RavishingRickRudo

I have been disappointed in their set design for a while now. Whomever they have in charge of that needs to be fired or repositioned in the company.

You just blew my mind with the hatch being a gateway to hell. Lost = Paradise Lost??

It was a thumbs down show because it was a $50 show, and I paid (err. owe ) half of it and I wouldn't consider that a show where I got my moneys worth. I have countless **** matches on my computer right now, and I got those for "free", so a show would have to have a lot more than 2 **** matches for it to be a thumbs up.

It's not pointless. It hurts the other wrestlers if they can't use blood in their matches, since blood is a dramatic element. I wondered why Rey didn't shoot up during his entrance, since its his trademark spot. HHH got to use it instead, and it was a very cool lil moment. HHH didnt need a cool moment, though. Whether Batista went over clean and whether he was "put over" are two very different things. Benoit went over clean last year too, but was never put over by HHH. Of course, HHH doesn't have his HBK feud to fall back on and main event with and they've set Edge up with Batista, so hey, maybe for a few months we'll get someone new on top. Maybe HHH will go over to Smackdown now that his Raw resources have dwindled.

The WWE is a daycare centre, and HHH is taking all the toys that the other children could play with, and is playing with them by himself.

To me, it sounded like the crowd mic was dummed down.

If you go back and actually read what I said, I was pretty spot on. I said Shawn and Angle were perfect for each other, but their match could only reach a certain limit. Both guys can work a crowd, work spots, and work a pace - and they did very well. They started out slow and built it up and ended with big high spots. I just didn't really see a story other than "Kurt tries the anklelock a lot".

Eddie/Rey - ** 1/2. I'm not as surprised as most people were about this being not very good, because they never live up to their Havoc match. There was too much pressure on them and no point to their match, so they just went out to do some "fun" stuff and when they lost their pacing, they were fucked. Some nifty spots, but nothing that we really haven't seen from them before. Ladder Match - I'd give this ****, I really enjoyed it. It was a total showcase for Benjamin, who did 3 really big spots, and Benoit was great in it too... so for someone who was essentially chipping in on the PPV to see this match, it delivered to an extent. It should have gone 10 minutes longer. Kane, Jericho, and Christian served no real purpose other than to catch and bump. Orton/Taker - To be honest, if you were to do a breakdown of every match, this would come in as the best match of the night. It lacked some energy though, so ***1/2. They did some nice psych and storytelling, Taker bumped like a madman. Did some nice spots at the end there. Could have used some juice. Bob Orton Sr. was fantastic. Stratus/Hemme - CRAP. Angle/HBK - It was pretty much exactly what I expected. ****, they did the best they could, but anything over that is ridiculous for a match that had no depth in storytelling. The opening mat stuff was bad, but it picked up after that and Curry and I mark huge for AnkleLock 03. I loved the anklepick spot at the end. Meltzer completely overrated it, but thats nothing new. Akebono/Show - let us never speak of this match again. JBL/Cena - Fucking HHH. It went way too short, there was a clear audible called by the ref 2 or 3 minutes before the finish because the crowd wasn't coming around for the match. There was none of the smoke and mirrors that HHH had, JBL and Cena both should have been wearing crimson and instead the match is cut short. JBL held the title for HOW many months and this is how he loses? As a match, I'd say **3/4. I enjoy JBL's style of wrestling, but he got too much offense in which was then no sold at the double clothesline spot where somehow they were both at equal energy. Could have been so much better. HHH/Batista. Fuck HHH. He got ALL the treatment. He was the only one allowed to gig, he rose from the fucking ground (hmm, and Rey didn't, I wonder why), he had Motorhead play him in, he got the main event billing, he went long and got to use all the stall tactics he usually uses in his matches with crap guys, and he got in way too much offense on Batista. The match was predictable up until the end spot with the pedigree into the pseudo ARC. To the point to where I got to LOTC "So, they gonna do a collar and elbow spot and fight over it" "Yup" "Press Slam spot?" "Yup" "Watch, there's going to be a Suplex spot in 2 minutes (10:32) *Suplex Spot (10:35)* SO DAMN CLOSE! Overall, as a _show_ it was a thumbs in the middle. Paying $25, it was a thumbs down.

BSG definitely has a DS9 vibe to it.

What they should do for the HOF DVD, is have wrestler commentary on the matches. The Iron Sheiks alone would be worth it. Then maybe some Heenan commentary, just coz. Heenan and Hogan doing commentary on WM 3 or something. Orton, Piper, Hogan, Orndorff doing commentary on WM 1.

Reading the live reports, it sounded like they cut down Hogans speech. That they gave more time to the applause than the speech kinda pissed me off.

I am FREAKING OUT right now.

New Jack coming out unannounced and Roadkill being more over than Hogan at Wm 18 was the most memorable thing at a wrestling event that I've ever seen. The "Wrestlemania Experience" can't hold a candle to that.

Hmm, the "wrestlemania experience" must've skipped WM 18, cause it felt like a big time RAW.

I want to like the show, since I like Sci-Fi and any show that has Callum Keith Renne with a messiah complex deserves my attention, but the problem is I don't like any of the characters. I sorta like the old, grey haired guy, EJO doesn't offend me, I regularly like Mary McDonald but not in this, the chick who plays Starbuck annoys the shit out of me, and the only character I'd say that I enjoy watching is the doctor but the thing with him and the blonde chick confuses me.

Shells and AHITW are, really, the same episode in the way it was structured and how it begins and ends with Younger Fred.

I liked No Mercy 2001 for the most part, I enjoyed the RR this year (mostly for the humour), I liked Summerslam A LOT more than most people did. I haven't really been insanely excited going into a PPV since... Backlash 2002? That was only because they did an amazing hype video for HHH vs. Hogan and I was like "OH MAN I GOTTA SEE THIS!" (I didn't, of course). That's not to say that I don't get excited for PPVs anymore, just not WWE PPV's. I get downright giddy for most MMA shows. But there's always a certain amount of interest I have in them (WWE shows), just to see what the outcomes are and how they booked it and all that fun smarkish stuff.

I never said MMA was pro wrestling, I said they share similar elements that make them relatable for wrestling fans. I think Meltzer is on the pipe with that assessment especially when his key argument is "Japanese Wrestling Magazines Cover it". I just cannot believe that this is supposed to be "The biggest show of the year", to me, with the build, it feels like a RAW. The angles either feel rushed or half-baked, and many have been thrown together just to put em on TV. Hey, this truly is WRESTLEMANIA!

I liked WM 19's atmosphere, and didn't much care for the beginning of the UN-BE-LIEVABLE! era of the WWE which was decidedly kiddish. I never thought much of MSG as an arena -aesthetically speaking- and Safeco Field (I believe) was a great place to have an event.

I remember when you said you'd be willing to get banned if it meant me getting banned. It was, like, the biggest compliment I've ever gotten. I also love to hear all this excitement about Mania and then I hear lots of "decents" and "not bads" in describing th ematches. I don't pay $50 for "decent". If you do, could you send me over some $$$, I have some wooden nickels that you might be interested in.

I'd moreso credit Linda with that. She seems to have a better grasp on marketing and the business-end than Vince does (which is different from "promoting"). This is, of course, my impressions of them, where she -in interviews- talks like a business person while Vince, though he tries to talk the talk, ends up sounding more like a carny than anything else. Linda was hand-in-hand with Vince during the WWE's reign-of-terror and was involved in all the processes, especially on the business end. She didn't have to book like Vince did, so she had more involvement in developing their business model. If you look at it now, she's the one training Shane to take over the business-side, and Vince is with Steph at the creative-end.

Since then? Even the beloved WM X? Nope. WM X always had a different "feel" for me. Which is perhaps why I tend to look at their top two matches as being severely overrated. Somewhere along the way my interest died, probably because they put more of a focus on RAW and less on Superstars and I missed out on a lot of angles. That, and Hogan was gone.

No Rudo i'm not 11. I'm a grown man who chooses to like wrestling over a bunch of punk ass UFC fighters (they're both a work anyway.) You're more akin to pavlovs dogs in the way you are "always excited" for Wrestlemania. MMA bores me, like WWE obviously bores you. The difference is, i'm not acting like a bitch because you don't like WWE. You on the other hand is acting like a female about MY choices. Stop being so emotional. You're putting too much importance on yourself, here. I generally can't stand when people lick up Vinces shit and say it tastes like chocolate. The WWE wouldn't bore me if they put on better shows. I ask myself "Is this the best they can do?" in terms of making matches and building the show and the answer is a resounding NO. And for $50, they should be giving it their best effort. But since there are fans like you who are willing to accept the crap they spew out, fans like me have to suffer through their mediocrity. Neither UFC or Pride have the top fighters in the world. Boxers are the top fighters in the world. Boxers don't lay on each other for 10-15 minutes they actually fight. Put the top boxer against a top MMA fighter in a street fight. The boxer would be creamed. "Punching" is not "fighting". Boxers may be the best "punchers" in the world, but they are no where near the best fighters. Does MMA make moe money then WWE? MMA doesn't run the same sort of shows, it's business and operations model is different. The "works" in MMA are as frequent as the "***** match" in the WWE.

So basically, you don't like wrestling. No, basically, I don't like bad wrestling. I also don't like the prospect of having to pay $50 for an uninspired show. I don't know how anyone could. Maybe I'm just poor or something, but that's a lot of money to be spending on one event. I'd want to get my money's worth. If I hadn't been here for years of you talking about how the "best thing for the business" was for Benoit to win every match clean, have none of the heels ever say anything bad about him, and main event every PPV, Raw, and Smackdown, I'd think that you were just a gimmick poster that was here to tell us how wrestling sucked. All I ever wanted was Benoit to be an important player in the WWE, and for him to be in a storyline that can maximize his potential. It never happened. The fact is that WM has a way better looking card than it has the last couple years. But since OMG~BENOIT's not in the main event, you don't care, and we're stupid for caring. I was incredibly negative of the WM 3 way last year, still am. Benoit ME'd that. The fact is, for $50 the card is not very good at all, and compared to actual good shows like PRIDE and UFC's, it's particularly poor. And then we have to hear about MMA which has nothing to do with this thread, and which the vast majority of us could give a fuck less about. I think it has a certain amount of relevance here. Our perspective on how good the card is is based on our experience and knowledge of other promotions. This card appears good to some people here because the majority of their wrestling experience is the WWE. Their scale for "good shows" is much weaker than someone who has viewed more promotions and more -and better- shows. Once I felt the excitement of watching a live MMA show, a live wrestling show (even *in the arena*) still can't manage to compare. I mean really, Angle/HBK, and HHH/Batista are the same match? Just stop posting in this thread until you get over yourself I never mentioned Angle/HBK. Read it again, dumbass.

By "Business Model" I mean the magazines, syndicated television, sponsorship, music, food, branding and licenses etc. It's traditional brand extensions applied to wrestling, not the formulas for pushing wrestlers.