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NoCalMike

The latest twist in the Schiavo case.......

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aww whats so bad about starving this woman anyways, i bet she would have approved, isn't that what got her into that condition in the first place?

or was she one of those people who actually did eat but just induced vomiting? I always get those two mixed up. anorexic, bulemic? which was she

 

nobody talks about that angle, but shiavo has become such a "name" that this case could be used to try and promote, you know, NOT being an anorexic/bulemic/whatever, since there are thousands of women who do that shit to themselves. That should be the 'lesson learned and preached' moreso than just "have a living will!"

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Guest MikeSC
Why don't you refute his points instead of whining?

 

Well, isn't that keen. Let it not be said that you were not warned.

 

In the year 1998, Jeb Bush was the governer of Florida, which had a Republican Legislature. That legislature passed a reform law to allow for more intensive voter screening.

Which was necessary, considering the rampant scandal in the Miami mayoral race of 1998.

 

Jesus, a little research. Not that hard. The reporting won awards.

This law was passed two years prior to the Election in which George W. Bush ran for the position of President of the United States. George W. Bush, like his father, was a Republican.

I'm trying to think of an analogy that will succinctly describe how utterly pointless this is.

 

I cannot think of one.

 

You have an ability to spew meaningless bullshit that defies description.

Jeb Bush, at the Election, for the first time in American History, hired a private company (Choicepoint/DBT) to handle the identification and prevention of inelligable voting in the State of Florida.

Considering the problems of the 1998 Miami mayoral race where the courts had to play a role (http://www.cnn.com/ALLPOLITICS/1998/03/11/miami.mayor/), it was needed.

Choicepoint/DBT was Chaired by Frank Borman, a prominant Republican, and had four members of the GOP on it's board of directors.

And proof of wrongdoing, no doubt, is soon following. :rolleyes:

A list, provided from the office of Gov. Bush in Texas identified eight thousand felons in Florida that were not elligble to vote. It's unlikely that that this list was very accurate, but it was never used.

Actually, everybody on the list was given months to challenge their placement and correct any errors.

Cathrine Harris, current Congresswoman and then Secretary of State, Supervisor of Elections and head of the Bush Campaign in Florda (that's not a conflict of interests, mind you)

I cut here because I want to be able to say "you're correct" you a change.

was disatisfied with the list, and ordered it be expanded to number just over fifty eight thousand people. Only one county in Florida bothered going through the expensive process of checking the names in the list, which was only supposed to include felons, using the National Database. They found that ninety five percent of the names on that list were not felons, and were barred from voting for no particular reason.

Who is "they"? A source would be lovely.

Twenty two thousand of the illegally disenfranchized would-be voters were African American, or more commonly known as "Black". Black voters, especially in the last thirty years, have voted over ninety percent in favor of the Democratic Party.

Actually not 90% --- but pretty high numbers.

So, just for the sake of being generous, let's say that eighty five percent of those votes would have gone to the Democrats, with the five percent going to the Green party and ten percent to the Republicans. Under that math, that's eighteen thousand seven hundred votes that the Democratic party would have gotten. The official count in Florida shows that Gore lost by five hundred and thirty seven votes. Hm.

Imagine if those people, who were notified of them being on the list months before the election, decided to actually contact the Election Commission to state there is a mistake --- since, and I know this is shocking, felons often use aliases.

Fox News, owned by prominant Republican (he donates millions a year) Rupert Murdock announced that Bush had taken Florida long before the polls had closen.

You do know that this is unmitigated bullshit, right?

 

FOX declared Bush the winner of Florida --- at 2:15A. They called it, mistakenly, for Gore at before 8p --- before the polls closed.

 

You are lying here. It's really, really sad.

According to the on air talent, they were told to announce it fairly out of the blue, and no sources were quoted at any point.

And this "on-air" talent is...who?

 

And explain why they DIDN'T announce it until, oh, 6 hours after the polls closed?

 

And I notice no condemnation of the networks calling FL for Gore before the polls closed --- which is a known fact.

Gore, seeing this, conceded the election, as the whole Electio was dependant on Florida. I should point out that this was announced before the polls were closed, and that all other news stations exit polling showed it even, or if anything, they gave the democrats a slight edge.

The polls had been closed for 6 hours.

When it became clear that Fox news had simply lied, Gore revoked his concession, and was blasted on Fox News and CNN (equally as republican) for it.

Which is all interesting --- provided you weren't blatantly, repeatedly, and obviously lying here.

The Supreme Court eventually ruled that the recount, which hadn't finished or published it's results, wouldn't continue.

Actually, they vacated the FL Supreme Court's rulings which simply threw away election law (such as the time for a contest and the like),

The Supreme Court, seven of which were appointed by Republican Administrations (Souter, Thomas, Scalia, Stevens, Rehnquist, O'Conner and Kennedy) mysteriously supported the Republican bid to stop the recount, even though it was a legal recount.

Actually, since the legal recount had a very specific time when it had to be finished by, they made the right choice.

 

And I thought all but one were appointed by Bush.

Also, and at this point I feel it's necessary to point out that you're a complete dipshit, Souter and Thomas were both appointed in 1990 and 1991. That would be during the Tenure of George H. W. Bush. I'm not sure if you can count, but that adds up to two, not one.

Yes, let me double check that...

Two?

Yeah.

 

I'll add it again, and I'll show my work.

1(Souter)

+

1(Thomas)

______

2

 

Well holy shit.

And, fucktard, TWO is a shitload less than ALL BUT ONE.

The list of fifty eight thousand voters was expanded by including people with the same last name and birthday of known (by known, of course, we mean supposed, as the original list was flawed anyways) felons.

The whole FELONS USE ALIASES thing is lost on you, eh?

On top of that, after the polls had closed, an additional twenty thousand democratic votes were disallowed for a variety of reasons, the most publicly acknowledged of which were the improperly punched "chads", which were the bits of paper people were supposed to punch out next to the names of their choices in the election. This is to say, more specifically, that the choices made by the voters, while still clearly indicated, were not allowed because part of the paper hadn't torn.

Do you know how difficult it is to NOT puncture a ballot? It takes some doing.

 

But, hell, I trust YOU to decide what a voter MEANT.

 

Better than disqualifying military ballots, as a party tried to do.

Now, onto Deflective Politics;

 

In the United States, there are a number of twenty four hour news Channels. MSNBC, CNN and FOXNews. FoxNews is owned by Rupert Murdock, a Republican, and is bias beyond description. CNN is slightly less bias, but still favors the Republican party heavily, going so far as to have their reporters talk over Al Sharpton at the DNC, which most people felt was the most electrifying and impassioned speech of the evening.

The same CNN where the news chief lied, stating that troops were targeting journalists?

 

Yeah.

Deflective politics have been employed by both parties, most notebly by the democrats with the colombine shooting, which was used by Bill Clinton to take attention away from the fact that, earlier that day, he'd dropped a record number of bombs on Kosovo.

Oh God, please tell me you're not just spewing Michael Moore talking points here.

Shame on Bill Clinton, using a national tragedy to take attention away from an international tragedy. Clinton called a press conference to talk about Columbine, which was carried on every network, making it the most talked about issue of the day.

What was the int'l tragedy? Bombing the Serbs?

 

You do know what they were doing that led to that, right?

 

No, you probably don't.

This is common knowledge in Canada, but again, you're in the states, so we should assume that only doctors know that.

When I think about Canada...

 

Scratch that. I'm American. Why the fuck would I EVER think about Canada?

Social Security Reform, which is currently the biggest issue facing America, took a back seat.

 

The social security reform, for those who aren't aware, is the Government's plan to, rather than pay it themselves, have people invest their own money in various companies and then live off of the return once they retire.

Which return a higher investment than the gov't provides.

 

Hell, we've been told for years that people on Social Security can't survive on it to begin with.

Of course, investments don't always deliver returns, but the government has promised that they'll cover any loses.

 

Wait, no they haven't.

 

But they've promised that everyone will get a pay raise in order to invest, since many people can't afford to spare the money currently, right?

 

No, no they have not.

Actually, the plan is to take the money being shovelled into the system and putting it where it might actually make some money.

Regardless of the fact that I may have been mistaken on a few points in my initial post, you still have no business being such an asshole about.

Don't be a fucking moron or a little bitch when called on it.

The fact remains that I have every right to hold whatever opinions I do hold, and that there's absolutely no reason to attack me for having a different opinion than you.

I "attacked" you for being an idiot, not for your opinions.

What's happened is a clear "fight or flight" instinct, which happens when a member of the animal kingdom (which includes people) feel challenged on some level.

Hold on to that if it makes you feel better.

In this case, I have challenged your opinions by holding different ones.

Nah, you're just an idiot.

Since you are in no danger of physical harm online, you've responded with the "fight" instinct, choosing to attack me to support your position.

When you're openly lying and horribly mistaken on almost every point you make --- not much "defending of my position" is needed.

Fairly common behavior in the un-evolved mind, meaning that you're still growing into your capacity. I'm not calling you stupid, I'm saying that you don't yet know how to deal with your newfound mental resources. Plainly; You're smarter than you are mature.

And you're as moronic as you are boring.

And regardless of what you claim, I know you wouldn't dream of being such an arrogant little shit to my face, no one would.

Again, if it makes you warm and fuzzy to feel that...

It's utter bullshit when you say different, and if it isn't, you're parents ought to be arrested for raising such a little bastard.

Ooooh, BURN!

Grow up, learn some manners, and stop assuming that you're the hottest shit walking this planet, because no matter where you go, no matter where you are, there will always be someone bigger, badder and in this case, much, much smarter than you are.

Well, you've already met that person for your life.

 

Hi!

This is the last I'll be participating in this conversation, please do not attempt to contact me or illicit a response, I've said all I have to say and wasted more time than I would liked to already. In closing, you'll find life's a lot easier and more enjoyable when you don't go out of your way to be a sniveling, confrontational little douchebag.

 

Fuck off.

I think I'll just mock your idiocy some more and then laugh at you crying about it. Your points are so flimsy that they are laughable. Your logic is tedious when not openly fallacious. You openly and blatantly lie. And you whine.

From the Fox News article:

 

QUOTE

The consensus among doctors who have examined her has been that the damage was so extensive that the woman known for her quick smile and intriguing laugh had died long ago.

 

 

See?

People say Richard Nixon died when his wife did.

 

Somehow, I doubt his death certificate lists "Pat's death" as his cause of death.

-=Mike

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How in the hell can people do this line-by-line stuff. Geez.

 

Deadbolt was pretty dumb to bring all that other crap into this. Then again, I'm miffed that it took attention away from the incontrovertible point I made right before he went off on whatever that was.

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How in the hell can people do this line-by-line stuff.

 

I tried once or twice and went crazy. I must have ADD or something.

 

EDIT: Just for you Kotz, I went back and read your post. I think the argument would be that "nature" gave man the ability over 50-60 years to make the technology to extend life. Not saying I agree with this line of reasoning, just trying to bump up your self-esteem and not end a post with FAUX NEWS LOL or a Mikey Moore fat joke...

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

... which got me the thinking -- how many feeding tubes would Mikey have to have inserted to keep him alive?...

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... which got me the thinking -- how many feeding tubes would Mikey have to have inserted to keep him alive?...

 

Well, he has three in now.

So I'd say, roughly 147.

 

He'd look like he just woke up from the Matrix.

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Deadbolt was pretty dumb to bring all that other crap into this.

Yes, you're right. Floridian politics and the US Supreme Court have nothing to do with the Shiavo case. :rolleyes:

 

(Now do you see my point, Boon?)

 

And, fucktard, TWO is a shitload less than ALL BUT ONE.

 

The fact that some else was also wrong about the number doesn't change the fact that YOU were wrong. Not only did you INSIST that Bush Sr. only appointed one guy to the Supreme Court, but you were a dick about it by saying it was "BASIC research" after you got it wrong yourself.

 

You deserved the reply you got. Don't be a cry-baby about it.

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How in the hell can people do this line-by-line stuff. Geez.

 

Deadbolt was pretty dumb to bring all that other crap into this. Then again, I'm miffed that it took attention away from the incontrovertible point I made right before he went off on whatever that was.

The last time I tried doing it, I just wound up saying to myself "This is fucking pointless" and quitting in the middle. You really need to have a lot of time on your hands to do that on a consistent basis.

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(Now do you see my point, Boon?)

Aye. I guess I never noticed it before, b/c usually the remarks are sprinkled in between a lot of "Mike's a crazy fucking conservative and there he goes again," remarks. But I do see what you mean. Maybe everyone loves Mike after all?! Like when HHH gets face pops at live shows! I guess people just appreciate what he brings to the table, agree or disagree.

 

Kotz- I think that the technology they most oppose is stuff that directly conflicts with their ideology, e.g. stem cell research and its ties to abortion, cloning and its ties to playing God. I assume that if the technology is supporting their ideology, e.g. a feeding tube supporting right to life, they're okay with it. Yeah, it's pretty hypocritical, but that's one in a line of many hypocritical actions taken by political activists, ideology be damned.

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Guest Deadbolt
27ct13.gif

 

Must your post include so much arrogance and sarcasm? As valid as your points are, people don't respect you when you cover valid political argument with so much pompous, useless clutter.

 

For example-

 

Twenty two thousand of the illegally disenfranchized would-be voters were African American, or more commonly known as "Black".

 

Frankly, you're no better at keeping your emotions in check then MikeSC, so you can drop this "I won't bother wasting my time" act b/c frankly, you come off as a complete jackass, as well.

If we're being completely honest, then no, I don't have to be nearly as arrogant as I was in that post. I'm not entirely sure what you're trying to point out with your quote though, I hope it's not your way of telling me you think I'm racist. I can assure you, that's the last thing I was trying to put across.

 

However, here's the thing; I don't take kindly to people coming in and getting and acting like a prick at my expense. I'm not a turn the other cheek kind of guy, more of a fight fire with fire kind of guy. I don't appreciate being mocked over differing opinions, and Mike more or less openly challenged me, so I responded as I deemed appropriate.

 

------------------

 

Mike,

 

The Fox News Stuff; If I am blatantly lying, it's only because I've been blatantly lied to. Michael Moore, Al Frankon, Jon Stewart and Al Gore as sources for the various information. Where names aren't mentioned, well, I Don't have names.

 

On Kosovo; I know what the serbs were doing, "Ethnic Cleansing". Terrible stuff, no doubt, and I'm not saying that the bombing wasn't necessary, but any time that such a high number of bombs are dropped, there's going to be a certain number of innocent casualties. Whether you want to put that in your necessary evils column or not is up to you, but it was still 'covered' with the use of deflective politics. I'm not condemning Clinton, I like Clinton. I don't like the Repbulicans, because if you want to talk about flagrant lying, you have to look no further than them.

 

I've actually read the proposed changes to Social Security, it's many, many pages of mind numbing legal lingo, very unpleasant, but behind it all is the basic truth that the Government is expecting people to invest their own money in order to pay for retirement. That's the gist of the whole plan.

 

Finally, onto the whole Justices of the Supreme Court thing; I know, Two is a whole lot less than I originally figured had been appointed by Bush. That's my bad for trusting third hand information. But you had to go on this bit about basic research, so I actually did some, and found out that you, after all that shit about 'basic research', were completely wrong as well. When dealing with less than a dozen people, having the wrong number is having the wrong number, who was closer doesn't really count in my books. But then again, we're not following my books.

 

 

I really don't want to participate in this debate anymore, we've both made some valid points and we've both made some rather poor points. It happens. I really never wanted to get into the intricate details of it, my initial problem was with the attitude you brought to the table in correcting me. I have no problem at all being wrong, it happens, accept and move on. What I dislike is being sarcastically dressed down by someone who assumes he is better or superior based on the fact that his opinions are not the same as my opinions. That pisses me off.

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And I could connect the politics of Florida right now with the rise to prominence of the Bush children and the Republican Revolution to that and the Contract with America to that and the backlash against the 70s to the election of Reagan and...

 

You get the idea. Everything's connected, but those connections must be ignored if you're going to concentrate on anything specific.

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And I could connect the politics of Florida right now with the rise to prominence of the Bush children and the Republican Revolution to that and the Contract with America to that and the backlash against the 70s to the election of Reagan and...

kevinbacon.jpg

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Michael Moore, Al Frankon, Jon Stewart and Al Gore as sources for the various information.

You cannot be fucking serious. Three of your "sources" are a filmmaker who edits tape more than Bill O'Reilly, a mediocre comedian who wrote for SNL, and a self-described FAKE NEWS ANCHOR? Holy everloving shit.

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I wish someone would pull the feeding tube from this thread. Even Foxnews has forgotten about her, the death of someone important like the Pope being more newsworthy and who by the way didn't give himself brain damage by sticking his fingers down his throat.

There were people actually comparing Terri Schiavo to Jesus Christ.

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Guest MikeSC
However, here's the thing; I don't take kindly to people coming in and getting and acting like a prick at my expense. I'm not a turn the other cheek kind of guy, more of a fight fire with fire kind of guy. I don't appreciate being mocked over differing opinions, and Mike more or less openly challenged me, so I responded as I deemed appropriate.

 

------------------

It's a shame you're so utterly inept at "fighting fire with fire", huh?

Mike,

 

The Fox News Stuff; If I am blatantly lying, it's only because I've been blatantly lied to.

Do your own research.

Michael Moore, Al Frankon, Jon Stewart and Al Gore as sources for the various information. Where names aren't mentioned, well, I Don't have names.

Wow, I guess those ARE good sources. Far better than, you know, ACTUAL sources. Try, you know, ACTUALLY looking up, you know, BASIC timelines. There are more than a few books on it. Quite a few articles on the internet.

 

Hell, have a blast and look up the sites who take great pleasure in destroying every claim Michael Moore has ever made in his career.

On Kosovo; I know what the serbs were doing, "Ethnic Cleansing". Terrible stuff, no doubt, and I'm not saying that the bombing wasn't necessary, but any time that such a high number of bombs are dropped, there's going to be a certain number of innocent casualties.

You mean the civilians that were being massacred, en masse, by the Serbs?

 

So, your plan was to simply allow the slaughter to continue?

 

A humanitarian is you!

Whether you want to put that in your necessary evils column or not is up to you, but it was still 'covered' with the use of deflective politics. I'm not condemning Clinton, I like Clinton. I don't like the Repbulicans, because if you want to talk about flagrant lying, you have to look no further than them.

Or your posts...

I've actually read the proposed changes to Social Security, it's many, many pages of mind numbing legal lingo, very unpleasant, but behind it all is the basic truth that the Government is expecting people to invest their own money in order to pay for retirement. That's the gist of the whole plan.

Considering that the gov't will have to raise taxes to an absurd rate on workers to PAY for it --- it's a damned solid idea.

 

You see, when it was ORIGINALLY proposed, people living past 65 weren't nearly as common. So, rather than ever, you know, RAISING the age to keep up with the increasing life expectancy, they simply added benefits that we couldn't really afford because there were more baby boomers than retirees.

 

That stops --- in about 10 or so years.

I really don't want to participate in this debate anymore, we've both made some valid points and we've both made some rather poor points. It happens. I really never wanted to get into the intricate details of it, my initial problem was with the attitude you brought to the table in correcting me. I have no problem at all being wrong, it happens, accept and move on. What I dislike is being sarcastically dressed down by someone who assumes he is better or superior based on the fact that his opinions are not the same as my opinions. That pisses me off.

I'm not assuming anything. You're pulling out repeatedly disproven pap and meaningless gibberish as a replacement for your own thoughts.

 

If I wanted to read Michael Moore's thoughts, I'd simply slam my head in a car door and experience it firsthand.

-=Mike

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I wish someone would pull the feeding tube from this thread. Even Foxnews has forgotten about her, the death of someone important like the Pope being more newsworthy and who by the way didn't give himself brain damage by sticking his fingers down his throat.

There were people actually comparing Terri Schiavo to Jesus Christ.

 

Well, they both were skinny.

And white, well Jesus was according to white people.

And both knew a pretty big jackass.

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Coming in May on CBS.. the Terri Schiavo movie, starring Keri Russell and Dean Cain

Maybe in CBS' version, she gets her tube put in at the last second and makes a remarkable recovery..

 

I also feel bad for whoever has to play her.

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File this under "tying up loose ends"

 

from the Washington Post

 

Author Of Schiavo Memo Steps Forward

Sen. Martinez's Counsel Cited Upside for GOP

 

By Mike Allen

Washington Post Staff Writer

Thursday, April 7, 2005; Page A01

 

The legal counsel to Sen. Mel Martinez (R-Fla.) admitted yesterday that he was the author of a memo citing the political advantage to Republicans of intervening in the case of Terri Schiavo, the senator said in an interview last night.

 

Brian Darling, a former lobbyist for the Alexander Strategy Group on gun rights and other issues, offered his resignation and it was immediately accepted, Martinez said.

 

Martinez said he earlier had been assured by aides that his office had nothing to do with producing the memo. "I never did an investigation, as such," he said. "I just took it for granted that we wouldn't be that stupid. It was never my intention to in any way politicize this issue."

 

Martinez, a freshman who was secretary of housing and urban development for most of President Bush's first term, said he had not read the one-page memo. He said he inadvertently passed it to Sen. Tom Harkin (D-Iowa), who had worked with him on the issue. After that, other Senate aides gave the memo to reporters for ABC News and The Washington Post.

 

Harkin said in an interview that Martinez handed him the memo on the Senate floor, in hopes of gaining his support for the bill giving federal courts jurisdiction in the Florida case in an effort to restore the Florida woman's feeding tube. "He said these were talking points -- something that we're working on here," Harkin said.

 

The mystery of the memo's origin had roiled the Capitol, with Republicans accusing Democrats of concocting the document as a dirty trick, and Democrats accusing Republicans of trying to duck responsibility for exploiting the dying days of a brain-damaged woman.

 

Conservative Web logs have challenged the authenticity of the memo, in some cases likening it to the discredited documents about Bush's National Guard service that CBS News reported last fall.

 

The staff of the Senate Rules and Administration Committee, at the request of a Democrat, spent a week trying to determine the memo's origin and had come up empty, said an official involved in the investigation.

 

The unsigned memo -- which initially misspells Schiavo's first name and gives the wrong number for the pending bill -- includes eight talking points in support of the legislation and calls the controversy "a great political issue."

 

"This legislation ensures that individuals like Terri Schiavo are guaranteed the same legal protections as convicted murderers like Ted Bundy," the memo concludes.

 

It asserts that the case would appeal to the party's core supporters, saying: "This is an important moral issue and the pro-life base will be excited that the Senate is debating this important issue."

 

The document was provided to ABC News on March 18 and to The Post on March 19 and was included in news reports about congressional intervention in the Schiavo case. Bush returned from an Easter vacation in Texas and signed the bill shortly after 1 a.m. on March 21.

 

At the time, other Senate Republican aides claimed to be familiar with the memo but declined to discuss it on the record and gave no information about its origin.

 

In a statement issued last night, Martinez said that Harkin asked him for background information on the bill and that he gave him what he thought was a routine one-page staff memo on the legislation. "Unbeknownst to me, instead of my one page on the bill, I had given him a copy of the now infamous memo that at some point along the way came into my possession," the statement said.

 

Harkin said that when he read the part about the politics of the case he thought that was "rather out of line," but he said he did not discuss the matter with Martinez. Harkin said he has no complaints about Martinez.

 

"I really worked in good faith with Senator Martinez on this issue and I found him to be a decent, caring person to work with on this, and so I have a lot of respect for him," Harkin said.

 

Martinez said Harkin called him about 5 p.m. yesterday and told him that the memo had come from his office. Martinez said he then called in his senior staff and said, "Something is wrong here." He said that Darling later confessed to John Little, Martinez's chief of staff, and that he said he did not think he had ever printed the memo.

 

"It was intended to be a working draft," Martinez said. "He doesn't really know how I got it."

 

Efforts to reach Darling last night were unsuccessful.

 

Sen. Frank Lautenberg (D-N.J.), a member of the Rules and Administration Committee, wrote to the panel's leaders last week to ask for an investigation into the "document, its source, and how it came to be distributed."

 

"Those who would attempt to influence debate in the United States Senate should not hide behind anonymous pieces of paper," he said.

 

A Republican Senate official, who spoke on the condition of anonymity because he is not a committee spokesman, said yesterday that an informal inquiry began almost immediately and is likely to be concluded within a week. He said that conversations with senators, aides and reporters have turned up nothing definitive and that the inquiry is likely to end with a letter to Lautenberg saying just that.

 

Senate Minority Leader Harry M. Reid (D-Nev.) said in an interview Friday that he considered it "ludicrous" to suggest that his party created the document and said Republicans were using such talk to divert responsibility.

 

"I guess the best defense is a good offense -- that's their theory," he said.

 

In interviews at the Capitol yesterday, senators from both sides said they find the case perplexing, and a sign of the intense partisanship that permeates the building. Sen. Orrin G. Hatch (R-Utah) said that the torrent of accusations reflects the bitterness over the life-and-death issues in the Schiavo case, which he said were a proxy on both sides for what provokes "every other ugly political conversation -- that's abortion."

 

Sen. Joseph R. Biden Jr. (D-Del.) said he believed that the memo originated with the GOP because it is "totally consistent" with how the Republicans have operated for the past four years. "They just shouldn't lose their memos," he said.

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Martinez said he had not read the one-page memo. He said he inadvertently passed it to Sen. Tom Harkin (D-Iowa), who had worked with him on the issue.

 

LOL -- I guess that's why RIGHT-WING RADIO hasn't been talking about this memo being another Rathergate scandal for the past week or so. I also heard Terri S's name was misspelled on the memo.

 

On the bright side, a position just opened for you, Tyler...

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Sen. Joseph R. Biden Jr. (D-Del.) said he believed that the memo originated with the GOP because it is "totally consistent" with how the Republicans have operated for the past four years. "They just shouldn't lose their memos," he said.

Maybe a foreign head of state wrote it and somebody here plagiarized it, that would be consistent with how you operate, Biden

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Sen. Joseph R. Biden Jr. (D-Del.) said he believed that the memo originated with the GOP because it is "totally consistent" with how the Republicans have operated for the past four years. "They just shouldn't lose their memos," he said.

Maybe a foreign head of state wrote it and somebody here plagiarized it, that would be consistent with how you operate, Biden

Oh TAG~!

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Guest MikeSC

The inevitable next step has occurred.

Woman, 81, at center of feeding tube feud

Kenneth Mullinax, the patient’s nephew in Birmingham, Ala., said a hospice nurse told him that Magouirk had not received substantial nourishment since March 28. He wants a temporary feeding tube inserted until she can be evaluated for treatment at the University of Alabama Medical Center. A living will states that nourishment should be withheld only if she were in a coma or vegetative state with no hope of recovery.

Mullinax and the patient’s brother and sister – Lonnie Ruth Mullinax of Birmingham and A.B. McLeod of Anniston, Ala. – came here last Friday to arrange for a feeding tube and take her to the Birmingham hospital. That same day Gaddy received emergency guardianship in Troup County Probate Court.

 

At a follow-up hearing Monday, the parties reached a settlement that awarded guardianship to Gaddy provided three cardiologists – James Brennan and Thomas Gore, both of LaGrange, and Raed Aquel of Birmingham – evaluate the patient, who would receive whatever treatment two of the three recommended. A final decision had not yet been reached.

 

“They were all hugging necks when they left court,” said Probate Judge Donald Boyd. “I don’t know what happened.”

 

Boyd said Gaddy testified at the hearing that she feeds her grandmother Jello, chips of ice and “anything else she’d be willing to eat.”

 

“I think all of Mrs. Magouirk’s family has her genuine best interests at heart, but unfortunately they disagree on what they believe would be best for her,” said Jack Kirby of LaGrange, attorney for the patient’s brother and sister.

 

“She (Gaddy) said, ‘I think it’s time she (her grandmother) goes home to Jesus, that’s she’s too sick and would not have a good quality of life,” Kenneth Mullinax said.

His complaints have been posted on Internet Web logs that have been in overdrive since the Terri Schiavo case.

 

“All of the Terri Schiavo people have come to our rescue,” Mullinax said. “This thing’s going national.”

 

On Thursday, the Probate Office, West Georgia Health System and attorneys in the case were inundated with phone calls and e-mails.

 

“We need people surrounding that place (hospice), we need some activity,” one caller from Oregon told the Daily News, adding that she had called the governor’s office and attorneys in the case.

 

The probate office got an estimated 50 calls from people saying things like, “I understand y’all are murdering people in Troup County” and “You’re euthanizing people.”

 

“We’re taking the posture of refusing to deal with those people because they’re not representing the responsible parties,” said West Georgia Health System President Jerry Fulks. “We’re focusing on taking care of the patient and her family.”

Fulks said he could not comment on an individual patient, but the health system’s policy calls for nourishment and hydration for hospice patients, sometimes through a feeding tube because of throat cancer or some other condition that prevents the patient from swallowing.

 

He said there is a “reverence for life that our staff and our physicians and our volunteers all adhere to in doing the jobs they do.”

 

Mullinax said his aunt does not have a terminal condition, which is a requirement for admission to hospice.

 

Danny Daniel of LaGrange, the attorney for Gaddy and another grandchild, said doctors made the decision to admit Magourik into hospice.

 

Gaddy has been taking care of her grandmother for 10 years, he said.

“They’re following the doctors’ recommendations and they want to do what’s in the best interests of their grandmother,” Daniel said, adding that hospice is providing “excellent care” for Magourik, a widow with no children.

 

Gaddy could not be reached for comment.

 

“The doctors can make her very comfortable again and give her a normal life,” Mullinax said. “That’s all we want for Aunt Mae ... My aunt can’t live much longer without substantial fluids or nourishment.

 

“I want the world to know that at Hospice LaGrange you have people who are not terminal being denied nourishment as a matter of course. This national debate has reared its head in Troup County, Georgia. It’s the damndest thing I’ve ever seen.”

He said he will “pursue every available avenue” to get treatment for his aunt. http://www.lagrangenews.com/new.php?StoryType=full

Now, we have courts saying that a woman WITH a living will expressly stating a desire to live STILL can be starved to death because one member of her family wants it to happen.

-=Mike

...The first time is always the hardest. It gets easier and life becomes less precious every subsequent time...

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