Tim Donoghy airs NBA dirty laundry

[Agent_Bond34 0]

Isn't the whole "My referees are incorruptible and I'll fine anyone who says otherwise" gung-ho attitude exactly what allowed Donaghy to do what he did and get away with it as long as he did?

 

I would think so, because of this.

 

He probably wanted to keep it all tight-lipped and swept under the rug, and judging by his actions regarding this whole thing, it really seems like it.

 

This whole thing is without question David Stern's worst nightmare and fear come to life.

 

I have a feeling that there's more to this whole story.

[Nightwing 0]

Its not stupid. You have dozens of NBA former NBA officials that have felt completely screwed over by the league, sued them for firing them and such. But not a SINGLE one of them has EVER said anything close to this. The only one that has said anything along these terms happens to be going to prison for fixing games for the mob because of his gambling debts.

 

Just a little strange to me.

 

Are you joking? A disenchanted referee making claims of fixing would be less heard than the current Donaghy stuff. You'd dismiss it like you're dismissing Donaghy's claims as "them having an axe to grind". The assurance we have of people listening and at least some possibility of truthfulness with Donaghy is that he actually got caught in an FBI Investigation. Not only that, but the possible legal ramifications against them would be there as well: If they were involved in fixing games, they could go to jail even if they were following orders.

 

So I ask you: Do you really think they were so angry that they'd risk going to jail themselves for charges that might never manifest into anything meaningful?

[Ripper 0]

I ask you, you think that it is more likely for the NBA, its league officials, David stern and all the refs to risk serious criminal charges and never making another penny in their lives off of basketball, thus throwing away hundreds of millions of dollars forever so that they can get a boost in ratings than it is to believe that the guy that was FIXING GAMES FOR THE MOB AND BETTING ON THEM might be lying so he doens't have to go to jail or just because he wants to screw over the league?

 

We aren't talking about a group of retards here. We are talking about smart business men that would not sacrifice billions of long term dollars for millions of short term dollars. That is just beyond insane to believe. ESPECIALLY when we have exactly ONE guy saying they did it. There are DOZENS of officials with series axes to grind against the NBA. There is a million dollar book deal and immunity and historical fame if you would out the NBA for its practices. Yet NO ONE else except the game fixing criminal has decided to do it.

 

No, that doesnt sound realistic to me.

[Mike wanna be 0]

Anybody who stepped forward would have been putting their own ass on the line for fraud and their career would be over regardless of the legal outcome.

 

It's logical that the only guy who would put his ass on said line is the one who's already on the line and already has his basketball career over.

[Nightwing 0]

I ask you, you think that it is more likely for the NBA, its league officials, David stern and all the refs to risk serious criminal charges and never making another penny in their lives off of basketball, thus throwing away hundreds of millions of dollars forever so that they can get a boost in ratings than it is to believe that the guy that was FIXING GAMES FOR THE MOB AND BETTING ON THEM might be lying so he doens't have to go to jail or just because he wants to screw over the league?

 

1) It doesn't need to be the whole league, or even all the refs.

 

2) Is it worth millions of dollars? Maybe. Before Donaghy, did we believe that a ref would honestly attempt to fix games in this day and age? With millions of dollars and the well-being of the league, why not drag out one game, one series a little longer? You have this idea that it's all fixed, like wrestling or something, but it doesn't have to be. Lengthen one series here and there, get the right teams in the right places, and you don't have to fix every game to reap the benefits.

 

3) You can try playing the "He's a felon!" as much as you want, but you are honestly going to tell me that a guy who is going to serve less than three years of prison time will try and get some of that off at the risk of spending double or even triple that? His life could be fine if he just moved on, but no, he's going to make outrageous claims and get put into jail longer? That doesn't make sense. Just because he's a felon doesn't mean he's automatically lying. If anything, being under the microscope and having the threat of more time if he is lying about this stuff makes me believe him more. Let's not act like he has nothing to lose here; he's not that old, and the Feds can certainly tack on a lot more time if he's just trying to be vengeful.

 

We aren't talking about a group of retards here. We are talking about smart business men that would not sacrifice billions of long term dollars for millions of short term dollars. That is just beyond insane to believe. ESPECIALLY when we have exactly ONE guy saying they did it. There are DOZENS of officials with series axes to grind against the NBA. There is a million dollar book deal and immunity and historical fame if you would out the NBA for its practices. Yet NO ONE else except the game fixing criminal has decided to do it.

 

Not all criminals are retards, and with the amount of money to be made, why not? It's not like we haven't seen owner scandals before.

 

The million dollar book and immunity only if it works. If it doesn't (And remember, we are talking about guys you can discredit for having an "axe to grind" against the league), they're screwed and their life is over. Heck, it's still probably over due to the massive amounts of fraud involved. They just don't "hand out" immunity on a whim. If you think someone is going to put everything they know on the line over some bitterness, you are crazy.

 

We only had one guy talking about Steroids in baseball, and look where that led us. Is it that unbelievable that if one guy did it, others could? At the very least, you can't dismiss this out-of-hand. I'm not saying that we have to take it as gospel, but we've certainly seen enough that it holds some water.

[Guest Epic Narcissism]

Yeah, I don't think this guy is going to lie to the feds at this point. Some of you people, examine yourselves here. You're ready to dismiss him so quickly?

[EVIL~! alkeiper 0]

Yeah, I don't think this guy is going to lie to the feds at this point. Some of you people, examine yourselves here. You're ready to dismiss him so quickly?

I am. I mean, why mouth off now? What does he have to gain by exposure, versus what he has to gain by keeping his mouth shut? Is he doing it for the good of the NBA?

 

I think the smart analysis is that you really need corroboration before you take anything seriously. He is not credible in my eyes.

[Nightwing 0]

Yeah, I don't think this guy is going to lie to the feds at this point. Some of you people, examine yourselves here. You're ready to dismiss him so quickly?

I am. I mean, why mouth off now? What does he have to gain by exposure, versus what he has to gain by keeping his mouth shut? Is he doing it for the good of the NBA?

 

I think the smart analysis is that you really need corroboration before you take anything seriously. He is not credible in my eyes.

 

Point in case, this isn't something that is new as in, "He just started saying this!", but rather this is something that he already told the feds a while ago, and revealed it due to the $1,000,000 bill that the NBA recently stuck him with. This would have eventually come out sooner or later, Donaghy just seemed content to not talk about it until the NBA actually did something.

 

On corroboration, we'll have to wait and see the evidence, and I agree at not completely trusting him. I'm not saying that he's completely believable, but lying would hurt him ten times worse than it would help him at this point and that fact should be taken into account. It's hard to just say "Nope, not going to believe it" with the stuff we are seeing right now.

[Guest Epic Narcissism]

I don't know. I'm ready to hear this guy out: the alternative is taking the word of the National Basketball Association at face value. Yeah, guys, do that.

[Ripper 0]

Yeah, I don't think this guy is going to lie to the feds at this point. Some of you people, examine yourselves here. You're ready to dismiss him so quickly?

I am. I mean, why mouth off now? What does he have to gain by exposure, versus what he has to gain by keeping his mouth shut? Is he doing it for the good of the NBA?

 

I think the smart analysis is that you really need corroboration before you take anything seriously. He is not credible in my eyes.

 

Point in case, this isn't something that is new as in, "He just started saying this!", but rather this is something that he already told the feds a while ago, and revealed it due to the $1,000,000 bill that the NBA recently stuck him with. This would have eventually come out sooner or later, Donaghy just seemed content to not talk about it until the NBA actually did something.

 

On corroboration, we'll have to wait and see the evidence, and I agree at not completely trusting him. I'm not saying that he's completely believable, but lying would hurt him ten times worse than it would help him at this point and that fact should be taken into account. It's hard to just say "Nope, not going to believe it" with the stuff we are seeing right now.

 

How is it going to hurt him more? He is going to jail. He claimed that the NBA is doing things that he can't prove and is only his word. There will be no perjury unless they can prove he is lying (and they won't be able to prove it either way) thus all he is getting is more publicity and he gets his upcoming book all the more "juicy".

 

Until someone can explain to me how the Spurs/Pistons series happened, I am not going to buy the NBA CONSPIRACY theories. What the hell was SO important about the Lakers/Sacramento series that they would risk LITERALLY EVERYTHING to make that game happen. And I mean EVERYTHING. Their entire professional and for a while personal lives out the window so that they could add ONE freaking game to ONE freakin series.

 

Because unless you are saying that this was a common occurance, this is what you are saying. That the NBA league officials risked the fate of a BILLION dollar industry so that they could get one game. That is beyond silly to me.

 

Hell, I think we are dealing with human nature here and in game calls can get wonky sometimes, but we aren't dealing with some grand conspiracy called down from the league office to officials.

 

What does Tim D have to gain? He is a asshole who hated his coworkers (even got into a fist fight with one before) and now is pointing out refs he knew were company men that were fixing games. He is trying to destroy their careers just because he is a fucking dick and he can sell more books.

 

[Ripper 0]

Um....

 

<-------

 

LOOK AT THE TITTIES!!!

 

 

 

[Nightwing 0]

Just because he's going to prison doesn't mean it couldn't be worse. There is a difference between less than three years and more than 5 years. You can't tell me that he's going to make baseless lies so he can be in prison for a decade when he could just stay fucking quiet and get out in 2 years. That doesn't make sense on any level.

 

While sensationalism might help his eventual book, putting out baseless claims that completely discredit him will not. Making a lot of blatant lies that get turned over later won't help him, nor will the eventual libel/slander suits when it comes to the profits.

 

Until someone can explain to me how the Spurs/Pistons series happened, I am not going to buy the NBA CONSPIRACY theories.

 

Why not try it? The Pistons are in a large enough market, and other teams were on the downswing. IF they did rig this, maybe they wanted to see if the market would react favorably to two dominant teams rather than showing off big star players. With the Piston's popularity at the time, it might be worth a shot. Hell, maybe they just wanted to get the most out of the best matchups of the playoffs; extending big-series to 7 games when they had the chance.

 

If you want to see unwatchable, check out the Stanley Cup Finals from 2003 to 2006. San Antonio vs. Detroit has a better ring to it than Calgary versus Tampa Bay.

 

What the hell was SO important about the Lakers/Sacramento series that they would risk LITERALLY EVERYTHING to make that game happen. And I mean EVERYTHING. Their entire professional and for a while personal lives out the window so that they could add ONE freaking game to ONE freakin series.

 

Oh Christ, stop the over-acting.

 

What's so important about Sacramento/Los Angeles? You can't be serious. They'd started to form a pretty heated (if one-sided) rivalry since 2000. Getting the most you can out of a close and action-packed series would certainly boost ratings and hype up the Finals. You can't tell me that you don't believe that the NBA wouldn't have a vested interest in getting a 7 game series out of that one.

 

If anything, this is the perfect series to try and risk it. And if they did, they got away with one of the most blatant fixes ever, didn't they? No one of any real credibility accused them of a fix, and they got exactly what they wanted. If anything, it showed how little they had to risk, since no one would ever consider that the NBA fixed the game. Like this one, it'd just go down as "One of the worst-officiated games ever". We've seen a history of absolutely horrible officiating in the NBA Playoffs; maybe there is something to it. At the very least, it is worth looking into.

 

Because unless you are saying that this was a common occurance, this is what you are saying. That the NBA league officials risked the fate of a BILLION dollar industry so that they could get one game. That is beyond silly to me.

 

Did you read my previous post? It doesn't need to be that common, just strategic. And again, if it's true, how much risk do you think was there if they got away with Game 6 like they did? If you can get away with that, there's little to no risk. Donaghy getting caught by the Feds (something that had no real direct involvement with the NBA) was more just a bad break than anyone actually investigating the NBA.

Hell, I think we are dealing with human nature here and in game calls can get wonky sometimes, but we aren't dealing with some grand conspiracy called down from the league office to officials.

 

It doesn't need to be the entire NBA; it'd be stupid if everyone were in on it. But select people and select referees in select games? Sure. You don't need to control everything or even the eventual outcomes of series (If the Kings had come out of that Game 7, I'm sure that the NBA would have been just as happy, as they could talk about Sacramento finally kicking the Laker Playoff monkey), you just need to get the most out of things. If that means pushing a series to a Game 7 that shouldn't have happened, that's what you can do.

 

What does Tim D have to gain? He is a asshole who hated his coworkers (even got into a fist fight with one before) and now is pointing out refs he knew were company men that were fixing games. He is trying to destroy their careers just because he is a fucking dick and he can sell more books.

 

Wow, you just described Jose Canseco. Didn't people say he was doing the exact same thing?

[Ripper 0]

Your justification for the Pistons/Spurs series just tells me how insane believing that league officals called refs to tell them to fix a game.

 

On on hand you have the Spurs, a proven non draw in the finals and the Pistons, who won the year before and not to great ratings.

 

On the other you have a 62 win Suns team that happened to have the MVP in Steve Nash and had the most watched games in the playoffs, and the team in the East with the most watched games in the playoffs, who happened to have superstar Dwayne Wade and the runner up to the MVP race.

 

So the NBA fixed it so that they could have one big rating game in the Laker/Sacramento series, but not for a series that honestly would have demolished the ratings of that series. That makes NO sense.

 

Its just plain dumb to think the league officials told these guys to fix a game. Even if you believe the game was fixed, the goddamn LEAGUE isn't going to throw away their entire existance to do it. "Why not?" The league was just then gaining back relevance after the strike took alot of it away. They would have been fucking morons to fix a game, get exposed as having a rigged league, and losing their fanbase for a LONG fucking time.

 

I need to repeat this because I don't think it is sinking in. You are suggesting that the NBA League offices risked a multi BILLION dollar industry so that they could get some extra ratings for the Kings Lakers game. Thats like shooting yourself in the neck because there might be a cute nurse on duty that night. Its a incredibly stupid plan.

 

There are plenty of other cases where there was bad officiating in a NBA game. The reason he picked this game is because it was well known.

 

And no I didn't describe Jose Canseco. When he was writing his book, he was saying players were taking steroids to try and get better. This A: Was no suprise to anyone and B: completely believeable.

 

Now if he said that MLB sent in representatives where the team would line up and be given a shot of Anabolic Steroids so the league would look better, then I would have called bullshit. And that is still more believeable than someone in charge in the NBA calling refs and saying "fix the game". Let alone the refs agreeing to do it.

[Nightwing 0]

Your justification for the Pistons/Spurs series just tells me how insane believing that league officals called refs to tell them to fix a game.

 

On on hand you have the Spurs, a proven non draw in the finals and the Pistons, who won the year before and not to great ratings.

 

On the other you have a 62 win Suns team that happened to have the MVP in Steve Nash and had the most watched games in the playoffs, and the team in the East with the most watched games in the playoffs, who happened to have superstar Dwayne Wade and the runner up to the MVP race.

 

So the NBA fixed it so that they could have one big rating game in the Laker/Sacramento series, but not for a series that honestly would have demolished the ratings of that series. That makes NO sense.

 

Oh Jesus, look at the next year. Just because they tried it once doesn't mean that no game could ever, EVER be fixed again. Hell, I didn't even suggest that they fixed ever game or fixed who the champion was. If you actually read what I posted and didn't freak out like you are, you'll note that I didn't say that they may not even have picked the overall series winners; they may have just focused on lengthening series. Their ratings have never really recovered from the loss of Jordan, and maybe he was trying to try different options. I'm sorry, I'm not David Stern and I don't know what he does. Neither do you; what makes sense to us might not make sense to Stern since he has better information than we do. Maybe he was trying to get two squeaky clean teams in after all the player troubles and bad reputation the NBA had started to gain. Who knows what David Stern was thinking if he even was.

 

Also, reality check on the ratings: The ratings for the Pistons/Laker series were great. They were the most consistently high since 2001, and the second only to 2001 for series in this millennium (Barring the current series). And by the by? The Heat didn't do that much better than the 2005 NBA Finals.

 

Its just plain dumb to think the league officials told these guys to fix a game. Even if you believe the game was fixed, the goddamn LEAGUE isn't going to throw away their entire existance to do it. "Why not?" The league was just then gaining back relevance after the strike took alot of it away. They would have been fucking morons to fix a game, get exposed as having a rigged league, and losing their fanbase for a LONG fucking time.

 

They didn't throw their existence away on it, did they? No one accused them of fixing that game. Maybe they were banking on that, or maybe they knew that they were safe from such accusations. You keep saying "THEY WERE RISKING IT ALL!", but in reality no one knew a thing until Donaghy got picked up by accident.

 

I need to repeat this because I don't think it is sinking in. You are suggesting that the NBA League offices risked a multi BILLION dollar industry so that they could get some extra ratings for the Kings Lakers game. Thats like shooting yourself in the neck because there might be a cute nurse on duty that night. Its a incredibly stupid plan.

 

Oh shut the hell up about this. If this were true, we'd have no security frauds, no Enrons, no anything. Why would Michael Vick throw away his career on dog fighting or big baseball players take steroids?

 

Because they want to or they feel they need to. Maybe Stern wanted a bigger profit-margin, or maybe he wanted to try and shove San Antonio down our throats and try to make it the basketball equivalent of Green Bay (A small market team that has a ridiculously dedicated following). Maybe he felt that it was necessary to stretch out some series to get better exposure for the league. Who knows; I'm sure if Stern did it, it was either for money or what he felt was best for the league. Just because we don't understand why people with so much power would readily risk it doesn't mean that they never do; the amount of corporate scandals seem to indicate otherwise.

 

There are plenty of other cases where there was bad officiating in a NBA game. The reason he picked this game is because it was well known.

 

So there is absolutely no way that game could possibly have been fixed, right? You know it because you know the referees and you know David Stern and he is just a stand-up guy, right? Or are you just a fan who loves the sport? We don't know if more were mentioned, these were just the first two instances that he mentioned of the NBA fixing the games. Maybe there is more, and we'll have to wait and see if the Feds actually have anything.

 

And no I didn't describe Jose Canseco. When he was writing his book, he was saying players were taking steroids to try and get better. This A: Was no suprise to anyone and B: completely believeable.

 

It's obviously not completely believable for refs to fix a game because no one has ever done that, right? I mean, we aren't in that situation now, right?

 

And you DID describe Canseco: A self-concerned douchebag. Just because someone is a douche doesn't mean they aren't telling the truth. Especially when they are self-concerned and don't want more prison time.

 

Now if he said that MLB sent in representatives where the team would line up and be given a shot of Anabolic Steroids so the league would look better, then I would have called bullshit. And that is still more believeable than someone in charge in the NBA calling refs and saying "fix the game". Let alone the refs agreeing to do it.

 

But the league basically condoned it silently by doing nothing.

 

And you keep saying it's "more believable" when we've seen game fixing already occur. Donaghy never says he saw Stern telling the refs to give a "Code Red", but he said they were company men. Maybe they acted on their own in what they felt the best interests of the NBA were. Since we've already seen one "rogue referee" do what he needed to do, would it be out of the question for two more to do such a thing? Are referees really that incorruptible to you?

 

I feel like I'm portraying myself as a conspiracy theorist, but I'm really not. I'm not even fully trusting of what Donaghy has to say. But this swallowing of whatever David Stern seems to say without any more questions is ridiculous: We just had a referee admit to fixing games across multiple seasons. Is it that hard to believe that more could have done it, with or without NBA approval?

[C Dubya 04 0]

Really, I think that I most agree with what seems to be Simmons' take on the whole thing. I don't think that there was ever communication to officials, but I think that the NBA does find a way to get their worst officials calling the biggest games where there is a desired outcome. The bad officials are most likely to get caught up in the game, which then tends to benefit the home team in particular (and to a lesser extent, the better story/more exciting team).

 

 

[Guest Vitamin X]

OH HO HO AND THE PLOT THICKENS!

 

Federal agents asking questions about Bavetta

By Chris Sheridan

ESPN.com

 

LOS ANGELES -- Two former NBA referees told ESPN on Thursday that federal investigators had questioned them about referee Dick Bavetta while conducting their probe into Tim Donaghy.

 

Former referee Hue Hollins said Thursday on ESPN's Outside The Lines that federal investigators "questioned me about Dick Bavetta more than they did about Tim Donaghy."

 

"They wanted to know what I knew about Dick Bavetta in terms of holding calls, making sure this team wins, that team wins. I said 'I never heard of that, and I didn't know anything about it,' " Hollins said. "When they called to interview me, I was again caught by surprise they asked so many questions about Bavetta. I didn't know where they were going with that."

 

Another ex-referee, who spoke to ESPN.com on the condition he not be identified, said federal investigators asked him about specific games that Bavetta refereed and whether he had noticed anything peculiar about Bavetta's actions.

 

Former referee Mike Mathis told ESPN.com that he had been questioned by the FBI but was not asked about Bavetta. Also, ex-referee Blaine Reichelt said he had not been contacted by any law enforcement authorities, and ex-referee Ted Bernhardt said he had only been questioned by NBA security officials.

 

A request by ESPN.com to interview Bavetta was denied Thursday by the NBA, as was a request to view the officials' post-game report from Game 6 of the 2002 Western Conference finals -- a game Donaghy has alleged was refereed unfairly to ensure that the Lakers and Kings would meet in a Game 7.

 

Bavetta, Bob Delaney and Bernhardt were the three referees who worked that game, and Delaney told ESPN on Wednesday that he has never been contacted by NBA or federal investigators concerning Donaghy's allegation that two referees in that game intended to assure that series went seven games.

 

Bernhardt, reached Thursday by ESPN.com, recalled the aftermath of Game 6 in 2002.

 

"I only talked to [former supervisor of officials] Ed Rush after the game, and I said I wasn't happy about it. He asked why, and I said I didn't feel we were very good."

 

"But I stand by my calls in that game. I was right on," Bernhardt said. "I believe in Dick Bavetta, and I believe in Bob Delaney, and I believe in the NBA for that matter. I'm also afraid that if Tim Donaghy is proven wrong, he's going to end up having to serve more time. I feel sorry for his kids. It's just a terrible situation all around," Bernhardt said.

 

NBA commissioner David Stern was asked Tuesday night by ESPN.com whether he was aware of any ongoing investigations of other referees: His response: "I'm going to repeat the question because I want everyone to hear it: Are we aware of any open investigations by the government? Only possibly of Mr. Donaghy, nothing else."

 

Bavetta officiated Game 1 of the NBA Finals in Boston, and it is unknown whether he is scheduled to work any more games this postseason. The NBA does not release its referee assignments until the morning of a game day.

 

During a lengthy interview with ESPN.com early in 2006, Bavetta bristled at a question that cited detractors' criticisms of him, including his officiating in Game 6 of the Lakers-Kings series, and he declined to answer on the record.

 

The NBA, in turning down ESPN.com's request to interview Bavetta, did not explain the reasoning behind its decision, which in effect deprived Bavetta an opportunity to defend himself against Donaghy's latest allegations.

 

Hollins told The New York Times, in a story published Thursday, that investigators asked if he ever noticed that Bavetta "was making sure that the home team would win, and I told them I had no idea because I didn't work with him a lot."

 

Lemell McMorris, president of the referee's union, declined comment, and FBI spokesman Steve Kodak said the U.S. Justice Dept. never comments regarding any kind of ongoing investigation.

 

If Donaghy somehow ends up taking down Dick Vendetta with him, I can't say this could turn out too bad at all.

[bobobrazil1984 0]

I just saw that right now at work and I couldn't stop laughing at the (remote) thought of Dick Bavetta getting nailed somehow.

 

You know whats funny, I was just reading some article on ESPN, some columnist saying something like "you know something's wrong in the NBA when we're in the middle of a huge ref credibility crisis... and one of the refs of an NBA FINALS GAME, is a ref who got suspended for corrupt refereeing owing to personal grudges, and for tax reasons."

 

Now Dick Bavetta it comes out was being questioned by the FBI... and hey look he just reffed an NBA Finals Game too.

 

Does it bother ANYONE that after Game 2, seeing the FT discrepency there, we all immediately knew that Game 3 was going to have a huge FT discrepency for the Lakers? I mean we all KNEW it was going to happen and it's the damn finals.

 

Even if everything Donoghy says is made up and it very well might be... there is something rotten going on in the ref house. Its like the Bush administration, you honestly cant tell if its just incompetence or corruption.

[The Niggardly King 0]

I'm more interested in the draft lottery conspiracies and what with trying to make Cleveland into a big market and making damn sure they did everything to give them the #1 pick, along with the Heat/Mavericks where it became Dwayne free throw practice.

[Mike wanna be 0]

Cleveland to a big market is a conspiracy, yet no mention of the Frozen Envelope, the back-to-back #1s for Orlando, or even wild reaching for the Toronto "Please save basketball in Canada" or this year's Bulls wins? Bad form, MBC.

[The Niggardly King 0]

I always seem to forget the Orlando and Toronto conspiracies.

[randomguy 0]

Stern outright saying "fix the game" seems improbably.

 

On the other hand "I noticed you guys weren't calling many fouls on the Kings, and gee it sure would be nice if the series went to 7" is pretty believable.

[Guest Epic Narcissism]

Cleveland to a big market is a conspiracy, yet no mention of . . . this year's Bulls wins?

If there was a conspiracy to improve the Chicago Bulls, it would've been nice for somebody to alert the Chicago Bulls.

[bobobrazil1984 0]

Stern outright saying "fix the game" seems improbably.

 

On the other hand "I noticed you guys weren't calling many fouls on the Kings, and gee it sure would be nice if the series went to 7" is pretty believable.

 

That's pretty much how I feel. There are way too many variables in basketball to "rig" it with any consistency, its very difficult.

 

Here is an interesting bit I read on ESPN.

 

Is the FBI investigating Donaghy's allegations? Will others be charged with crimes?

 

The FBI already has investigated the allegations. Donaghy first met with FBI agents in July 2007. A team of agents has been probing his stories ever since. As the result of their investigations, federal prosecutors have filed what is known as a 5(k) letter. The 5(k) letter means the agents have checked on the stories and have concluded Donaghy was truthful. The 5(k) letter does not apply to the 2002 Western Conference finals Game 6 because the statute of limitations had expired. More than five years went by before Donaghy described that game to any agents. There was no reason to look into that game because no one could be charged with a crime. The 5(k) letter does apply to statements Donaghy made to agents regarding the three games in 2005. The information could result in a reduction of Donaghy's prison sentence when Amon sentences him July 14. He faces a maximum of 33 months in prison under federal guidelines.

 

Although the FBI has concluded Donaghy was truthful, it does not mean others will be charged with crimes. Agents and prosecutors easily could have concluded that the rigging of the four games was reprehensible but did not qualify as a federal crime. There was no indication of gambling or money laundering or racketeering on the part of the NBA in Donaghy's allegations. If the NBA wants to extend a series to a seventh game, it might be fraud upon the fans, but it is not a federal crime.

[RepoMan 0]

Cleveland to a big market is a conspiracy, yet no mention of the Frozen Envelope, the back-to-back #1s for Orlando, or even wild reaching for the Toronto "Please save basketball in Canada" or this year's Bulls wins? Bad form, MBC.

 

I always thought Cleveland conviently won the lottery to save the franchise.

 

[Mike wanna be 0]

Cleveland to a big market is a conspiracy, yet no mention of the Frozen Envelope, the back-to-back #1s for Orlando, or even wild reaching for the Toronto "Please save basketball in Canada" or this year's Bulls wins? Bad form, MBC.

 

I always thought Cleveland conviently won the lottery to save the franchise.

They, surprisingly enough, tied for the worst record in basketball that year with Denver. Cleveland snagged #1 and Denver slipped to #3.

 

Leads one to wonder, though, if Denver gets James and Cleveland's got #2/3/4, do they take Wade, Anthony, Bosh, or everyone's favorite trivia answer and the Human Victory Cigar, Darko Milicic?

[alfdogg 0]

They would have taken Anthony at the time, most likely. Wade was a good player, led Marquette to a Final Four, but I don't know if anyone expected him to become a marquee player to the magnitude that he is now.

[bobobrazil1984 0]

Cleveland to a big market is a conspiracy, yet no mention of the Frozen Envelope, the back-to-back #1s for Orlando, or even wild reaching for the Toronto "Please save basketball in Canada" or this year's Bulls wins? Bad form, MBC.

 

I always thought Cleveland conviently won the lottery to save the franchise.

They, surprisingly enough, tied for the worst record in basketball that year with Denver. Cleveland snagged #1 and Denver slipped to #3.

 

Leads one to wonder, though, if Denver gets James and Cleveland's got #2/3/4, do they take Wade, Anthony, Bosh, or everyone's favorite trivia answer and the Human Victory Cigar, Darko Milicic?

 

Melo or Darko, depending on who they needed more.

 

They do not take Wade or Bosh. Nobody had them projected to break the Top 3. It woulda been like if Yi or Horford were drafted at #2 ahead of Durant or Oden. There was no chance of them breaking the top 3, that's just fanboy hindsight now that everyone sees how good Wade/Bosh are and how sucky Darko is.

 

Every GM in the league had Darko at 2 or 3. I do think its likely Cleveland would choose Carmelo over Darko, since Melo is also a great 3, and is the next best thing.

[cabbageboy 0]

To chime in here, this stuff sounds about like the shocking "tobacco is bad for you" revelations from some years ago. NBA refs calling games in order for star players to get calls and big name teams to get to the Finals? Well, duh.

 

Let's take a look at that 2002 playoffs. We already had the New Jersey Nets, a blatant non draw, advance to the Finals. There was no need to rig that series vs. the Celtics since the Celtics were so heatless then that no one would have cared if they had made the Finals and gotten swept. But on the other hand you have the Lakers going for a threepeat and the pesky Kings standing in the way of that history. You're telling me David Stern didn't want that series going 7 games with the Lakers eventually winning? Does anyone think NBC in their last year with the NBA wanted the craptastic matchup of the Nets vs. Kings? Much like in 2000 they didn't want Portland vs. Indiana in a ratings killer Finals, though I don't really think there was anyone crying foul over the Lakers/Blazers series.

 

2005 is a different story. I couldn't even think of a series that seemed dubious off hand. Dallas/Houston is a series that really didn't matter in the grand scheme of things, it was just whoever wins here loses to Phoenix (and I doubt Stern would risk the cred of his league over a 4/5 series). By the time the Suns got to the Spurs in those playoffs they were so injury riddled that there was no way to even rig that series if the NBA wanted to, it just went 5 games. I don't have a problem with the league looking at certain dubious things a player does and instructing refs to call it, so the Rockets really don't have as much of a case for being pissed.

 

I can see these conspiracies in instances like 2002, but what would be the motive behind rigging the 2006 Finals for the Heat to win? Is them winning really soooo much better than the Mavs? Does Stern hate Mark Cuban that much? It was likely typical bad home cooking type officiating, but nothing beyond that.

 

At the end of the day it seems like either NBA refs are one of three things: 1. Crooked like Donoghy and fixing games for Vegas. 2. Crooked and fixing games for the league for desired outcomes. 3. Inept and incompetent.

[Guest Epic Narcissism]

the Celtics were so heatless

[Mike wanna be 0]

If the 06 finals were fixed, it must have been due to the 'star power' of Shaq & Wade over the non-star power of Dirk and...uh...