Who's greater

[Guest BANKYWOOD]

Two very different genres. But who did more for music, did more for their certain genre, exposed that genre to the mainstream, and has a overall greater musical catalogue?

[Guest cobainwasmurdered]

It's Johnny buddy. I will win the arguement

[Guest BANKYWOOD]

Right. If anyone had HALF of a brain, they would recognize Davis' musical accomplishments far outreach Johnny's.

[justsoyouknow 0]

Miles Davis exposed his genre to the mainstream? Cash released several excellent live CDs that showcased his "comman man" demeanor, allowing him to connect with the listener on a more personal level.

[kkktookmybabyaway 0]

Cash becasue I'm a racist...

[Guest BANKYWOOD]

Miles Davis exposed his genre to the mainstream? Cash released several excellent live CDs that showcased his "comman man" demeanor, allowing him to connect with the listener on a more personal level.

What Cash did with lyrics, Davis did with music. His musicianship was all he needed. Conveying emotions through music without lyrics can, and most of the time is, more powerful. I dig on Johnny Cash, don't get me wrong. But Miles Davis catalogue is fucking ridiculous. How he changed jazz music, and made several landmark albums that music critiques, not jazz critiques, claim to be as some of the greatest of alltime. Johnny Cash never truly had any great albums, aside from the novelty of San Quintin and Folson Prison, until he started working with Rubin. He just had certain radio songs that were catchy and ones that people could relate to. Aside from those radio songs, he didn't have that much else - Davis did have that.

[The Ghost of bps21 0]

Johnny Cash.

 

You could ask this question as Cash vs. anyone in music ever and I'll still vote the same.

[justsoyouknow 0]

Miles Davis exposed his genre to the mainstream? Cash released several excellent live CDs that showcased his "comman man" demeanor, allowing him to connect with the listener on a more personal level.

What Cash did with lyrics, Davis did with music. His musicianship was all he needed. Conveying emotions through music without lyrics can, and most of the time is, more powerful. I dig on Johnny Cash, don't get me wrong. But Miles Davis catalogue is fucking ridiculous. How he changed jazz music, and made several landmark albums that music critiques, not jazz critiques, claim to be as some of the greatest of alltime. Johnny Cash never truly had any great albums, aside from the novelty of San Quintin and Folson Prison, until he started working with Rubin. He just had certain radio songs that were catchy and ones that people could relate to. Aside from those radio songs, he didn't have that much else - Davis did have that.

Davis may have been a better performer, but people could relate much more easily with Cash, therefore they were more eager to get into similar music. His interview with Merle Haggard on the "Live from San Quentin" CD got a few people that I know listening to Merle Haggard, so all is well. And I'm not ragging on Davis, the man was a genius, but Cash was more accessible.

[ArkhamGlobe 0]

I haven't listened nearly as much to either as I'd like, but for innovation and the like I'd go with Davis in a heartbeat (it may also have something to do with the fact that I much prefer jazz to country).

[Edwin MacPhisto 0]

This should be a chip shot for Miles Davis. Fun sidenote: I've never actually met a serious Johnny Cash fan.

[Giuseppe Zangara 0]

I've never actually met a serious Johnny Cash fan.

It's so hip to like Johnny Cash. You don't have to really like country to appreciate him, while enjoying Miles Davis requires that you actually like jazz (in its many forms, too). I suppose if Davis--had he lived long enough--covered Nine Inch Nails or Soundgarden, I'd be singing a different tune.

[Edwin MacPhisto 0]

More importantly: why not Charizard? My only guess is potential ejaculation jokes.

[k thx 0]

Musically, people admire Cash. People are inspired by Davis.

 

I go with Miles

[nl5xsk1 0]

I like Cash's music better, but voted for Miles. In terms of influence, and place in music history, Miles is up there with the ultra-elite.

 

Johnny is great, and it's cool to see all these younger kids get into him, but it still won't equal the level of fame and influence that Miles has had for the last several decades.

 

The fact that it took a Nine In Nails cover and his death to get Cash any real mainstream attention is proof that Davis wins the argument.

[Mecha Mummy 0]

Close one as I like both, but I went with Miles due to his aforementioned greater impact on music in general.

[Youth N Asia 0]

There is no denying Davis' greatness, but I prefer Cash.

[C Dubya 04 0]

I think that it's really hard to say who is greater, since they have such differing styles. They both were incredibly influential to their respective genres as well.

 

On a side note, it kind of annoys me that people are calling Cash a fad and what not because he achieved late success in life for covering NIN. That really belittles what he accomplished in his younger years. For much of the late sixties/early seventies he was one of the most popular/influential mainstream musical performers. There were an absolut ton of Cash fans before his recent resurgence. He just reached a new generation of fans with his recent releases.

[Sonic Reducer 0]

You really can't compare Jazz to Country.

 

Not to classify either of them, but their styles are so different.

 

I personally like 'em both.

[Nighthawk 0]

Davis, because he was more of an innovator. The evolution of jazz over the 50 years or so of his career could almost be summed up in one man.

[Guest BANKYWOOD]

I think that it's really hard to say who is greater, since they have such differing styles. They both were incredibly influential to their respective genres as well.

 

On a side note, it kind of annoys me that people are calling Cash a fad and what not because he achieved late success in life for covering NIN. That really belittles what he accomplished in his younger years. For much of the late sixties/early seventies he was one of the most popular/influential mainstream musical performers. There were an absolut ton of Cash fans before his recent resurgence. He just reached a new generation of fans with his recent releases.

To coin a phrase, its like comparing apples to oranges. Regardless of how different they are, I still like apples more. Y'dig? So choosing which artist one enjoys or considers a greater influence shouldn't be such a chore.

 

I think Cash certainly has been made out to be greater than he truly was. His image has been tweaked to be a rebellious, drug taking bad ass. The fact is, he's been arrested twice (never incarcerated) and was addicted to pills. If one wanted to ponder Davis' streak of debauchery (sp?) they need not look further than his prolonged abuse of heroin, numerous arrests, many sexual escapades, and seemingly volatile personalily. Simply put, Miles Davis makes Johnny Cash seem as menacing as Big Bird.

 

The whole NIN thing was genius. It was a great song, emotional song that did apply to a man nearing his death who was reminiscing about his life. Fuck, the song and the coinciding video is fucking brilliant. There is a reason why it captivated so many people.

 

His Unearthed box set is also pretty fucking cool. But wanna know something? his most memorable shit has been written for him. His most popular albums were novelty releases. The only albums ANY of you can name have been cover song albums or the jail releases. Shit, most country fans probably couldn't name the album Ring of Fire was originally released on. But everyone jazz fan, or casual jazz fan knows Kind of Blue, Sketches of Spain, Birth of the Cool, and so on. The people's careers who Davis has spawned in his numerous quartets and such are still going strong today. Coltrane, Roach, McChloughlan (sp?), Elvin Jones, Hancock, Mingus, Thelonious Monk. All guys who have had successful jazz careers for over 30 years after playing with Davis.

 

Who did Cash spawn? Merle Haggard? Who else? Not many.

 

Think back to a few months ago when a poster here started a thread about the 50 most influential people in music. He didn't include jazz people on that list because that genre is so different than everything else. It incapsulates so much more than rock music, and has a more wide ranging audience than anything else. In Canada, there aren't any big rock festivals. There isn't any big country festiavls. But go to the individual cities (Montreal, Calgary, even Saskatoon) and they ALL have big fat fucking Jazz festivals that are huge money for their city. Everything is sold out when these festivals come around. Country doesn't have that kind of following.

 

But if one was to start a 50 most influential list on jazz, Miles Davis would be smack dab on top of it. The man didn't neccesarily create jazz, he just did it better than anyone else. He didn't create fusion, but he was the first to do it at such an amazing level. I'd maybe put Dizzie Gillespie or Charlie Parker above Miles...but thats about it.

[WrestlingDeacon 0]

You know, Edwin, I've never met a serious Miles Davis fan.

 

I am a real Johnny Cash fan and was so long before his death. Hell, I even have a vinyl album by his brother Tommy in my collection. Reading through this thread I find that people are either overhyping Cash or underselling him and both are far off base. You people don't know jackshit about Johnny Cash, only about the past year of his history.

 

If you examine Cash and Davis from all the fundamental elements that make a music career (musicianship, songwriting, etc.) Davis beats Cash in just about every category but stage presence.

 

However, Cash's impact on society and American culture kills Davis' ten fold. Johnny Cash was instrumental in the birth of rock 'n roll and was the first crossover artist between that and country music in history. Cash inspired and influenced many rock pioneers such as Elvis, Jerry Lee Lewis, Buddy Holly and Roy Orbison and all have said so in interviews. Cash was the first major country star to have his own variety show and it was the second most popular such program during it's lifetime after the Dean Martin show. Cash introduced mainstream audiences to the likes of Bob Dylan, Linda Ronstadt and gave a boost to the then emerging singer/songwriter tradition that became big in the seventies. Several performers of that genre, such as Harry Chapin and Joni Mitchell, have also stated their love and influence by Cash. Johnny Cash was also the first performer to play prisons and college campuses and the was first celebrity to give mainstream exposure to their plight and concerns along with speaking out for the poor, homeless and other societal castoffs before that became trendy for celebrities to do. Cash was also instrumental in giving a foundation to the outlaw music of the seventies and gave boosts to the careers of Waylon Jennings, Merle Haggard, Willie Nelson and especially Kris Kristofferson through his friendship and recording of their songs. Johnny Cash is a cultural icon based on his style and personality and outside of the druggie badass label that the uneducated want to slap on him, the real personality of Cash is that of a pioneer, trailblazer and creative force who used his celebrity to give light to music and issues he felt were important and worthy of exposure.

[Henry Spencer 0]

Miles Davis, although both are cool.

[godthedog 0]

who did more for music

music in general? probably miles.

 

did more for their certain genre

miles. he lead the whole medium out of bebop. i can't point to any specific musical practice in country & say "nobody did that before johnny cash." i can point to any number of things with miles.

 

exposed that genre to the mainstream

cash, definitely. while everybody knows who miles is, most people's exposure to him is very indirect. mainstream audiences haven't seen his performances and generally don't buy his albums. cash's mainstream exposure has been very direct: everyone has seen/heard several johnny cash performances/songs.

 

has a overall greater musical catalogue

for innovation, depth & variety, miles's catalog kills just about every other musician of the 20th century. he would crap a great record before breakfast every morning.

 

going by banky's standards, it's miles 3-1.

[Guest The Winter Of My Discontent]

Ah. But when someone decides to dabble in jazz who is the first person they check out? Miles Davis. In country music there are plenty of people (including Cash) who they could check out. But anyone/everyone getting into jazz is introduced to it through Miles Davis' music. Usually Kind of Blue.

[The Ghost of bps21 0]

Did you vote with both of your screen names?

[Guest The Winter Of My Discontent]

Did you vote with both of your screen names?

No, CWM wouldn't let me.

[The Ghost of bps21 0]

I have to say this is much closer than I thought it would be.

 

I voted for Cash but fully expected him to lose by double digits.

[Guest The Winter Of My Discontent]

I have to say this is much closer than I thought it would be.

 

I voted for Cash but fully expected him to lose by double digits.

You thought Cash would lose?

[The Ghost of bps21 0]

Yes.

 

Because if I had never heard either of their music (which is a strong possability with some voters) I'd vote for Davis just because voting for Jazz > than voting for country.

[Guest The Winter Of My Discontent]

Yes.

 

Because if I had never heard either of their music (which is a strong possability with some voters) I'd vote for Davis just because voting for Jazz > than voting for country.

No way. In the past year Cash has gone past his country label. People now consider him a musical icon because of how he re-invented himself. If Cash wouldn't have put out that NIN single, this contest would be over. But because of his death and amazing cover songs, he's gained a whole new audience who could give a shit that he could be considered "a country singer".