Dr. Tom 0 Report post Posted June 10, 2004 I see on Drudge that Bill Clinton is bitching about being left off the speakers list. The thing is, Clinton is an excellent and charismatic speaker. While he might not have had a lot in common with Reagan in regards to political ideaology, I still think he could deliver a heck of a speech. Obviously, he won't be asked to, but if I were the Reagans, I would. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Vanhalen 0 Report post Posted June 10, 2004 Margaret Thatcher is too ill to attend...is she on her last legs? Pretty much yeah, she has suffered three stokes, and had her husband pass away last year Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
The Robfather 0 Report post Posted June 10, 2004 The thing is, Clinton is an excellent and charismatic speaker. While he might not have had a lot in common with Reagan in regards to political ideaology, I still think he could deliver a heck of a speech. Obviously, he won't be asked to, but if I were the Reagans, I would. Clinton can give a great speech, sure, but much of the time, he never has much of substance to say. The Vice President did a great job last night, anyway. Besides, I have heard several times that this was planned out a long time ago by Nancy and Ronald. Maybe Reagan didn't like Bill Clinton, who knows, but it wouldn't surprise me. It's the family's choice. This is a time to play honor to a great man, not let Clinton weasel his way into the spotlight again. BTW, I saw Lady Thatcher last night pay her respects to Ronald's casket. It gave me chills. An amazing woman. God bless her. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Firestarter 0 Report post Posted June 10, 2004 The thing is, Clinton is an excellent and charismatic speaker. While he might not have had a lot in common with Reagan in regards to political ideaology, I still think he could deliver a heck of a speech. Obviously, he won't be asked to, but if I were the Reagans, I would. Feh. President Reagan was a thousand times better than Clinton, because, as Rob said, Clinton had zero substance. His rhetoric may have been delivered well but there's nothing to back it up. I wouldn't want hollow, hypocritical bullshit blown in my face at my husband's funeral either - no matter how nice it sounded. Listen to - or read - A Time for Choosing for a truly great speech. Surpassed anything that ever came out of Clinton's mouth by lightyears. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest thebigjig Report post Posted June 10, 2004 The thing is, Clinton is an excellent and charismatic speaker. While he might not have had a lot in common with Reagan in regards to political ideaology, I still think he could deliver a heck of a speech. Obviously, he won't be asked to, but if I were the Reagans, I would. Feh. President Reagan was a thousand times better than Clinton, because, as Rob said, Clinton had zero substance. His rhetoric may have been delivered well but there's nothing to back it up. I wouldn't want hollow, hypocritical bullshit blown in my face at my husband's funeral either - no matter how nice it sounded. Listen to - or read - A Time for Choosing for a truly great speech. Surpassed anything that ever came out of Clinton's mouth by lightyears. Yes... Reagan was a better speaker than Clinton, and it's a damn shame the Gipper can't deliver his own speech I don't believe Dr. Tom was trying to compare the two... and one can also make the "hollow hypocritical bullshit" argument for the speaker of honor, George W. Christ Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest MikeSC Report post Posted June 10, 2004 The thing is, Clinton is an excellent and charismatic speaker. While he might not have had a lot in common with Reagan in regards to political ideaology, I still think he could deliver a heck of a speech. Obviously, he won't be asked to, but if I were the Reagans, I would. Feh. President Reagan was a thousand times better than Clinton, because, as Rob said, Clinton had zero substance. His rhetoric may have been delivered well but there's nothing to back it up. I wouldn't want hollow, hypocritical bullshit blown in my face at my husband's funeral either - no matter how nice it sounded. Listen to - or read - A Time for Choosing for a truly great speech. Surpassed anything that ever came out of Clinton's mouth by lightyears. Yes... Reagan was a better speaker than Clinton, and it's a damn shame the Gipper can't deliver his own speech I don't believe Dr. Tom was trying to compare the two... and one can also make the "hollow hypocritical bullshit" argument for the speaker of honor, George W. Christ Wow, jig, can you post anything but Bush bashing? Seriously. -=Mike Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest thebigjig Report post Posted June 10, 2004 The thing is, Clinton is an excellent and charismatic speaker. While he might not have had a lot in common with Reagan in regards to political ideaology, I still think he could deliver a heck of a speech. Obviously, he won't be asked to, but if I were the Reagans, I would. Feh. President Reagan was a thousand times better than Clinton, because, as Rob said, Clinton had zero substance. His rhetoric may have been delivered well but there's nothing to back it up. I wouldn't want hollow, hypocritical bullshit blown in my face at my husband's funeral either - no matter how nice it sounded. Listen to - or read - A Time for Choosing for a truly great speech. Surpassed anything that ever came out of Clinton's mouth by lightyears. Yes... Reagan was a better speaker than Clinton, and it's a damn shame the Gipper can't deliver his own speech I don't believe Dr. Tom was trying to compare the two... and one can also make the "hollow hypocritical bullshit" argument for the speaker of honor, George W. Christ Wow, jig, can you post anything but Bush bashing? Seriously. -=Mike Oh Jesus Christ Mike, like your posts are so diverse in opinion... Would you like me to do a post search and find just how many anti-Kerry posts you've made in the past few months? I gave Bush bashing a break for a few days anyway Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest MikeSC Report post Posted June 10, 2004 The thing is, Clinton is an excellent and charismatic speaker. While he might not have had a lot in common with Reagan in regards to political ideaology, I still think he could deliver a heck of a speech. Obviously, he won't be asked to, but if I were the Reagans, I would. Feh. President Reagan was a thousand times better than Clinton, because, as Rob said, Clinton had zero substance. His rhetoric may have been delivered well but there's nothing to back it up. I wouldn't want hollow, hypocritical bullshit blown in my face at my husband's funeral either - no matter how nice it sounded. Listen to - or read - A Time for Choosing for a truly great speech. Surpassed anything that ever came out of Clinton's mouth by lightyears. Yes... Reagan was a better speaker than Clinton, and it's a damn shame the Gipper can't deliver his own speech I don't believe Dr. Tom was trying to compare the two... and one can also make the "hollow hypocritical bullshit" argument for the speaker of honor, George W. Christ Wow, jig, can you post anything but Bush bashing? Seriously. -=Mike Oh Jesus Christ Mike, like your posts are so diverse in opinion... Would you like me to do a post search and find just how many anti-Kerry posts you've made in the past few months? I gave Bush bashing a break for a few days anyway I don't mention Kerry hardly. God knows he's too dull to mention. -=Mike Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Vern Gagne 0 Report post Posted June 11, 2004 I see on Drudge that Bill Clinton is bitching about being left off the speakers list. The thing is, Clinton is an excellent and charismatic speaker. While he might not have had a lot in common with Reagan in regards to political ideaology, I still think he could deliver a heck of a speech. Obviously, he won't be asked to, but if I were the Reagans, I would. No, Clinton would just use the speech to pedal his new book. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Vanhalen 0 Report post Posted June 11, 2004 Whatever you think about his personal politics, I think its a measure of the man, that not only in the UK is his funeral being carried on all the major 24 hour news networks over here, but also the 4 main terrestial channels, BBC1, ITV and so on, the last time this has happened was for Princess Diana's funeral in 1997, and the Queen Mothers funeral in 2001, so he is in good company there. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Vanhalen 0 Report post Posted June 11, 2004 BTW did anyone find the pictures of Thatcher and Gorbachev touching Reagans coffin really touching? It was weird, its like the whole of the 80's capsulated in one little space. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Salacious Crumb Report post Posted June 11, 2004 Here's an observation. You're an idiot... I second that observation. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kkktookmybabyaway 0 Report post Posted June 11, 2004 At least he's now using Rogaine -- good for Gorby... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
The Robfather 0 Report post Posted June 11, 2004 The Brits have a marvelous way of expressing themselves. WONDERFUL tribute from Mrs. Thatcher. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kkktookmybabyaway 0 Report post Posted June 11, 2004 Wow. Now I regret my stupid joke -- I heard her recording, too... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Vanhalen 0 Report post Posted June 11, 2004 Thatchers tribute was very powerful, along with George Bush's senior, i think George.W.Bushs tribute was a bit washy and meanlingless, but the first two were very powerful indeed, I think America can be proud of what they have done today so far for Ronald Reagan, regardless of political affiliation. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Vanhalen 0 Report post Posted June 11, 2004 Here is Margaret Thatchers amazing tribute to President Reagan for anyone who missed it "We have lost a great president, a great American, and a great man. And I have lost a dear friend. "In his lifetime Ronald Reagan was such a cheerful and invigorating presence that it was easy to forget what daunting historic tasks he set himself. He sought to mend America's wounded spirit, to restore the strength of the free world, and to free the slaves of communism. "These were causes hard to accomplish and heavy with risk. "Yet they were pursued with almost a lightness of spirit. For Ronald Reagan also embodied another great cause - what Arnold Bennett once called 'the great cause of cheering us all up'. "His politics had a freshness and optimism that won converts from every class and every nation - and ultimately from the very heart of the evil empire. 'Grace under pressure' "Yet his humour often had a purpose beyond humour. In the terrible hours after the attempt on his life, his easy jokes gave reassurance to an anxious world. Ronald Reagan's life was providential "They were evidence that in the aftermath of terror and in the midst of hysteria, one great heart at least remained sane and jocular. They were truly grace under pressure. "And perhaps they signified grace of a deeper kind. Ronnie himself certainly believed that he had been given back his life for a purpose. "As he told a priest after his recovery 'Whatever time I've got left now belongs to the Big Fella Upstairs'. "And surely it is hard to deny that Ronald Reagan's life was providential, when we look at what he achieved in the eight years that followed. "Others prophesied the decline of the West; he inspired America and its allies with renewed faith in their mission of freedom. "Others saw only limits to growth; he transformed a stagnant economy into an engine of opportunity. Trust "Others hoped, at best, for an uneasy cohabitation with the Soviet Union; he won the Cold War - not only without firing a shot, but also by inviting enemies out of their fortress and turning them into friends. When his enemies tested American resolve, they soon discovered that his resolve was firm and unyielding "I cannot imagine how any diplomat, or any dramatist, could improve on his words to Mikhail Gorbachev at the Geneva summit: 'Let me tell you why it is we distrust you.' Those words are candid and tough and they cannot have been easy to hear. But they are also a clear invitation to a new beginning and a new relationship that would be rooted in trust. "We live today in the world that Ronald Reagan began to reshape with those words. It is a very different world with different challenges and new dangers. All in all, however, it is one of greater freedom and prosperity, one more hopeful than the world he inherited on becoming president. "As prime minister, I worked closely with Ronald Reagan for eight of the most important years of all our lives. We talked regularly both before and after his presidency. And I have had time and cause to reflect on what made him a great president. "Ronald Reagan knew his own mind. He had firm principles - and, I believe, right ones. He expounded them clearly, he acted upon them decisively. Goodwill "When the world threw problems at the White House, he was not baffled, or disorientated, or overwhelmed. He knew almost instinctively what to do. "When his aides were preparing option papers for his decision, they were able to cut out entire rafts of proposals that they knew 'the Old Man' would never wear. Baroness Thatcher is paying tribute to an old friend "When his allies came under Soviet or domestic pressure, they could look confidently to Washington for firm leadership. "And when his enemies tested American resolve, they soon discovered that his resolve was firm and unyielding. "Yet his ideas, though clear, were never simplistic. He saw the many sides of truth. "Yes, he warned that the Soviet Union had an insatiable drive for military power and territorial expansion; but he also sensed it was being eaten away by systemic failures impossible to reform. "Yes, he did not shrink from denouncing Moscow's 'evil empire'. But he realised that a man of goodwill might nonetheless emerge from within its dark corridors. "So the President resisted Soviet expansion and pressed down on Soviet weakness at every point until the day came when communism began to collapse beneath the combined weight of these pressures and its own failures. "And when a man of goodwill did emerge from the ruins, President Reagan stepped forward to shake his hand and to offer sincere cooperation. Patriotism "Nothing was more typical of Ronald Reagan than that large-hearted magnanimity - and nothing was more American. "Therein lies perhaps the final explanation of his achievements. "Ronald Reagan carried the American people with him in his great endeavours because there was perfect sympathy between them. He and they loved America and what it stands for - freedom and opportunity for ordinary people. "As an actor in Hollywood's golden age, he helped to make the American dream live for millions all over the globe. His own life was a fulfilment of that dream. "He never succumbed to the embarrassment some people feel about an honest expression of love of country. "He was able to say 'God Bless America' with equal fervour in public and in private. And so he was able to call confidently upon his fellow-countrymen to make sacrifices for America - and to make sacrifices for those who looked to America for hope and rescue. "With the lever of American patriotism, he lifted up the world. "And so today the world - in Prague, in Budapest, in Warsaw, in Sofia, in Bucharest, in Kiev and in Moscow itself - the world mourns the passing of the Great Liberator and echoes his prayer 'God Bless America'. Twilight "Ronald Reagan's life was rich not only in public achievement, but also in private happiness. "Indeed, his public achievements were rooted in his private happiness. The great turning point of his life was his meeting and marriage with Nancy. "On that we have the plain testimony of a loving and grateful husband: 'Nancy came along and saved my soul.' We share her grief today. But we also share her pride - and the grief and pride of Ronnie's children. "For the final years of his life, Ronnie's mind was clouded by illness. That cloud has now lifted. "He is himself again - more himself than at any time on this earth. For we may be sure that the Big Fella Upstairs never forgets those who remember Him. "And as the last journey of this faithful pilgrim took him beyond the sunset, and as heaven's morning broke, I like to think - in the words of Bunyan - that 'all the trumpets sounded on the other side'. "We here still move in twilight. But we have one beacon to guide us that Ronald Reagan never had. "We have his example. Let us give thanks today for a life that achieved so much for all of God's children." Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Swift Terror 0 Report post Posted June 11, 2004 Thatcher rules. BTW, unforgettable rendition of The Battle Hymn of the Republic. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dr. Tom 0 Report post Posted June 11, 2004 Lady Thatcher's tribute was AMAZING. That alone made it worth tuning into the state funeral. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jobber of the Week 0 Report post Posted June 11, 2004 BTW, unforgettable rendition of The Battle Hymn of the Republic. I remember they were playing that one when they were putting him inside, too. Sure have been hearing it alot. As songs go, that one creeps me out because it practically binds the country to God, and you know how I feel about that. I kept hoping for "Taps" or something, but it seems I missed that. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kkktookmybabyaway 0 Report post Posted June 11, 2004 I can't wait for that shithead from that hippie Separation of Church and State group (Something Lynn -- I'm too busy yelling at him when he's on TV to hear his first name) to start whining about the frequent mentioning of God during Reagan's funeral. He needs a beating the the nth degree... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Spicy McHaggis 0 Report post Posted June 11, 2004 I can't wait for that shithead from that hippie Separation of Church and State group (Something Lynn -- I'm too busy yelling at him when he's on TV to hear his first name) to start whining about the frequent mentioning of God during Reagan's funeral. He needs a beating the the nth degree... Seriously. I'm glad the speakers didn't hold back though. It seems like these people forget the fact that no one is being indoctrinated. Jobber this country, which embraces God-given rights, is bound to God whether you like it or not. As long as no one gets Jesus-freaky about it, it's peachy. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest MikeSC Report post Posted June 11, 2004 BTW, unforgettable rendition of The Battle Hymn of the Republic. I remember they were playing that one when they were putting him inside, too. Sure have been hearing it alot. As songs go, that one creeps me out because it practically binds the country to God, and you know how I feel about that. I kept hoping for "Taps" or something, but it seems I missed that. Let me guess --- you refuse to exercise your rights and freedoms here, because the founding fathers said they were given to us by God, right? -=Mike Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kkktookmybabyaway 0 Report post Posted June 12, 2004 God gave our rights and freedoms, but they violated the law of church-and-state separation, which means our Constitution is unconstitutional. I have a headache... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest thebigjig Report post Posted June 12, 2004 No, Clinton would just use the speech to pedal his new book. riiiight... Anyway... the funeral was amazing... when Bush 1 started to choke up, so did I, and I didn't even like Bush 1 all that much... guess I'm just too much of a bleeding hearted liberal Oh, and the Battle Hymn of the Republic at the end gave me goosebumps Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jobber of the Week 0 Report post Posted June 12, 2004 Let me guess --- you refuse to exercise your rights and freedoms here, because the founding fathers said they were given to us by God, right? -=Mike I just personally find that song to be more about religion and less about patriotism than other songs, such as Stars & Stripes Forever, the national anthem, America The Beautiful, or others. Also, our rights were granted by a "creator", of which no specific denomination was named, thank you. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest MikeSC Report post Posted June 12, 2004 Let me guess --- you refuse to exercise your rights and freedoms here, because the founding fathers said they were given to us by God, right? -=Mike I just personally find that song to be more about religion and less about patriotism than other songs, such as Stars & Stripes Forever, the national anthem, America The Beautiful, or others. Also, our rights were granted by a "creator", of which no specific denomination was named, thank you. If you oppose religion in gov't as much as you claim --- that should be more than you can handle, too. And, I seem to remember people getting pissy about our "over-patriotism". Reagan was a Christian. It's not exactly a secret. -=Mike Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Jobber of the Week 0 Report post Posted June 12, 2004 I support the government keep itself restrained to non-specific religion, left to be interpreted by the viewer, with no sponsorship of any particular religion. And anyone who thinks the death of a President isn't a reason to be over-patriotic is nucking futs. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Justice 0 Report post Posted June 12, 2004 As a trumpet player who has played "Taps" twice for my town on memorial day, that was the most beautiful rendition I've ever heard of the song. And Nancy rubbing the coffin is making me choke up... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
