Oh yeah, he went there

[Justice 0]

Okay, my entire look at the thing:

 

I think the most important line Kerry said is that "He couldn't think". It shows that he was sufficiently dazed from the sheer incredulity of the entire event. I doubt this goes down any more when you are in charge of the country under attack. I'm sure this probably INCREASES the amount of fogginess because not only is this horrific event going on, but YOU are the person who will be in charge of responding to it. That would sufficiently daze me, and I can completely understand. Do I think that Kerry's bullshitting? A bit; he's trying to use a minor event to make Bush seem unqualified by telling us how he would theoretically act. I really doubt he would do that, in all honesty; an event of that magnitude is such a system shock that I doubt he'd be doing anything but sitting and thinking for a few minutes on exactly what you want to do. Does this change my opinion of Kerry? Not really, no. Does it affect my opinion of Bush? No, not really either.

Well then one could argue that there is a major difference between watching coverage on tv of the attacks, and having someone whipser into yor ear, "america is under attack" and not having a clue anything else about.

Fair enough, but I still think that even that could cause substantial shock to ones own mind to keep you from doing anything for at least a few minutes, if not more. I doubt any President would have done differently than what Bush did, and frankly I wouldn't hold it against them if they did. It's an utterly stupid way to judge one's character, in my honest opinion.

[Guest thebigjig]

It's a MONKEY ISLAND reference you ridiculous self righteous ass

It was a SHITTY reference regardless, you unoriginal twatrock.

-=Mike

Oh FUCK YOU, Mike. Monkey Island references are fucking GOLD, especially this case. You should try the God damn game before dissing it.

 

A Devoted MI Fan.

its very cool we agree on something! I've been a fan since 1994

 

is that a rubber chicken in your pocket, or are you just happy to see me?

[NoCalMike 0]

Okay, my entire look at the thing:

 

I think the most important line Kerry said is that "He couldn't think". It shows that he was sufficiently dazed from the sheer incredulity of the entire event. I doubt this goes down any more when you are in charge of the country under attack. I'm sure this probably INCREASES the amount of fogginess because not only is this horrific event going on, but YOU are the person who will be in charge of responding to it. That would sufficiently daze me, and I can completely understand. Do I think that Kerry's bullshitting? A bit; he's trying to use a minor event to make Bush seem unqualified by telling us how he would theoretically act. I really doubt he would do that, in all honesty; an event of that magnitude is such a system shock that I doubt he'd be doing anything but sitting and thinking for a few minutes on exactly what you want to do. Does this change my opinion of Kerry? Not really, no. Does it affect my opinion of Bush? No, not really either.

Well then one could argue that there is a major difference between watching coverage on tv of the attacks, and having someone whipser into yor ear, "america is under attack" and not having a clue anything else about.

Fair enough, but I still think that even that could cause substantial shock to ones own mind to keep you from doing anything for at least a few minutes, if not more. I doubt any President would have done differently than what Bush did, and frankly I wouldn't hold it against them if they did. It's an utterly stupid way to judge one's character, in my honest opinion.

For the record I don't hold it against Bush for what he did. I am not mad, outraged, engorged in anger etc.......I am simply just responding to MikeSC claiming that Kerry is somehow a liar because he answered a hypothetical question to a make believe scenario that never existed.....

 

 

Oh and I apologize for my overall poor grammar today, I am at work so it I don't really have time to proofread...

[CheesalaIsGood 0]

Lets not overlook that in waiting the 7 minutes Bush did make a mistake. A forgivable mistake but mistake nonetheless. As an issue (which it IS considering how much debate has been lended to it) it is a small one and I doubt would be the turing point for any independent voting. Nor should it be. But if this is being cast as one of "Moores talking points" then the attempts to minimize his influence has failed.

 

In conclusion, I will now investigate this mystery known as Monkey Island.

[Vyce 0]

No, it's rather sad that Kerry apparently is having to resort to aping pages from the Michael Moore playbook in his efforts to attack Bush.

 

I suppose he's more worried about the lack of a convention bounce than he's letting on. I have to agree with Downhome back on the first page - this move by Kerry was one of the first things he's done which reeks of very sad desperation.

[Guest MikeSC]

BTW, about the vets "rescinding" their criticism, a few things:

 

First off, please note a name:

Veteran retracts criticism of Kerry

By Michael Kranish, Globe Staff  |  August 6, 2004

Care to guess the name of the person who is writing the forward for the official campaign book for the Edwards/Kerry campaign?

From this little nugget of shit, I can assume that you're implying that because the reporter is a visible supporter of John Kerry, that his report is somewhat biased.

Yup, basically.

 

Except throw out that "somewhat" word.

Let me ask you Mike, what does this matter? What makes you think that this story would have been any different had it been written by anyone else at the Globe?

If David Frum broke a story on Kerry that made him look horrible --- would you blindly accept it? Especially since the vet in question said he is lying?

Did Kranish choke the veteran until he recanted his words against Kerry? Did he lock him in a hole in the ground until he got the story he wanted to hear?

 

What's your point?

The vet said the story is false. It just seems odd that the ONLY media source EVER described as being biased is Fox News --- yet you have this paper publish a story that is disputed heavily by the TARGET and it's written by somebody with an undeniable idealogical axe to grind.

 

Nothing to worry about THERE. No sir.

Oh FUCK YOU, Mike. Monkey Island references are fucking GOLD, especially this case. You should try the God damn game before dissing it.

 

A Devoted MI Fan.

Tried it. Hated it. Only LucasArts adventure titles I ever enjoyed were Sam & Max Hit the Road and Grim Fandango.

Mike, here's how I'm interpreting your perspective. Correct me if I'm wrong, cause I don't want to misrepresent you:

 

Environment and situation - such as being the head of a company vs. a low-level employee, or a senator vs. a chief executive - have no effect on how an individual acts, reacts, and makes decisions.

No --- how one acts in a moment of PANIC doesn't change based on job title. How one acts in a moment of crisis won't change with job titles.

-=Mike

[St. Gabe 0]

Mike, here's how I'm interpreting your perspective. Correct me if I'm wrong, cause I don't want to misrepresent you:

 

Environment and situation - such as being the head of a company vs. a low-level employee, or a senator vs. a chief executive - have no effect on how an individual acts, reacts, and makes decisions.

No --- how one acts in a moment of PANIC doesn't change based on job title. How one acts in a moment of crisis won't change with job titles.

-=Mike

But, it HAS to. I don't care how incredulous it sounds to hear "america is under attack" at an elementary school, or if it "shocks" you. Kerry shouldn't have commented on it, because he was in the same situation (sorta), but If you are the President of The United States, the most powerful man in the free world, shocked or not, thinking or not, you get your ass up and go. Don't you? It doesn't do much to argue the point now, and he probably couldn't have done much, but wouldn't it have been a bit more pro-active for him to have excused himself immediately and gotten briefed on what was going on?

 

I understand human nature, but I truly believe at a certain point, a large responsibility has to dictate the actions one takes.

 

=Gabe

[Dr. Tyler; Captain America 0]

I don't know, but if I was the president and I heard "America is being attacked," I'd be more than curious to find out, like, how we're being attacked. I wouldn't prolong my lack of knowledge about the situation by reading about a fucking goat or whatever. But really, it doesn't even matter. It's a non-issue in the long run. I'm just saying how I'd react. So don't flame me.

 

Or do, what the fuck do I care. I'm going to bed anyway, chances are you'll be posting back and forth to yourself for a few hours as it is.

[Special K 0]

I still think Bush should've acted, buit that's beacuse I hold the president to be better than me. I would've just wanted to hold my gf/wife close, which is exactly what I did.

[Styles 0]

I still think Bush should've acted, buit that's beacuse I hold the president to be better than me. I would've just wanted to hold my gf/wife close, which is exactly what I did.

Did you hold both at the same time?

[Jobber of the Week 0]

I don't approve Kerry attacking the President on this issue but I think it's playing out very well with the public regardless. It's lowblow politics that appeals to the lowest common denominator, and I'd feel ashamed about it but Bush/Rove seems to own the patent on it, which makes me feel better.

 

I'm suprised he didn't attack the new Bushism instead. If Bush is still making these flubs two months before the debate, Kerry is going to toast him.

[Special K 0]

Of course it's been overblown. (*and it was my gf*) I think Bush should've gotten out of there and seen what was up, but on the whole, he did what any decent president would've done once he was presenting himself to the nation. (and yeah, Gore would;ve done the same thing. people seem to like to say that he would have gone touchy-feely immediately.)

 

no one should explot or defame others based on 9/11. I think it has been safely established that it was a major, general failing, and it brought to the forefront the terrorism issue, which no one imagined would be what it is now.

[Stephen Joseph 0]

This is still going on?

 

BTW, is there anyone else who would like to see CE without the ByeByeBush or Kerry Sucks two words asinine comments? I mean seriously, if you don't have anything constructive to say, just don't post.

 

That being said, I honestly don't read anything into Kerry's comment. I think Edwin is right, Kerry really didnt have much of an option, he had to say something to not appear weak, and he did it without mentioning Bush.

[kkktookmybabyaway 0]

BTW, is there anyone else who would like to see CE without the ByeByeBush or Kerry Sucks two words asinine comments?

Well then go save another message board, bitch. I love the petty name-calling...

[Guest Wildbomb 4:20]

Hereby seconded.

 

You know, it's amazing that we're still talking about said seven minutes in a classroom, when I think that most of us probably would have reacted in the same way. We can all talk about the way we would have HOPED to react in the same hypothetical situation, but that doesn't mean that's how it would happen. In fact, we can't find out how said reaction would take place, unless suddenly we back track four years, or if something happens in the future.

 

That having been said, I have no problem with what Kerry said over the delay. Why? Because he hasn't actually been placed in that situation. Again, it's all hypothetical. There's no evidence beyond what he did as Senator. Who knows? Maybe he would have done the same thing. Makes no difference now.

 

--Ryan

...who is out of creative insults for the day...

[Stephen Joseph 0]

BTW, is there anyone else who would like to see CE without the ByeByeBush or Kerry Sucks two words asinine comments?

Well then go save another message board, bitch. I love the petty name-calling...

This one is hardly saved ... yet

 

Don't worry KKK...Me and My ECONO-powers will soon transform this board into a utopian heaven

 

...with commies.

[kkktookmybabyaway 0]

Hereby seconded.

 

Ha. And you were one of those Why-can't-we-talk-about-the-issues people whose single post on the myth of media bias would contain more words than a day's full of crap that I'd write. It's nice to see you ruined.

 

EDIT: Wait a second, were you talking to me or Steve J?

 

...who is out of creative insults for the day...

 

When all else fails use "boner fuck." I heard this term YEARS ago and it still gets a laugh out of me.

 

Me and My ECONO-powers will soon transform this board into a utopian heaven

 

Don't you have to be, like, an ECONOMIST, first?...

[Stephen Joseph 0]

He was talking to me fool

 

Go smoke on your KKKrackpipe

[kkktookmybabyaway 0]

I got your crack pipe right here.

 

And if Wildbomb is siding with you on the wimpy "Let's-stop-the-petty-bickering" debate, I'll call his bitch-ass out, too.

 

Boner fuck...

[Guest Wildbomb 4:20]

Hey hey hey hey HEY~! I was siding with you on this one, kkk.

 

I'm officially ruined, and certainly proud of it. Petty bickering: Ruining TSMers since the birth of the Internet.

 

And don't you forget that Al Gore invented it, bitch!

 

--Ryan

...bah, you boner fuck...

[kkktookmybabyaway 0]

That boner fuck wasn't aimed at you in the first place -- it was aimed at our pseudo-economist...

[Stephen Joseph 0]

HAHA! I love chaos!

 

And KKK, if you really feel that way about me, we can meet up later

 

*wink*

[kkktookmybabyaway 0]

I've seen your pic.

 

No thanks...

[Guest Wildbomb 4:20]

kkk, I figured your original boner fuck was intended towards Everyone's Fake Economist, but hey, I said I was out of creative insults. 'Twas all in good fun.

 

Besides, you've got the significant other to take care of...why worry about said basketcase known as SJ?

 

--Ryan

...I'm Evil...

[Guest INXS]

Rather than guaranteeing himself universal empathy after the rather bad Swift Boat Vets ad, Kerry decided to make sure that people DIDN'T like him by deciding that one of Michael Moore's talking points was WELL worth mentioning.

 

Yup, he said that if he was President and heard we were under attack, he wouldn't have sat in a school for seven minutes. Dammit, he would've ACTED!!

 

Which, of course, is belied by what Kerry ACTUALLY DID on 9/11. From Kerry's interview with Larry King:

"...And as I came in [to a meeting in Sen. Daschle's office], Barbara Boxer and Harry Reid were standing there, and we watched the second plane come in to the building. And we shortly thereafter sat down at the table and then we just realized nobody could think, and then boom, right behind us, we saw the cloud of explosion at the Pentagon..."

http://www.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0407/08/lkl.00.html

 

So, was Kerry WRONG to sit in his office in a daze? Nope. Most people were in a daze --- I know I was.

 

But, Jesus Christ, saying he would've acted when he clearly didn't not only politicizes the tragedy, it makes him look like a fucking idiot.

-=Mike

Kerry wasn't president on September the 11th 2001 , Bush was.

[Stephen Joseph 0]

And we expect Bush to be non-human?

 

Hindsight buddy. Wishful expectational updating.

If you expect a President to act in anything other than a superhuman manner, you're an idiot.

 

They're human. If it was Gore, or Kerry, or Clinton, I'd be saying the same thing. You're criticizing a man on just normal human reaction.

 

Whatever.

[Dr. Tom 0]

Rather than guaranteeing himself universal empathy after the rather bad Swift Boat Vets ad, Kerry decided to make sure that people DIDN'T like him by deciding that one of Michael Moore's talking points was WELL worth mentioning.

 

Yup, he said that if he was President and heard we were under attack, he wouldn't have sat in a school for seven minutes. Dammit, he would've ACTED!!

 

Which, of course, is belied by what Kerry ACTUALLY DID on 9/11. From Kerry's interview with Larry King:

"...And as I came in [to a meeting in Sen. Daschle's office], Barbara Boxer and Harry Reid were standing there, and we watched the second plane come in to the building. And we shortly thereafter sat down at the table and then we just realized nobody could think, and then boom, right behind us, we saw the cloud of explosion at the Pentagon..."

http://www.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0407/08/lkl.00.html

 

So, was Kerry WRONG to sit in his office in a daze? Nope. Most people were in a daze --- I know I was.

 

But, Jesus Christ, saying he would've acted when he clearly didn't not only politicizes the tragedy, it makes him look like a fucking idiot.

-=Mike

Kerry wasn't president on September the 11th 2001 , Bush was.

And I suppose no CE topic is complete without you to fling shit at the walls...

 

Christ, do you even pay attention to threads in here? Do you read ANYTHING that's in them at all, except a post by Mike that gets your liberal panties in such a twist that you HAVE to reply at once? That issue was talked about, extensively. Get with the times, for fuck's sake.

[kkktookmybabyaway 0]

But isn't he adorable?...

[Guest BDC]

Give him the Choken Treatment.

 

To be honest, I'd rather have something to the effect of "I was stunned so I took a few minutes to collect myself" but I'm not going to fault anyone.