Rape

[snuffbox 0]

"She might as well just lay back & enjoy it" - Bob Knight

 

"She was askin' fer it" - MikeSC

 

These kinds of statements are definitly not coming from the strongest/self assured of people and, unfortunately, are probably not very rare. Rape is terrible enough but all the people that brush it aside or blame the victim do nothing but further the widespread problem.

 

See also: this thread.

[Guest Eagle Man]

Well, to clarify on the Bob Knight thing, there was no "she" involved; he was referring to how the refs were giving the other team all the calls and there was nothing they could do about it. Poor choice of words, but he wasn't really telling women to enjoy being raped.

[snuffbox 0]

I thought it was from a Connie Chung interview.

 

In either case he makes it seem as though rape is no bad thing. He's not alone in that mindset.

[Special K 0]

"She was askin' for it" is very mildly putting Miks SC's thread of horror.

 

"Tell your (rape victim) slut friend to keep her legs closed." That's a bit different.

[snuffbox 0]

Yes, it was definitly far worse than I paraphrased it. That guy has some serious problems. Almost equally sad how many people at that other board continue to e-bend over for him.

[Ripper 0]

You can't just run it and say "Hey, STOP" You are equiped with non lethal weapons and raper is morelikely not. Its can be a dangerous situation for a corrections officer.

 

Yeah, they're equipped with nonlethal weapons. Nighsticks, tazers, what have you. The rapist(s) are armed with a hard dick and their pants around their ankles. These people are trained to deal with outbreaks of violence, sometimes riots, you're honestly saying they can't stop a rape? Did I misunderstand.

 

"Oooh, that guy's getting raped. But if I stop it, I might get socked. Fuck that."

 

I missed this earlier.

 

You think rape victim is being threatened with being socked? Have you ever heard of shanks, prison weapons? See if you were a CO, you would be dead in a week because of that crap. Yes, they are trained to deal with outbreaks of violence and riots....in which case they go, suit up and go in to stop it with proper equipment so they don't get stabbed to death. they don't walk around with tasers(thats not permitted around the inmates. Basically, nothing the inmates could take and use on the CO is permitted unless there is a case of a outbreak of violence. a baton is about all you are going to see. And prison rape is not one on one. Thats why there are prison GANGS. A CO is not there to run in recklessly and die to save a prisoner from getting raped. Is it messed up, sure, but once again, prison is not a fucking vacation. Its messed up. PUNISHMENT is the only change that can be made in the policy towards prison rape. Avoiding it, I am sorry, but it is nearly impossible to do safely for the staff.

[Dobbs 3K 0]

The other thing that's forgotten is even if you have a hundred people on staff at a time, they can't cover every foot of ground at once. Stuff happens when people aren't looking. I doubt a lot of prison rapes happen with a guard just standing there watching.

[Ripper 0]

Seroiusly though, if you ever talk to a CO, if something violent is happening inside the gates, it can take them 3-5 minutes to get the proper gear on to go into a violent situation while preserving their safety.

 

I am sorry but the safety of the men and women hired to patrol the prisons come at a higher importance than those that are inthere. Its unfortunate but hey...thats the case.

[Boon 0]

And prison rape is not one on one. Thats why there are prison GANGS.

That's a point that I think has gone really unnoticed in this thread, and it's an important one.

[Thanks for the Fish 0]

If there wasn't the possibility of being raped or otherwise assaulted I don't think Prison would have nearly as much as a deterrent effect. Taking away ones freedom, when many are coming from nothing anyways isn't really a deterrant. If the state was allowed to make prison time harder, prisoner on prisoner violence wouldn't be needed to act as THE deterrent.

[Ripper 0]

If there wasn't the possibility of being raped or otherwise assaulted I don't think Prison would have nearly as much as a deterrent effect. Taking away ones freedom, when many are coming from nothing anyways isn't really a deterrant. If the state was allowed to make prison time harder, prisoner on prisoner violence wouldn't be needed to act as THE deterrent.

 

I am sorry , but that is laughable. Any person that thinks prison violence is needed to make prison a deterrent has obviously never known anyone or seen a prison. Coming from being poor isn't the same as having no freedom. Yeah...I'm poor. Being strip searched, eating crappy food, manual labor for free, no women, and having every second of my day controlled is still a deterrant. What do you think poor people are going through?

 

Prison time is hard, and nothing bothers me more when I see some person say "That prisoner had time to play a video game...prison is becoming a country club". (Not you in particular, but I hear that all the time).

 

VIOLENCE isn't a deterrent to not go to to prison for violent people. they don't give a crap and they are the ones that are committing the violent acts.

[Spicy McHaggis 0]

Seroiusly though, if you ever talk to a CO, if something violent is happening inside the gates, it can take them 3-5 minutes to get the proper gear on to go into a violent situation while preserving their safety.

 

I am sorry but the safety of the men and women hired to patrol the prisons come at a higher importance than those that are inthere. Its unfortunate but hey...thats the case.

Shhh... your logic will complicate their simple, obvious solutions.

[Dobbs 3K 0]

I've never understood why the US has never looked at exile as a viable alternative to domestic incarceration. The US has plenty of islands where no one is living. Ship the scum off to some remote island and let them either survive, or slaughter each other. No reason we should have to pay for them to live.

[snuffbox 0]

Haggis spent his 98% tax cut on rape porn.

[bob_barron 0]

Invader's turning into a gimmick

[Dobbs 3K 0]

Why, do you disagree with my statement?

[snuffbox 0]

You keep repeating the same retarded Soviet/Siberia idea over & over, along with burn-the-ghettos and other such gems of ideas. It's really gimmick-y.

[Guest Eagle Man]

I've never understood why the US has never looked at exile as a viable alternative to domestic incarceration. The US has plenty of islands where no one is living. Ship the scum off to some remote island and let them either survive, or slaughter each other. No reason we should have to pay for them to live.

Hahaha, what the fuck are you talking about, you dumbshit knuckle-dragger? We're not going to exile people to the Marianas, or Alaska, or even Branson. "Why haven't we considered stranding people on a desert island as punishment?" Because the real world isn't a cross between 1984 and The Swiss Family Robinson, you fascist nerd. So, to summarize, we're treating kids like shit, walling off Mexico, vasectomizing the poor, and shipping off criminals to Samoa. I hope my one-eighth Jewish heritage is below the minimum when it comes time for you to round 'em up here in Invader's World.

[theintensifier 0]

When I first came to prison, I had no idea what to expect. Certainly none of this. I'm a tall white male, who unfortunately has a small amount of feminine characteristics. And very shy. These characteristics have got me raped so many times I have no more feelings physically. I have been raped by up to 5 black men and two white men at a time. I've had knifes at my head and throat. I had fought and been beat so hard that I didn't ever think I'd see straight again. One time when I refused to enter a cell, I was brutally attacked by staff and taken to segragation though I had only wanted to prevent the same and worse by not locking up with my cell mate. There is no supervision after lockdown. I was given a conduct report. I explained to the hearing officer what the issue was. He told me that off the record, He suggests I find a man I would/could willingly have sex with to prevent these things from happening. I've requested protective custody only to be denied. It is not available here. He also said there was no where to run to, and it would be best for me to accept things . . . . I probably have AIDS now. I have great difficulty raising food to my mouth from shaking after nightmares or thinking to hard on all this . . . . I've laid down without physical fight to be sodomized. To prevent so much damage in struggles, ripping and tearing. Though in not fighting, it caused my heart and spirit to be raped as well. Something I don't know if I'll ever forgive myself for.

 

http://www.hrw.org/reports/2001/prison/report.html#_1_2

 

This guy's crime...a DUI. That could easily have been someone I knew from college.

 

We have a major human rights disaster going on right this moment in prisons here in the United States. Now if this guy was a brutal murderer or a child molester, I wouldn't have all that much sympathy for him. But we have a lot of people in prison here for fucking weed. And they're being subjected to this shit.

I am not condoning the fact these men / women are being raped in prison, but it does take at least three DUI's or a certain poundage of weed to land yourself in prison. A person is given at least three chances to correct his behavior, and I don't feel sorry for an individual that cannot learn from his mistakes and gets locked up in prison. Does he / she deserve to be raped? No. Its a unfortunate that these people have to endure years of this punishment.

 

So, essentially, when we sentence someone to prison, today, we're sentencing them to a distinct possibility of repeated gang rape.

Pretty much, yeah.

 

As far as I'm concerned somebody who's put in for DUI is an attempted murderer and deserves to have a train run on them by a well-endowed inmate. Something minor like petty larceny or weed is one thing but drunk drivers are pieces of shit that deserve the worst punishment possible.

That is a horrible overreaction. Yes, a person driving under the influence is a person who is increasing the chances of killing someone or themself, however they certainly do not deserve to be raped.

 

People like you would be singing a totally different tune if you were in that man's shoes.

 

Blah blah blah. Don't commit crimes. Its that easy. If you want to really decrease the chances of you going to jail, don't do illegal shit. Yeah, sure, there are some people there that don't belong, but if he went to PRISON for a DUI, it either wasn't his first time or he hit or killed someone. You don't go to prison for getting pulled over for DUI. So, yeah...fuck him. Noone deserves to be raped, but you don't need to do shit that will put you in a ass taking environment.

Well said. Its very logical - if you commit a crime you will serve time. A fairly simple concept to understand.

 

As far as I'm concerned somebody who's put in for DUI is an attempted murderer and deserves to have a train run on them by a well-endowed inmate. Something minor like petty larceny or weed is one thing but drunk drivers are pieces of shit that deserve the worst punishment possible.

Vast overreaction. There's a tremendous difference between a DUI--a misdemeanor that results in no harm being done to another party--and, say, vehicular manslaughter resulting from a DUI, a felony in which a victim dies. Drunk driving is retarded and people should be punished for it, but there are obvious degrees that you have to take into account as with any crime. I don't know what this guy's particular case is, but that's a dangerous generalization to make.

 

On the main topic, U.S. prisons are overcrowded, poorly managed warzones. I don't know what we do about that.

I'm currently going to college to become a state corrections officer, and we had the opportunity to talk to a recently released inmate. He served in the Marine Corps, and served in Iraq during the beginning of the conflict, and he said that he'd rather fight in downtown Fallujah then spend one night in the level 5 state prison he was sentenced to.

 

Our country is obsessed with incarceration. I believe that is the wrong philosophy to have in this day. We've simply created a new problem, our prisons are grossly overcrowded and cannot support a large enough staff to observe / watch all the inmates they house. Our country needs to get back to deterring criminals instead of simply locking them up. In foreign countries, if you are found shoplifting, you'll get your hand cut off. That generally deters most individuals from commiting that crime, because uh...your hands are somewhat important. Should we take it that far, not necessarly, but things like public humiliation and caning might serve a greater good than tightly confining hundreds/thousands of men who have nothing to lose.

 

I'm not really sure if there really is a solution to this problem, I think what I suggested was a good idea.

[theintensifier 0]

Says it was his third DUI offense. Sorry he's getting raped and all, but it was his third one.

 

I actually know a guy who has 3 DUI's.........he has court dates and such and doesn't know if he's going to prison or not. Yes a DUI is stupid and he should have his liscense taken away for a long time but I'm not sure he should get some long prison term......he could just get house arrest which seems more in line for what he should get.

Obviously the punishments he's already endured through the other two DUI's did absolutely no good for the guy you know. Again, he's a habitual law breaker that deserves jail/prison time - not being raped.

 

Regardless of the crime, nobody deserves that kind of treatment.

Even someone who's in for rape themselves?

 

Dont believe in an eye for an eye?

The days of Hammurabi have long since passed, and even though it'd be nice to make the person suffer for what they have done by having it done to them, it would make us just as bad as them. I'm probably alone on this, but I think those people just need a good fine tuned attitude adjustment - meaning, you place the rapist in a room with no windows, a camera (so everyone can see what happens to a rapist), and only one door, and then you let in a man like Chuck Liddell and let him adjust the rapist attitude for him. Yes, its breaking the law, but it would be a very effective way of deterring someone from raping another human being.

[theintensifier 0]

It's fucked up and all he's getting raped but people know what prison is like.

 

This argument, used by many in this thread, could be used to fit any punishment for any crime.

 

Let's say we make the penalty for jaywalking death by stoning...

 

"Well, it's fucked up, but you know that's the penalty so if you jaywalk you have it coming."

It makes sense as ridiculous as it is. Its like putting your hand in a fire even though you know its going to hurt and burn the piss out of you. Its quite idiotic to go against something like that, if you know the consequence and go ahead and do it anyway, it just defies all logic.

 

Stories like the one in the first post are good reasons why this country needs to replace prisons with work camps, and allow more executions.

Workcamps yes, and executions on a certain level (murders/repeat rapist/drug smugglers)

 

See that is a backwards system.

 

Don't tell me preventing rape is "too expensive"

Eric, you're a pretty knowledgeable guy, but you don't have a clue about the prison system. The inmate to officer ratio in the prisons in my state is at least 15-30/1. Have you ever tried watching 15-30 at one time?

 

Prison is the most controlled place in society.

 

If you cannot prevent it there, you cannot prevent it anywhere.

Controlled if you mean that the inmates allow the guards to "control" them, then yes.

 

The United States leads ALL countries in incarceration, a stat we shouldn't be proud of in the least. The answer definitely isn't being locked up, because the number of incarcerated continues to grow larger each and every day. There has to be something else we can do.

 

*It wouldn't allow me to post it all at once, my bad.*

[cbacon 0]

Says it was his third DUI offense. Sorry he's getting raped and all, but it was his third one.

 

I actually know a guy who has 3 DUI's.........he has court dates and such and doesn't know if he's going to prison or not. Yes a DUI is stupid and he should have his liscense taken away for a long time but I'm not sure he should get some long prison term......he could just get house arrest which seems more in line for what he should get.

Obviously the punishments he's already endured through the other two DUI's did absolutely no good for the guy you know. Again, he's a habitual law breaker that deserves jail/prison time - not being raped.

 

Regardless of the crime, nobody deserves that kind of treatment.

Even someone who's in for rape themselves?

 

Dont believe in an eye for an eye?

The days of Hammurabi have long since passed, and even though it'd be nice to make the person suffer for what they have done by having it done to them, it would make us just as bad as them. I'm probably alone on this, but I think those people just need a good fine tuned attitude adjustment - meaning, you place the rapist in a room with no windows, a camera (so everyone can see what happens to a rapist), and only one door, and then you let in a man like Chuck Liddell and let him adjust the rapist attitude for him. Yes, its breaking the law, but it would be a very effective way of deterring someone from raping another human being.

 

Other than being physically and psychologically damaging, how the hell would that work as a deterrent if it's proven that capital punishment isn't?

 

Bunch of fucking sadists on this board.

[theintensifier 0]

The only reason capital punishment isn't working is because the chances of getting that sentence is so absurdly low, and it takes nearly 15 years to actually be put to death. The level of deterrence I created would happen to any and all individuals who broke the law, doesn't matter if you're a billionaire or not.

 

What I suggested is definitely outrageous yes, but more so than our current means of punishment?

[Dobbs 3K 0]

Well, the reality is that something needs to be done in the US. The population is rapidly rising, due mainly to unchecked illegal immigration. We aren't going to build prisons fast enough to house the rise in the number of criminals that is naturally going to occur as our population gets bigger. We will have to become more brutal as a society in order to keep the criminal element in check. Whether this means harsher punishments, or citizens taking the law into their own hands, I don't really know.

[EricMM 0]

[Dobbs 3K 0]

[EricMM 0]

You are ridiculous.

[bob_barron 0]

Well, the reality is that something needs to be done in the US. The population is rapidly rising, due mainly to unchecked illegal immigration. We aren't going to build prisons fast enough to house the rise in the number of criminals that is naturally going to occur as our population gets bigger. We will have to become more brutal as a society in order to keep the criminal element in check. Whether this means harsher punishments, or citizens taking the law into their own hands, I don't really know.

 

Gimmick.

 

Death Wish was just a movie.

[Dobbs 3K 0]

What do you disagree with in what I said?

[bob_barron 0]

We will have to become more brutal as a society in order to keep the criminal element in check. Whether this means harsher punishments, or citizens taking the law into their own hands, I don't really know.

 

I've never understood why the US has never looked at exile as a viable alternative to domestic incarceration. The US has plenty of islands where no one is living. Ship the scum off to some remote island and let them either survive, or slaughter each other. No reason we should have to pay for them to live.