Dark Age 0 Report post Posted December 15, 2004 I saw the thread on Meltzer's ECW ratings and was wondering if anyone knows where (or has) to find Meltzer's * ratings for WCW? Anything really, PPV, COTC, Nitros, etc. Thanks in advance. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Loss Report post Posted December 15, 2004 I have no clue where you could find those, but if you do, please let me know. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dark Age 0 Report post Posted December 16, 2004 Heh. Thanks a lot Loss! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
UseTheSledgehammerUh 0 Report post Posted December 16, 2004 Those are a joke. My God, that Sting/Abdullah tag match from Starrcade was awful. *** 1/2. LOL. Among other notables. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SamoaRowe 0 Report post Posted December 16, 2004 I have no clue where you could find those, but if you do, please let me know. LoL. After skimming through that I did not notice many (if any) matches with less than *** ratings. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Cheech Tremendous 0 Report post Posted December 16, 2004 I have no clue where you could find those, but if you do, please let me know. LoL. After skimming through that I did not notice many (if any) matches with less than *** ratings. Seeing that the site is a list of WCW matches that Meltzer has given ***+ to, I would say that's a pretty accurate statement. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Dynamite Kido Report post Posted December 16, 2004 For the most part....I think the ratings are as close to accurate as you can get. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dark Age 0 Report post Posted December 18, 2004 Question: Are there certain matches that Meltzer simply doesn't rate? Maybe he misses matches, or doesn't mention them, or just comments without adding a rating? I ask this because there seem to be some omissions from that site. No Mercy 01 has SIX ***+ rated matches, yet not one is the triple threat main event. Surely Meltzer wouldn't give matches like Kane/Test and Taker/Booker ***+ ahead of the far superior Austin/Angle/RVD? JD02 has matches like HHH/Jericho and Austin/Flair and Big Show, yet no love for RVD/Eddie? Maybe the guy making the site didn't have the ratings for some matches, or maybe Meltzer didn't think they were good, but it does seem strange. In WCW in 98, he skips the Booker/Saturn/Martel series. I know it's all a matter of opinion, but using the Meltzer system, those matches are easily ***+ The further it goes back, it seems the less Meltzer rates TV matches. Is this because Mike Stamcoff doesn't have much info on back issues of the observer, or that Meltzer has only recently started rating as many TV matches? And finally, looking at the other Observer site (http://home.att.net/~backrake/) Edge & Christian vs. Chris Benoit & Shelton Benjamin WWE Raw 11/15 was described as far better than anything on Survivor Series (11/14). The highest rated match from that night (Christian vs. Shelton Benjamin) was rated ***1/2. Does Meltzer do this a lot? Maybe that is why certain matches are missing? Anyway, it's still a great site of course. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest Loss Report post Posted December 18, 2004 Meltzer will usually only rate a match if it's *** or better if it's on TV, but he typically rates every single match on a PPV. This is only intended to be a collection of his ***+ ratings, as was previously said. Meltzer gave every single match at No Mercy '01 at least ***. He called it one of the best workrate PPVs ever. Meltzer has only recently started rating so many TV matches. TV was almost entirely squash matches until the Monday Night Wars, with main eventer v midcarder being about as high-profile as you got on free TV. No way HHH v Benoit v Edge, for example, would have been shown on free TV in 1994. The Backrate site doesn't document anything rated under ***1/2. The Stamcoff site doesn't document anything rated under ***. Like you, I wondered about a few matches that were omitted. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Hunter's Torn Quad 0 Report post Posted December 19, 2004 If you want to know why the No Mercy main event isn't there, it's probably because Meltzer didn't give a rating for it for some reason. He does call it an awesome match, but says the finish was flat because the attention was on Vince while the finish was going down. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Mystery Eskimo 0 Report post Posted December 19, 2004 Apart from anything else, theres some matches on that list I'd kill to see, mainly Anderson/Flair vs. Pillman/Austin 2/3 falls and Flair vs. Rude. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Zetterberg is God 0 Report post Posted December 19, 2004 Apart from anything else, theres some matches on that list I'd kill to see, mainly Anderson/Flair vs. Pillman/Austin 2/3 falls and Flair vs. Rude. I'm pretty sure that the 2/3 falls tag match is on the Stone Cold Truth DVD as an extra. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Betty Houle 0 Report post Posted December 20, 2004 Apart from anything else, theres some matches on that list I'd kill to see, mainly Anderson/Flair vs. Pillman/Austin 2/3 falls and Flair vs. Rude. I may be in a minority but I was thoroughly bored by the Rude-Flair matches. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SamoaRowe 0 Report post Posted December 20, 2004 I have no clue where you could find those, but if you do, please let me know. LoL. After skimming through that I did not notice many (if any) matches with less than *** ratings. Seeing that the site is a list of WCW matches that Meltzer has given ***+ to, I would say that's a pretty accurate statement. True, there more than i thought. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
UseTheSledgehammerUh 0 Report post Posted December 21, 2004 Betty Houle, Rude/Flair did *NOT* click, and was one of the worst feuds ever. Flair, a lifetime womanizer, gets upset his FRENCH MAID is demeaned by Rick f'n Rude? And then Flair, the master of cheating, jobs the title and gets DQ'd in the rematch. Not good...93 was a mess. WCW U.S. Champion Lex Luger Vs. "Dangerous" Dan Spivey WCW World Champion Ric Flair, Sid Vicious, Barry Windham, & Larry Zbyszko Vs. Sting, Brian Pillman, & WCW U.S. Tag Team Champions The Steiner Brothers WCW World Tag Team Champions The Steiner Brothers Vs. WCW U.S. Champion Lex Luger & Sting WCW Television Champion Arn Anderson Vs. "Beautiful" Bobby Eaton WCW World Champion Lex Luger Vs. Ron Simmons WCW World Champion Lex Luger & Arn Anderson Vs. "Z-Man" Tom Zenk & Terrence Taylor Sting & The Great Muta Vs. The Steiner Brothers WCW Light Heavyweight Champion Jushin "Thunder" Liger Vs. Brian Pillman WCW World Tag Team Champions Arn Anderson & "Beautiful" Bobby Eaton Vs. The Steiner Brothers WCW U.S. Champion "Ravishing" Rick Rude Vs. Ricky "The Dragon" Steamboat WCW World Tag Team Champions The Steiner Brothers Vs. Tatsumi Fujinami & Takayuki Iizuka WCW World Champion Sting, WCW Television Champion Barry Windham, Dustin Rhodes, Ricky "The Dragon" Steamboat, & Nikita Koloff Vs. WCW U.S. Champion "Ravishing" Rick Rude, "Stunning" Steve Austin, Arn Anderson, "Beautiful" Bobby Eaton, & Larry Zbyszko WCW U.S. Champion "Ravishing" Rick Rude Vs. Ricky "The Dragon" Steamboat WCW World Champion Sting Vs. Big Van Vader Sting Vs. Big Van Vader WCW World Champion Big Van Vader Vs. Sting WCW World Champion Big Van Vader Vs. Cactus Jack WCW World Champion Big Van Vader Vs. Ric Flair Big Van Vader Vs. The Boss WCW World Champion Ric Flair Vs. Ricky "The Dragon" Steamboat WCW World Tag Team Champions The Nasty Boys Vs. Cactus Jack & Maxx Payne WCW World Tag Team Champions The Nasty Boys Vs. Cactus Jack & Kevin Sullivan WCW World Champion Ric Flair Vs. Hulk Hogan WCW World Champion Hulk Hogan Vs. Ric Flair Ric Flair Vs. "Macho Man" Randy Savage Ric Flair Vs. Arn Anderson Brian Pillman Vs. Johnny B. Badd Ric Flair & Sting Vs. Brian Pillman & Arn Anderson Jushin "Thunder" Liger Vs. Chris Benoit Shinjiro Ohtani Vs. Eddie Guerrero WCW World Champion Randy Savage Vs. Ric Flair WCW Cruiserweight Champion Dean Malenko Vs. Rey Mysterio, Jr. Chris Benoit Vs. Kevin Sullivan Psychosis Vs. Rey Mysterio, Jr. "Macho Man" Randy Savage, Lex Luger, & Sting Vs. The Outsiders & The Third Man Chris Benoit Vs. Chris Jericho WCW World Champion Hollywood Hogan, The Outsiders, & nWo Sting Vs. Ric Flair, Sting, Lex Luger, & Arn Anderson WCW Cruiserweight Champion Rey Mysterio, Jr. Vs. Dean Malenko WCW Cruiserweight Champion Dean Malenko Vs. J-Crown Champion Ultimo Dragon WCW U.S. Champion Eddie Guerrero Vs. Dean Malenko Mortis Vs. Glacier "Diamond" Dallas Page Vs. "Macho Man" Randy Savage Mortis & Wrath Vs. Ernest Miller & Glacier Chris Benoit Vs. Kevin Sullivan WCW Cruiserweight Champion Chris Jericho Vs. Eddie Guerrero WCW Cruiserweight Champion Eddie Guerrero Vs. Rey Mysterio, Jr. WCW World Champion Hollywood Hogan Vs. Sting Juventud Guerrera, Super Calo, Lizmark, Jr., and Chavo Guerrero, Jr. Vs. La Parka, Psicosis, Silver King, and El Dandy Chris Benoit Vs. Raven WCW Televison Champion Rick Martel Vs. Booker T. WCW Televison Champion Booker T. Vs. Saturn WCW Cruiserweight Champion Chris Jericho Vs. Juventud Guerrera WCW U.S. Champion "Diamond" Dallas Page Vs. Chris Benoit Sting Vs. Hollywood Hogan WCW Cruiserweight Battle Royal WCW Cruiserweight Champion Chris Jericho Vs. Cruiserweight Battle Royal Winner Perry Saturn Vs. Raven WCW Television Champion Chris Jericho Vs. Raven WCW World Champion Goldberg Vs. "Diamond" Dallas Page WCW Cruiserweight Champion Billy Kidman Vs. Rey Mysterio, Jr. Vs. Juventud Guerrera WCW Cruiserweight Champion Billy Kidman Vs. Eddie Guerrero WCW World Champion Goldberg Vs. Kevin Nash WCW Cruiserweight Champion Billy Kidman Vs. Mikey Whipwreck WCW World Champion Hollywood Hogan Vs. Ric Flair Blitzkrieg Vs. Juventud Guerrera Chris Benoit & Dean Malenko Vs. Raven & Perry Saturn WCW World Champion Ric Flair Vs. Sting Vs. Hollywood Hogan Vs. "Diamond" Dallas Page WCW Tag Team Champions Rey Mysterio, Jr. & Billy Kidman Vs. Dean Malenko & Chris Benoit Vs. Raven & Perry Saturn WCW U.S. Champion Chris Benoit Vs. "Diamond" Dallas Page Chris Benoit Vs. Jeff Jarrett Chris Benoit Vs. Bret "Hitman" Hart Chris Benoit Vs. Sid Vicious WCW World Champion Jeff Jarrett Vs. Booker T. WCW World Champion Booker T. Vs. Scott Steiner Shannon Moore & Shane Helms Vs. Yang & Kaz Hayashi Vs. Jamie Knoble & Evan Karagias WCW Cruiserweight Champion Chavo Guerrero, Jr. Vs. Shane Helms Shane Helms Vs. Yang Vs. Kaz Hayashi Vs. Shannon Moore Vs. Jamie Knoble Vs. Evan Karagias Jason Jett Vs. Kwee Wee Elix Skipper & Kid Romeo Vs. Rey Mysterio, Jr. & Billy Kidman WCW Cruiserweight Champion Chavo Guerrero, Jr. Vs. Shane Helms These PPV matches are all *** +, with the exception of the Sting/Hogan bouts in 97-98. Check out the WCW Thread I started in Gen Wres. for more. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest fanofcoils Report post Posted December 21, 2004 http://www.geocities.com/mfoy18/wmstarindex.html Wrestlemania 2 - Roddy Piper vs. Mr. T: -***** Wrestlemania 5 - The Fabulous Rougeaus vs. The Bushwackers: -**** Interesting Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TheFranchise 0 Report post Posted December 21, 2004 Wrestlemania 2 - Roddy Piper vs. Mr. T: -***** Overrated. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JHawk 0 Report post Posted December 22, 2004 The worst rating possible and it's overrated? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TheFranchise 0 Report post Posted December 26, 2004 The worst rating possible and it's overrated? Come on, it can get MUCH worse than -*****. We're talking -****** levels here. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Guest LooneyTune Report post Posted December 26, 2004 There's no such thing as anything above... er, below -*****. -***** is the absolute worst match in the history of wrestling that would make Jesus, Moses, and Santa Claus spin in their graves for eternity while 1,000,000 people piss on their graves simultaniously at the same time nuclear bombs destroy the earth. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
alfdogg 0 Report post Posted December 27, 2004 So, after going through these: This year's Rumble was as good as 92? Bret-Shawn from Surv. Series 92 was better than Bret/DBS? Steiner/Goldberg had a ****1/4 match? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
UseTheSledgehammerUh 0 Report post Posted December 27, 2004 alf, No, Steiner and Goldberg never had a match that good. They had a passable "Oh, this could be on WWE" match that wasn't boring. Since it wasn't boring, it had a decent storyline and wasn't embarassing to watch like the rest of tyhe company's matches, it was overrated. Call it ** 1/2. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dark Age 0 Report post Posted August 30, 2005 http://www.geocities.com/mfoy18/wwfstarlist.html 1/3/05 Triple H vs. Randy Orton ***1/2 1/9/05 Triple H vs. Randy Orton vs. Chris Jericho vs. Edge vs. Batista vs. Chris Benoit (Elimination Chamber) ****1/4 1/24/05 Chris Benoit/Chris Jericho/Shawn Michaels vs. Tyson Tomko/Christian/Edge ***1/2 1/24/05 Randy Orton vs. Ric Flair ***1/2 1/30/05 Shawn Michaels vs. Edge ***1/4 1/30/05 HHH vs. Randy Orton ***1/4 2/7/05 Chris Benoit vs. Chris Jericho (Submission) ***3/4 2/10/05 Rey Mysterio vs. Kurt Angle **** 2/14/05 Randy Orton vs. Christian ***1/2 2/20/05 Kurt Angle vs. John Cena ***3/4 2/21/05 Edge/Christian vs. Randy Orton/Shawn Michaels **** 2/28/05 Edge vs. Shawn Michaels (Street Fight) ***3/4 3/14/05 Chris Benoit vs. Triple H ***1/2 3/17/05 Kurt Angle vs. Marty Jannetty ***1/4 3/21/05 Shelton Benjamin/Chris Jericho vs. Edge/Christian ***1/2 3/28/05 Chris Benoit/Chris Jericho/Shelton Benjamin vs. Tyson Tomko/Christian/Edge ***1/2 4/3/05 Eddy Guerrero vs. Rey Mysterio ***1/4 4/3/05 Edge vs. Chris Benoit vs. Shelton Benjamin vs. Kane vs. Chris Jericho vs. Christian (Ladder) ****1/2 4/3/05 Randy Orton vs. Undertaker ***1/2 4/3/05 Shawn Michaels vs. Kurt Angle ****3/4 4/4/05 Edge vs. Chris Benoit **** 4/14/05 Kurt Angle vs. Eddy Guerrero ****1/4 5/1/05 Chris Jericho vs. Shelton Benjamin ***1/2 5/1/05 Chris Benoit vs. Edge (Last Man Standing) **** 5/1/05 Batista vs. Triple H *** 5/2/05 Shelton Benjamin vs. Shawn Michaels ****1/2 5/2/05 Edge vs. Chris Jericho ***1/2 5/2/05 Triple H vs. Chris Benoit ***1/2 5/5/05 Chavo Guerrero vs. Rey Mysterio (Street Fight) ***1/2 5/9/05 Edge vs. Shawn Michaels ***1/4 5/22/05 Joey Mercury/Johnny Nitro vs. Hardcore Holly/Charlie Haas ***1/4 5/22/05 Kurt Angle vs. Booker T ***1/4 5/22/05 Eddie Guerrero vs. Rey Mysterio ***3/4 5/22/05 John Cena vs. John Bradshaw Layfield (I Quit) ****1/4 6/9/05 Kurt Angle vs. Booker T ***1/4 6/12/05 Chris Jericho vs. Lance Storm (ECW) ***1/4 6/12/05 Sabu vs. Rhyno (ECW) ***1/4 6/12/05 Chris Benoit vs. Eddy Guerrero (ECW) ***1/4 6/12/05 Masato Tanaka vs. Mike Awesome (ECW) ****1/4 6/12/05 Sandman/Tommy Dreamer vs. Bubba Ray Dudley/D-Von Dudley (ECW) ***1/2 6/23/05 Eddy Guerrero vs. Rey Mysterio **** 6/26/05 Shawn Michaels vs. Kurt Angle ****1/2 6/26/05 John Cena vs. Chris Jericho vs. Christian ***3/4 6/26/05 Triple H vs. Batista (Hell in a Cell) ****1/2 6/27/05 Ric Flair vs. Kurt Angle ***1/2 7/16/05 Chris Benoit vs. William Regal ****1/4 7/21/05 Eddy Guerrero vs. Chris Benoit ***1/2 7/24/05 Eddy Guerrero vs. Rey Mysterio ***1/4 8/18/05 Chris Benoit vs. Randy Orton ***1/4 8/21/05 Rey Mysterio vs. Eddy Guerrero (Ladder)***1/2 8/21/05 John Cena vs. Chris Jericho ***3/4 8/21/05 Shawn Michaels vs. Hulk Hogan ***1/2 8/22/05 Kurt Angle vs. Shelton Benjamin ***3/4 8/22/05 Chris Jericho vs. John Cena (You're Fired)***1/2 Meltzer's ratings in 2005. Thoughts? I think he's a nut, personally. I like Meltzer, but I don't trust his opinions on wrestling MATCHES at all. **** for Eddie/Rey when he gives higher ratings to matches like the damn elimination chamber!? How on EARTH is that crappy match ****1/4? Tanaka/Awesome as good as Benoit/Regal? Sure. It's like last year, when he said Orton/Edge was better than Eddie/JBL and Eddie/Brock. He overrates matches, I accept this. But, seriously, at least show some consistency. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Placebo Effect 0 Report post Posted August 30, 2005 The worst rating possible and it's overrated? <{POST_SNAPBACK}> You suck at sarcasm. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CanadianChris 0 Report post Posted August 30, 2005 Bret-Shawn from Surv. Series 92 was better than Bret/DBS? <{POST_SNAPBACK}> That's actually true. Obviously, they had a much better crowd at Summerslam, but the Survivor Series match was excellent, better than the Iron Man match at WMXII. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
The Mandarin 0 Report post Posted August 30, 2005 the damn elimination chamber!? How on EARTH is that crappy match ****1/4? I'd suggest you re-watch that match. It's easily the best Elimination Chamber ever and is at least ***1/2 higher than anything else on the NYR show. Meltzer's ratings are pretty odd. I thought Flair/Angle was better than Michaels/Angle from Vengeance and he gave the Vengeance match ****1/2 and Flair's match ***1/2. I'd say it's more like ***3/4 vs. Flair, ***1/2 vs. Michaels. And some of the rest is garbage too. Tanaka/Awesome was not nearly that good. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dark Age 0 Report post Posted August 30, 2005 If everything else on that show is -* or so, then yeah. Actaully, everything IS about -*. His ratings are still nuts though. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
cabbageboy 0 Report post Posted August 30, 2005 WM 19: 3.0556 WM 21: 2.5 WM 17: 2.3182 WM 12: 2.2 WM 20: 2.1875 WM 13: 2.1786 WM 10: 2.1667 WM 14: 1.8125 WM 6: 1.7143 WM 3: 1.6667 WM 11: 1.6429 WM 18: 1.6364 WM 7: 1.5357 WM 9: 1.4167 WM 16: 1.3056 WM 1: 1.28125 WM 15: 1.1389 WM 2: 1.0625 WM 8: 0.8889 WM 4: 0.75 WM 5: 0.6607 Interesting that I just watched WM 19 and frankly thought the show wasn't worth a shit. It was a decent Michaels/Jericho match with the wrong guy winning, Lesnar damn near killing himself by fucking up, and HHH killing Booker's career. And a stale Austin/Rock match. Sorry but it isn't anywhere close to being the best WM, despite these ratings. Ironically WM 4 and 5 rank among my favorite shows and they are dead last here. Maybe booking and storyline is as big a part of enjoying the show as the actual wrestling? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dark Age 0 Report post Posted August 30, 2005 19 was fine for wrestling, but had some terrible booking. Book/Trips was good, Jeircho/Shawn was better. Rock/Austin was one of my favourite matches of the year, and just seemed way more important than most other WWE matches. Angle/Brock was pretty good, even if it was overrated. Hogan/Vince was fun. Undercard was rushed but solid. Only match I didn't really enjoy much was the 3 way tag. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
World's Worst Man 0 Report post Posted August 31, 2005 Meltzer's ratings in 2005. Thoughts? I think he's a nut, personally. I like Meltzer, but I don't trust his opinions on wrestling MATCHES at all. **** for Eddie/Rey when he gives higher ratings to matches like the damn elimination chamber!? How on EARTH is that crappy match ****1/4? Tanaka/Awesome as good as Benoit/Regal? Sure. It's like last year, when he said Orton/Edge was better than Eddie/JBL and Eddie/Brock. He overrates matches, I accept this. But, seriously, at least show some consistency. <{POST_SNAPBACK}> You mean Awesome vs. Tanaka at ONS wasn't ****1/4? Who knows, maybe Dave's ratings are based off a 10 star system these days. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
