitimate superstar and cap room to nab someone else of that level?

 

Why stay at Florida, the defending National Champions with 0 returning starters?

 

Why go to Miami, where their situation in 2010 could not possibly be any better than the 07-08 Magic?

[iggymcfly 0]

Basically, my point was that he should stay at Florida until he gets a ridiculously good offer because the situation there is so good. Yes, the Gators graduated their entire starting five, but coming off two national championships, Donovan could have his pick of any recruit in the country and he'd be practically guaranteed a Top-5 program for years to come. Once you get that kind of recognition with recruits, you've basically got it made, especially at a school like Florida with relatively loose academic standards and in a place where a lot of students would want to go anyway.

 

And no, I don't think Orlando's all that good of a job. Yes, you have Howard and Nelson, but you have no one else and I don't think Howard's ever going to be a first-team All-NBA type anyway. Off the top of my head, listing coaching jobs in order right now, I'd put all of the following ahead of Orlando:

 

Cleveland

Phoenix

Dallas

San Antonio

Denver

Houston

Utah

Chicago

Portland

Detroit

LA Lakers

Toronto

Seattle

 

So, basically, he's giving up the 2nd best college coaching job for the 14th best NBA job despite the fact that the last 6 or 7 coaches to go from college to the NBA have failed miserably and been fired or given up before the end of their first contract. Doesn't sound like such a great idea to me.

[Precious Roy 0]

Basically, my point was that he should stay at Florida until he gets a ridiculously good offer because the situation there is so good. Yes, the Gators graduated their entire starting five, but coming off two national championships, Donovan could have his pick of any recruit in the country and he'd be practically guaranteed a Top-5 program for years to come. Once you get that kind of recognition with recruits, you've basically got it made, especially at a school like Florida with relatively loose academic standards and in a place where a lot of students would want to go anyway.

 

And no, I don't think Orlando's all that good of a job. Yes, you have Howard and Nelson, but you have no one else and I don't think Howard's ever going to be a first-team All-NBA type anyway. Off the top of my head, listing coaching jobs in order right now, I'd put all of the following ahead of Orlando:

 

Cleveland

Phoenix

Dallas

San Antonio

Denver

Houston

Utah

Chicago

Portland

Detroit

LA Lakers

Toronto

Seattle

 

So, basically, he's giving up the 2nd best college coaching job for the 14th best NBA job despite the fact that the last 6 or 7 coaches to go from college to the NBA have failed miserably and been fired or given up before the end of their first contract. Doesn't sound like such a great idea to me.

 

 

And how many of those jobs are available? And even if jobs like Dallas, San Antonio, Phoenix, LA, Chicago, Cleveland etc. became available, do you think they'd hire a college guy before someone with meaningful NBA experience as a player or coach? Why are you acting like he can just pick and choose from any job he wants?

 

Donovan spent a decade building up the Florida program and it's not going to get any better than back to back championships. Maybe he'd rather leave while on top than to take on the task of rebuilding the program. Maybe he feels like he's accomplished everything he set out to do there and wants a new challenge. He's getting a lot of money, staying in Florida, and inheriting a young team with upside in both talent and financially, reasonably low expectations and the chance to make some noise in the next couple years. What is 'retarded' about that? Even if he struggles and decides the NBA isn't for him (and I think he's got the makeup to do well and is in a good situation) he's still going to be looked at as an A+ hire for nearly every college program in the country. I don't get how anyone can knock the guy for that.

[Slayer 0]

So he went from "I want to elevate Florida into a program that can be mentioned in the same sentence as Kentucky, UNC and Duke" to "I've done everything I can here... Bye!"

 

I agree with Czech's statement earlier... he'll be back in college by the end of the decade

[Guest George's Box]

The sports world could only be improved by more people not paying so much attention to goddamned college basketball. It's the manager of the Toledo Mud Hens managing the Indians. That's all it is.

[Ripper 0]

I need to clarify, its a great move by Donovan, not so great move by the Magic.

 

There were better coaches to be had. But Billy had nowhere to go but down after the last two years in Florida. And trust me, at the end of year 3 when he has a mediocre team instead of a championship team, there would have been rumblings in florida. I would much rather have rumblings about my job at 6 million a year.

[Just John 0]

Off the top of my head, listing coaching jobs in order right now, I'd put all of the following ahead of Orlando:

 

Cleveland

Phoenix

Dallas

San Antonio

Denver

Houston

Utah

Chicago

Portland

Detroit

LA Lakers

Toronto

Seattle

 

So, basically, he's giving up the 2nd best college coaching job for the 14th best NBA job despite the fact that the last 6 or 7 coaches to go from college to the NBA have failed miserably and been fired or given up before the end of their first contract. Doesn't sound like such a great idea to me.

 

Wait, what? At least 11 of those 13 teams are currently set on coaches. Not sure about Seattle and Detroit may be looking this offseason, but I don't see either taking a stab at Donovan. NBA coaching isn't like McDonalds or Best Buy where you go turn in an application and maybe they'll call you back for a job. He doesn't exactly get to pick which teams have openings.

 

And if he doesn't improve the Magic, or "fails miserably and gets fired," he gets to collect 36 million dollars on his way out the door and a D1 college team will pick him up in heartbeat. Remember Steve Spurrier's stint in the NFL?

 

Basically, the worst thing that can happen to him is he ends up in the exact situation he is now in 2 years, only 36 million dollars richer. I don't see where the bad decision is.