Getting Orton Over

[The Dames 0]

If they are SERIOUS about getting Orton over with the crowd as a heel...this is what they should do. He should LOSE tonight's title match to Benoit, giving him the title back.

 

Orton would be CRUSHED since the announcers and wrestlers would call his victory a fluke. Triple H could still be the leader of Evolution, going after the World Title and such. His consolation for Orton is to tell him that regardless of how long his title reign was, it was at SummerSlam and THAT's the match that's remembered, that's the match thats on the video stores, that's the match that goes on the annual highlight reels. Keeping Orton in his place...

 

Orton would then be on a MISSION to win the World Title back...but was actually most concerned with how long his title reign would be. He ends up winning the World Title and holds it til Wrestlemania (making a BIG DEAL about his first title defense, which is an automatic draw with an over champion), where Triple H goes for the shot. Triple H tries to tell him that he doesn't want to hurt him, so Orton should just make it easy on him in their match. Orton is of course appalled and tells him that he doesn't have to listen to him. He won the World Title defeating a man that he couldn't (Benoit), he was the youngest champion, Triple H was how old? They wouldn't come to blows, but eventually Flair brings them together and agrees to a stipulation match. The winner of the match is not only the World Champion, but the leader of Evolution and the loser is kicked out.

 

Dames

[Guest Big_Jay101]

I think they did a good job getting him over in the final segment on RAW tonight. If that doesn't get him over as a face in the US I don't know what will. THe angle was intresting and I was into it myself.

[Eclipse 0]

I think what happened tonight was ok, but I was thinking the same. He should have lost the title right away....

[Steviekick 0]

It's still salvagable. He has plenty of time to drop the title. Just don't put it off too long.

[Aero 0]

I like the idea alot, but a heel vs. heel title match might not be the best for Wrestlemania, unless it's on Raw or another PPV. After watching Summerslam and Raw tonight, I'm all for Orton's face turn. Here's an idea I had...

 

The rematch between Benoit and Orton goes on just as it did tonight, with Evolution distracting Benoit and basically costing him the match. Afterwards, Evolution tries to celebrate, but Orton is somewhat reluctant. No beatdown. Next week, Bischoff says at the top of the show, a number one contender at Unforgiven will be determined by the end of the show after the performances of everyone, which would include Jericho, Edge, Kane, and HHH among others. Mid-way through the show, in the office, Bischoff decides to let Orton choose his opponent, within reason for the PPV main event. HHH overhears and tries to use his influence to get the title shot. He assures him that no matter who wins, Evolution will stay together. The main event of the night is HHH vs. Benoit, with HHH winning after Flair & Batista interfere. Bischoff and Orton come out, and Bischoff says that Orton has a decision to make right then and there. He reluctantly says that he wants Benoit one more time at Unforgiven in a 2/3 Falls match because after the respect that Benoit showed him at Summerslam, Benoit deserved a clean rematch, and that he wanted to prove that Summerslam wasn't a fluke, without any interference. HHH is visibly pissed that night, but the next week, he acts normal and tells Orton that he doesn't mind, just so long as he wins. At Unforgiven, the match is 1-1 and goes about 30 minutes. Orton manages to win, cleanly, once again. Now, after the match, Evolution celebrates once again, but here they give Orton the boot.

[Guest Trivia247]

hard to remain a heel when the Head heel of the show just whooped your ass and made you feel like crap, dirt...or worst..... RVD, Booker T, Scott Steiner and anyone else that happen to lose to HHH when he was champ.

[DangerousDamon 0]

I think another great way for Orton to get even more over is to have Evolution cause him to drop the strap in a rematch with Benoit. Have Benoit not see the interference and then after he sees it get discouraged. He feels shame in winning the title and goes to forfeit it, but Bischoff says he doesnt want a vacant title on his show. Benoit then feeling like he hasnt earned his title teams up with Orton who is just crushed that Evo has cost him the one thing that meant the most to him. Have HHH throw everyone he can at Orton and Benoit to soften them both up being that hates them both being that Benoit beat him for HIS title and then Orton stole it from right under his nose. Have Orton feud with everyone from Batista, Flair, Edge ( drops the IC title to Jericho), random thugs HHH pays off. Have HHH cheat to beat Benoit at Survivor Series and then have him find ways to keep Orton from being the #1 contender. HHH defends vs Jericho or Benoit at Royal Rumble, maybe toss in a tag match at the December PPV, but dont let Orton and HHH square off in the ring. Make it like Batista/Edge vs Orton/Benoit. Have Orton win the Royal Rumble even after Evolution has it rigged for him and Benoit to be #1 and #2. Then you do the build to Mania and Orton finally gets his hands on HHH

[Guest GreatOne]

Might be a little retarded right away but I can buy Orton as a face.

 

>Beats Benoit straight-up, where in 2004 HHH can't.

>Was the one member of Evolution that COULD win big matches cleanly (Batista merely beating Benoit up doesn't count)

 

HHH can do neither (in 2004) so there you go.

 

I just hope we aren't headed for a Benoit/Orton Respect lovefest. Hell I'll take something like 'Let's get something straight Orton (or Benoit): it ain't over between us, but isn't between me and HHH either' and a resulting Benoit/Orton v HHH/Batista match.

[NoCalMike 0]

Ok here is the problem, it is obvious they were going for the "cool heel" who turns face route like Austin/Rock, however in all honesty, Orton wasn't even 1/4th as over playing a "cool heel" as Austin/Rock were upon their face turn. Orton needed another good 6 months of refining and polishing as a cool heel, and not as a cocky backup to "the man" before he could be bought as the #1 babyface. Now he is being turned face with the hopes that the small amount of fans that liked him can spread their cheer. It remains to be seen if Orton has what it takes to get over as a heel, where the cool factor will obviously be played second fiddle to Triple H's cool/god complex.

[Guest Bitterness the Star]

Reading the results, I think that they made an excellent choice - I mean, everything Orton had as a heel can be loved as a face, looks, charisma, etc.

 

By turning him heel, all of those elements that contributed to his heel persona are reversed and work towards him being the best face that he can be. That's why turning him is such a good idea and he can be a terrific babyface, thus he gets over.

 

I do wonder though whether or not Evolution will replace him.

[Mole 0]

They want to make this the WM21 main event? So they are going to build on this feud for 7 months? I can't see WWE doing that at all.

 

At first I thought it was a good idea turning Orton right away. But now that I think about it more, it was a bad idea. They should have teased this for a long time, around December or so, and have Evolution turn on Orton. Like other people have said, he isn't over enough as a face and wasn't even over enough as a heel yet.

 

They also should have had Orton beat Benoit clean. The fact that Benoit was distracted by Evolution only makes Orton look weak as a champion. If they want him to get over as a worthy champion, he should have hit the RKO in the middle of the ring and beaten Benoit twice in two nights. And what do they do with Benoit from here?

 

I am not happy with Orton's first reign so far.

[Guest JMA]

I really feel the heel Orton character died tonight. The character finally received his comeuppance for all the crap he's pulled; spitting in Foley's face, mocking him, and beating him at his own game; spitting in Harley Race's face; beating HBK through dubious means; giving the RKO to Mark Cuban; his "you people" comment towards Shelton Benjamin; and many other things. Orton had his friends turn on him and beat the shit out of him. He's no longer a member of Evolution and his very identity is in question.

 

Orton is now a pariah holding the one thing everyone wants -- the World Heavyweight Championship. This is a really good story.

[Guest Bitterness the Star]

Excellent point, but the fact is, in pro wrestling, a beatdown just doesn't happen on a heel with him remaining that way.

 

Besides, if the guy is now a face I'm sure that these fans can live and let live. As for him being the holder of Raw's highest honour... well, see my earlier post.

[bobobrazil1984 0]

now that orton is apparently going to be a face... I think it's time for....

 

wait for it....

 

GENERIC SMILING BABYFACE!!!

 

followed by a promo that goes something like this:

 

HHH: What makes you think you're better than me, huh!? I've beaten Rock, Austin, Undertaker, Goldberg, <insert name>, <insert name> etc etc... what makes you think you're so different!?!?

*orton punches HHH and HHH runs out into the aisle looking all shocked despite the fact that it happens to him every three months*

[Scroby 0]

I don't care what anyone says or thinks about Orton, he still hasn't impressed me at all. Yes he can have good matches but those matches have all been with guys who are able to carry him in a good match. Orton is nothing but your standard wrestler (i.e Maven) from the WWE. I don't really wanna sound like a troll here so sorry if I am, I just really don't think Orton should be a champion at all, I just think the WWE is trying to do with Orton what they did with the Rock. If WWE is going to turn Orton face he'll probably bomb since he did the first time he was a face. Just remembe he wasn't anything till HHH put him under his ring, the only thing he was were those annoying "Randy status is" promos and thats it. He's still very steller in the ring and I predict he'll bomb as a face but then he's still in the HHH beltcamp so maybe Evolution will continue to carry him.

[Fro 0]

Look at how they screwed Orton over by rushing his face turn... they totally flubbed this... yes him getting turfed out should have happened, but 2-3 months later at least (after a rematch with Benoit on the next PPV and after a Survivor Series match).

 

Who's Orton going to feud with as a face? HHH? Kane (lol)? You're going to have to turn people heel just so he has people to feud with after HHH. I think Edge may be heading that way, but Orton just feuded with him 2 months ago!

 

And HHH isn't a realistic option as a heel champ either since he's already destroyed everyone on the roster except for Edge.

 

They're booking themselves into another JBL situation (although Orton is a much more viable champ, heel or face), IMHO, as far as having to run stale feuds.

[Guest BDC]

I don't see why they want to push Orton so hard. I mean, yeah, he's improving, but they insist on giving him the mic.

 

Then they fail to realize how damn boring he is.

[notJames 0]

And once again, HHH is the focus of the show, while former champ Benoit slinks silently into the background and Orton is made to look like a placeholder champ.

 

Plus ça change, plus c'est la même chose.

[JasonX 0]

And once again, HHH is the focus of the show, while former champ Benoit slinks silently into the background and Orton is made to look like a placeholder champ.

 

Plus ça change, plus c'est la même chose.

Well at least Benoit gets to slink back to the mid-card with his dignity intact while Randy Orton becomes the lame-duck champion everyone and their mothers were expecting Benoit to be...

 

That being said, the simple way to build Orton up now would be to do an injury angle. Have HHH "cripple" Orton and steal the belt and go around for a couple of months acting like he's the champion and badmouthing RO and after a couple of months have RO come back to reclaim his stolen belt and then beat HHH for good.

[EricMM 0]

Orton, if he is to remain "the future of the company" needs to remain STRONG.

 

He still has to pose, he still needs the good music, he still needs the golden sparkles.

 

He needs to NOT slink, he needs to go out and say that he wasn't kicked out of Evolution because he IS evolution. Is Bautista Evolution? No he's just another freak, dime-a-dozon big man. Is Flair Evolution? What a joke, his heyday was twenty years ago. And is HHH evolution? No, his day was yesterday, but his day is over. Orton is Evolution.

[Shanghai Kid 0]

What was the point of the opening promo last night? Orton making fun of the crowd and getting heat, I don't get it. He wasn't that over as a heel, and now that he's gotten jumped by Evolution, the crowd is just going to cheer him?

 

You can make a solid case that Randy had that beatdown coming to him. He's done alot of crap in the last 7-8 months.

 

I just don't see him suddenly coming out to huge face pops. He doesn't have the kind of promos that get the crowd behind him like Rock/Austin/Foley. He has that slow monotone heelish promo style.

 

The only way he can maybe become a good face if Benoit totally gets behind him. It's going to have to take the faces acceping him before the fans just come out and start cheering him. This is not a situation like the Rock. The Rock was getting more heat than anybody, Orton is not.

[notJames 0]

Orton saves Benoit from an Evolution beatdown. One reluctant handshake later, and a face is born.

 

Too bad all of this is being rushed so much... could've made for a lot more interesting storytelling.

[Angle-plex 0]

For all the people saying that they should have waited until January to do the turn: What sense does that make? Triple H (the character) is a selfish asshole who wants one thing: The World Heavyweight Championship. If they held off on the turn it would have made no sense for his standpoint. However, I also doubt that this will be the WM21 main event (That will be Cena/Orton).

[Guest Loss]

They sacrificed the story so they could swerve us, which is why Orton did the promo at the beginning of the show. They didn't want us to see the turn coming. The fact is, they should have built it up so the fans would actually want to see Orton tell Evolution to stick it.

[Angle-plex 0]

They sacrificed the story so they could swerve us, which is why Orton did the promo at the beginning of the show.

Waiting to turn Orton would have killed the story. Trips would never play the lackey and he probably felt betrayed that Orton won the title, and pissed that he beat Benoit cleanly, something he couldn't do. Waiting too long to do the Evolution beat down would have made Trips look like he was going into evolution's "past" role with Flair.

 

Orton did the promo at the beginning of the show because that was his character. He's an arrogant prick. After doing something like winning the WORLD HEAVYWEIGHT TITLE, an arrogant prick would be gloating and saying how much better his is than everyone else; just like Orton did last night. Having him suddenly change personalities and make a generic "I like Benoit because we shook hands" promo would have been the problem, not what he did.

[Promoter 0]

Realistically it does make more sense for Triple H to attack Orton sooner than later. If we want some consistency how would someone like Triple H who is an ass against retards and a championship monger to suddenly play second fiddle to someone he can claim he groomed wearing HIS title?

[Guest Loss]

It's consistent with HHH's character, but it totally buries Orton. The fans have to express interest in cheering him before they turn him face, and I have my doubts on whether or not Orton can get over now. I mean, sure, he can probably get a few pops, but will he end up like Edge, who gets booed when he interacts with other babyfaces or "cool" heels?

[Angle-plex 0]

Orton has been getting good face pops lately anyways. As long as they keep him the same basic character and not have a sudden personality change, I think he'll remain over. He'll never be the next Austin or Rock, but I think he can been top face.

 

As long as they do that and give him a good theme song and have him lose some of the submission/rest holds he does in the middle of the match, he should get over pretty good.

[Guest GreatOne]

Orton can't beat Benoit straight, of course it just happened two nights ago

 

And as predicted the 'Benoit is being buried' whine spreads over to Orton. Yes how dare that HHH continue to be a heel (in the context of the storyline, like HHH is gonna walk around touting the man who did what he couldn't do, beat Chris Benoit for the world title), hell you can make the same Rock/Nationv2.0 parallel when he was first I-C champ and Faarooq was merely accepting. A three-month slow build might have worked for the I-C champ and it's about second or third down on the depth chart but not here. Think of Luger winning the battle royal and the Horsemen dumping him, only with the world title involved.

 

Only thing truly lame that could come out of this is they do a 99 Bossman 'wow we really showed those morons' bit.................

[NoCalMike 0]

Something else about this. The Evolution beat down makes it seem more like Evolution is and has always been about protecting Triple H. I mean you'd think Flair and Batista would have a problem with that Triple H wanted them to do.......oh well.....I am thinking to logical again.