The influcence of mixed martial arts in pro wrestling

[Black Lushus 0]

heh

[FroGG_NeaL 0]

I ate some beef stew the other day.

 

I followed my grandma's recipe.

 

It turned out good.

[Lord of The Curry 0]

It's funny when somebody thinks they're going to derail a thread and they don't.

 

Try harder next time Vyce. And thanks to everybody who's contributed so far. Great thread.

[razazteca 0]

This thread needs a 5 paragraph rant on how a top wrist lock became a finisher.

[KingPK 0]

I'm also fond of chicken tortilla soup. I have my own recipe, which is fairly tasty. I slow cook the chicken before hand, so that it's so tender it will literally pull apart at you fingertips. Add some tomatoes, some broth, onions, assorted spices, maybe some beans if I'm feeling it. Not usually corn, although I like corn; I'll save the corn for the tortillas. The tortillas are added after the fact, of course.

 

Knock it off.

[Lord of The Curry 0]

C'mon now, you have to appreciate the attempt.

 

Failed attempt, that is.

[KingPK 0]

It was annoying then, it's annoying now.

 

Back to the topic, I agree with MisawaGQ; I just think MMA and wrestling are two completely different worlds that really can't mesh very well. WWE matches have panned out in basically the same way for years (Finishers end matches) and it will take a lot of retraining the fans for anything else to be accepted. Conversely, MMA fans won't watch an MMA-based character when they already have charismatic guys like Tito Ortiz that bring some of the spectacle of pro wrestling to the sport.

 

As we've seen with the buildup to Ortiz/Shamrock, Dana White is already starting to think like a Vince McMahon in how he promotes his big matches. He's just got to not turn into another Don King.

[Lord of The Curry 0]

The "feud" (though I wouldn't call it that) between Matt Hughes and Georges St. Pierre has written itself better then anything WWE has done this decade, hands down so in that way Dana has already established that his company can tell a more compelling story then WWE and they don't need writers and producers to pull it off.

[Lei Tong 0]

Now you're just being Canadian.

[Vyce 0]

Odd, when one of you MMA faggots derail a wrestling thread with soup talk, suddenly it's hilarious........

 

Anyway, the one type of soup I cannot abide is butternut squash. I have never been a fan of squash, ever, and I just can't eat any sort of soup product derived from it. Hideously awful. If I am ever presented with such a soup, I always politely decline.

 

So what say you-all? Do you like butternut squash soup? If not, would you enjoy it more if Chuck Liddell came in it?

[CanadianChick 0]

Odd, when one of you MMA faggots derail a wrestling thread with soup talk, suddenly it's hilarious........

 

Anyway, the one type of soup I cannot abide is butternut squash. I have never been a fan of squash, ever, and I just can't eat any sort of soup product derived from it. Hideously awful. If I am ever presented with such a soup, I always politely decline.

 

So what say you-all? Do you like butternut squash soup? If not, would you enjoy it more if Chuck Liddell came in it?

 

It was annoying then, it's annoying now.

[PLAGIARISM! 0]

Silliness is part of wrestling. And it should be.

[Lord of The Curry 0]

Odd, when one of you MMA faggots derail a wrestling thread with soup talk, suddenly it's hilarious........

 

Anyway, the one type of soup I cannot abide is butternut squash. I have never been a fan of squash, ever, and I just can't eat any sort of soup product derived from it. Hideously awful. If I am ever presented with such a soup, I always politely decline.

 

So what say you-all? Do you like butternut squash soup? If not, would you enjoy it more if Chuck Liddell came in it?

 

You get points for continued effort even in the face of utter defeat.

[Golgo 13 0]

I'm guilty of it and it doesn't make it right, but those threads were honestly awful. The impact of MMA on wrestling and vice versa is a bigger concern than this week's news fluff or some rehashed topic or boneheaded question what with the rise of MMA and wrestling promoters wanting to capitalize.

 

I like aspects MMA in my wrestling. In a bloodfeud, for example, I think it makes a hell of a lot more sense than Irish whips and a bunch of blatantly assisted maneuvers. I feel qualities of MMA in wrestling help to get hatred across better, but only if the wrestlers can make it work. Otherwise you get sloppily applied holds holds and poor attempts at groundwork which come across as forced, especially when the rest of the company isn't with that mindset.

 

As was also said... if wrestling really hopes to arbitrarily throw this stuff in and attract MMA fans who weren't wrestling fans already... fat chance. It very likely does more harm than good, instead setting yourself up to be dropped by wrestling fans who either dislike the direction or go on to discover MMA.

[Your Paragon of Virtue 0]

Vyce it's all about timing, if you did it in the beginning before anything was posted in response and derailed the thread, maybe you would have succeeded. You were too late as is.

 

Besides, there was only like one or two people that did it in the WWE folder before (Rudo and LOTC may in fact be the same person). So to ruin a thread (Check it, try to ruin) when a bunch of WWE Folder regulars as well as MMA fans that never really bothered to check out the wwe folder are also posting in it, is well, pretty stupid....which actually makes sense all things considered. Now that CC told you to stop, you probably will though. If only we could get Leena to scold you too, you'd probably never post about MMA again.

 

Anyway, do you have a source for that Brock Lesnar thing? Besides, it's hard to take what Pat says about Brock seriously when his number one HW in Tim Sylvia thinks he's God when it's quite clear that God is busy fighting on the other side of the pacific.

 

Something I think Wrestling has taken from MMA and can do more of is try to make it look more legitimate. I saw one match where they introduced characters just like they would before a fight when they were in the ring standing in their corners. Just overall presentation stuff. Another thing they can borrow is to try to push feuds over who is the better wrestler, rather than spilled coffee or something. These aren't mma specific though, these are the signs of any legitimate sport. But those are things I'm personally interested in, as a sports fan. Most people that watch Pro wrestling aren't really watching it for competition's sake obviously. This is why I don't think that they should really try to borrow anything from each other than presentation aspects. Anything else would take away from what it is.

[Lord of The Curry 0]

Seeing as how you've talked to both of us at the same time you damn well know we're not the same person.

 

Unless it was the same person doing both voices........

[razazteca 0]

The "feud" (though I wouldn't call it that) between Matt Hughes and Georges St. Pierre has written itself better then anything WWE has done this decade, hands down so in that way Dana has already established that his company can tell a more compelling story then WWE and they don't need writers and producers to pull it off.

We all know that the Frank Trigg fights were better. Trigg was talking shit about the champion but could'nt back it up in the octogon even heel tactics like low blows could'nt derail the champion. Trigg choked under pressure.

[Lord of The Curry 0]

No we don't.

 

And yes you're wrong.

[FroGG_NeaL 0]

I posted a serious post and a soup post in this thread.

 

I apoligise for the latter.

 

I've been watching some UFC lately and I'm diggin' it.

[PLAGIARISM! 0]

Expanding on my stance, I think there is definitely a place for MMA in wrestling. In big matches, if there's two guys who, in the eyes of the fans, have credibility as legitimate fighters (Angle mainly) who do loads of shoot inspired stuff then that's good, but I'd rather someone with an act like Ric Flair just stuck to his guns, for example. When guys get over by doing more traditional wrestling, they should stick to it. There's no point in Batista suddenly donning MMA gloves and doing MMA inspired takedowns and strikes, for instance, because he's over doing clotheslines and spinebusters. Doesn't mean someone who's more suited to MMA inspired moves shouldn't use them against him.

[LooseCannon25 0]

I do think MMA oriented moves could work in wrestling (WWE), but the submissions may not. The Kimura, Triangle choke, and armbar could look good enough to have credibility, but the problem is noone has really tapped to these moves in the past in WWE. Takers' triangle finishes noone and several wrestlers have had alternatives to armbars leglocks and chokes, but used them more as restholds. If wrestlers start tapping out to them now it would look kind of silly for fans that ave been watching wrestling for years.

 

WWE has tried before with MMA based guys.....Take Ken Shamrock for one, but let's all remember the guy before him that was MMA based that may slip alot of people's minds. They brought KAMA in back in 95 as an MMA based fighter and called him "The Supreme Fighting Machine". Obviously they were trying to work off the popularity of MMA and the UFC which had been around for about 2 years at the time KAMA came in.

[KingPK 0]

Something I think Wrestling has taken from MMA and can do more of is try to make it look more legitimate. I saw one match where they introduced characters just like they would before a fight when they were in the ring standing in their corners.

 

The NWA used to do that for championship matches all the time, so that isn't really something taken from MMA (boxing maybe, but not MMA).

[razazteca 0]

No we don't.

 

And yes you're wrong.

We Americans think so. I have'nt seen any UFC Unleashes to make think otherwise.

[LooseCannon25 0]

Something I think Wrestling has taken from MMA and can do more of is try to make it look more legitimate. I saw one match where they introduced characters just like they would before a fight when they were in the ring standing in their corners.

 

The NWA used to do that for championship matches all the time, so that isn't really something taken from MMA (boxing maybe, but not MMA).

 

 

It looks better and more important when they do the entrances, and then afterwards do the introductions. Except when Cena is involved and he starts throwing those terrible looking punches in his corner.

[Lord of The Curry 0]

My one fear starting this thread was that raza would use it to out his pro-wrestling meets mma fantasy booking.

 

Fears confirmed.

[razazteca 0]

It will come full circle if and only if Antonio Inoki vs Vince McMahon becomes the main event for Wrestlemania. Speaking of MMA crossing over to pro wrestling I saw a garbage hardcore match with every possible weapon used (TLC, barbed wire bat, cheese grater, pizza slicer, kendo stick, thumbtacks) end with the top keylock submission.

[Lord of The Curry 0]

As in a kimura with the dude applying the hold doing it from bottom position?

[Dandy 0]

I apologize in advance because I have not read the entire thread before posting this. Sorry if this has already been said.

 

There is nothing at all wrong with mixing MMA into the WWE style. I have been a pro wrestling fan since '83 at the age of 4 and I am alos a fan of MMA with very very minimal training in Brazilian Jui-Jitsu.

 

If we are, in theory, to suspend disbelief and think of WWE as real, where the winners of the matches get paid more than the losers, or each wrestler has a shot of winning huge amounts of money, then we should believe that people versed in an MMA style would want to join the WWE thinking they could be the top dog. We are to believe that pro wrestling is a real style of fighting, same as MMA styles. We have seen Shamrock and Dan Severn in WWE, as well as submissions and tapouts.

 

If Sylvester Terkay is the only wrestler given an MMA gimmick and makes people tap immediately, it does not undermine Flair having a figure four on someone and not getting a submission. Remember, we have seen Tough Enough training people in the "pro wrestling" style. We are to believe that a person learns how to perform as a pro wrestler, in both executing and taking pro wrestling maneuvers, but it really does hurt and the matches are not predetermined.

 

An MMA style worker could go against the grain and think that his style makes it unnecessary to learn the pro wrestling style, and he knows submissions and strikes better than anyone else on the roster. It would even work if he didn't finish running and bouncing off the ropes after an Irish Whip. We could conceivably believe that pro wrestlers finish running and bounce off the ropes with hope of executing an offensive maneuver, as that is the pro wrestling style.

 

Oh well, just my two cents.

[razazteca 0]

As in a kimura with the dude applying the hold doing it from bottom position?

If you are asking if it looked like the Kurt Angle vs Puder shoot then the answer would be no. The indy wrestler copied the Big Show's Cobra Clutch takedown spot (heel trip onto the knee) and CM Punk's arm submission (The Vice~). I wouldn't call it a kimura because it was not a straight armbar it was more like what CM Punk used on ECW but without the neck crank choke motion.

[Lei Tong 0]

 

Americana/top wristlock/keylock