triple h face turn

[slimm44 0]

I read off a website that Triple H would be taking time off after Unforgiven and that he would become a good guy. It said that Evolution would turn on him and Orton would be the new leader. This reminded me of Michaels getting kicked out of DX after he lost the title at Wrestlemania 14. I wonder if Michaels and Triple H would reform as a team to take on Evolution. Just thought about it.

Edited September 3, 2003 by slimm44

[NoCalMike 0]

My only problem with this is, Evolution hasn't really done enough or been around long enough to make anyone care. Oh and Orton isn't even over, and Flair will get cheered anyway.

[Papacita 0]

I'd rather see a heel HBK/Jericho team than a face HBK/HHH one.

[Guest Anglesault]

I read off a websie that Triple H would be taking time off after Unforgiven and that he would become a good guy. It said that Evolution would turn on him and Orton would be the new leader.

So the least over, least talented and least charasmatic Evolutionite takes over. Makes sense

[Crimson Platypus 0]

But Orton has potential~!

[TheFranchise 0]

So does Maven~!

[Spaceman Spiff 0]

So, Orton, Maven, and Batista will be the ME heels on Raw?

 

Somebody hold me.

[Crimson Platypus 0]

When is Bastista coming back anyway?

[Guest JMA]

So the least over, least talented and least charasmatic Evolutionite takes over. Makes sense

They're not making Batista the leader...

 

Anyway, I like the idea of Triple H being kicked out of Evolution. Not that I want him to turn face, he just doesn't belong in a group called "Evolution." It's too bad he won't retire for a couple of years like Michaels, though. Personally, I'd keep Maven out of the group (at least until he gets a last name). I'd have the group consist of Orton, the returning Batista, Jindrak, and Cade. These four are ALL potential title holders and are most importantly YOUNG. You have the leader (Orton), the enforcer (Batista), and the tag team (Jindrak and Cade). All they need is a manager. Although many people would hate the idea, I'd bring in Piper to manage them. He has history with Randy's father, after all.

[King Cucaracha 0]

Ahem...

 

HBK was thrown out of DX in 1998.

 

Your topic said 1999.

 

Which lead me to believe you meant the 'HBK getting thrown through a car window' angle. That would be a good idea.

 

 

Only trouble is, after an overly long search for the culprit angle, it'll turn out to be Mark Jindrak... Jindrak will take over Evolution, Jindrak will wrestle Triple H with Austin as guest referee, they'll both destroy Austin and in the end it'll all turn out to be a ruse, and Triple H will have been the one behind his own near crippling. And the best part...You Never saw it coming Austin! Austin vs HHH at Mania, HHH goes over.

 

Damn...if I weren't a WWE 'fan' I'd so be head booker.

[notJames 0]

...I'd have the group consist of Orton, the returning Batista, Jindrak, and Cade. These four are ALL potential title holders and are most importantly YOUNG. You have the leader (Orton), the enforcer (Batista), and the tag team (Jindrak and Cade). All they need is a manager. Although many people would hate the idea, I'd bring in Piper to manage them. He has history with Randy's father, after all.

The one glaring omission that ties those four together is that they are all boring and un-over. I can't remember one instance where any of them came out to even a smattering of polite applause or residual heel heat. Orton lost any potential once the RNN updates stopped coming in and they made him over into a Triple H clone. Batista's stint as a run-of-the-mill hoss left no impression, and no doubt his return will garner many a question mark in the minds of fans who didn't even notice him the first time around. Don't even get me started on the twin tyros of Heat. They've shown me nothing but a vanilla presentation, a Tough Enough-esque repertoire of moves (including 18 variations on a very boring dropkick), and not even a hint of charisma.

 

Piper is dead. Dust the ashes off and move on.

 

A gathering of this many green untalented wrestlers for a main event angle would spell disaster for any wrestling company. Which means it's perfect for the shit stew that RAW has become. Kudos on channelling those monkeys scribbling their RAW scripts on cocktail napkins. Perhaps you can send some kind of psychic aneurysm their way and end that Monday Night Farce altogether.

 

(Sorry for the extra vitriol. Somebody shit in my cereal today.)

[Guest JMA]

The one glaring omission that ties those four together is that they are all boring and un-over. I can't remember one instance where any of them came out to even a smattering of polite applause or residual heel heat. Orton lost any potential once the RNN updates stopped coming in and they made him over into a Triple H clone. Batista's stint as a run-of-the-mill hoss left no impression, and no doubt his return will garner many a question mark in the minds of fans who didn't even notice him the first time around. Don't even get me started on the twin tyros of Heat. They've shown me nothing but a vanilla presentation, a Tough Enough-esque repertoire of moves (including 18 variations on a very boring dropkick), and not even a hint of charisma.

 

Piper is dead. Dust the ashes off and move on.

 

A gathering of this many green untalented wrestlers for a main event angle would spell disaster for any wrestling company. Which means it's perfect for the shit stew that RAW has become. Kudos on channelling those monkeys scribbling their RAW scripts on cocktail napkins. Perhaps you can send some kind of psychic aneurysm their way and end that Monday Night Farce altogether.

 

(Sorry for the extra vitriol. Somebody shit in my cereal today.)

Call me an optimist, but I think it could work. Although, I wouldn't move Orton into the ME for at LEAST a year. I'd have him hold the IC title a couple of times.

[notJames 0]

Call me an optimist...

This from a person who has "Cry me a river... so I can drown you" in his profile.

 

And not for nothing, but wouldn't Orton being the head of a group in direct competition with Trips be considered main eventing? Because really, that's all Evolution would be doing for at least six months were they to oust Stephanie's beard from the fold.

[claydude14 0]

If they brought in Mike Sanders it could be like Natural Born Thrillers all over again. I liked them.

[Guest JMA]

And not for nothing, but wouldn't Orton being the head of a group in direct competition with Trips be considered main eventing? Because really, that's all Evolution would be doing for at least six months were they to oust Stephanie's beard from the fold.

Not really. He'd get one main event position with Hunter and then be shot back down to IC level.

[Guest Anglesault]

The one glaring omission that ties those four together is that they are all boring and un-over. I can't remember one instance where any of them came out to even a smattering of polite applause or residual heel heat. Orton lost any potential once the RNN updates stopped coming in and they made him over into a Triple H clone. Batista's stint as a run-of-the-mill hoss left no impression, and no doubt his return will garner many a question mark in the minds of fans who didn't even notice him the first time around. Don't even get me started on the twin tyros of Heat. They've shown me nothing but a vanilla presentation, a Tough Enough-esque repertoire of moves (including 18 variations on a very boring dropkick), and not even a hint of charisma.

 

Piper is dead. Dust the ashes off and move on.

 

A gathering of this many green untalented wrestlers for a main event angle would spell disaster for any wrestling company. Which means it's perfect for the shit stew that RAW has become. Kudos on channelling those monkeys scribbling their RAW scripts on cocktail napkins. Perhaps you can send some kind of psychic aneurysm their way and end that Monday Night Farce altogether.

 

(Sorry for the extra vitriol. Somebody shit in my cereal today.)

Call me an optimist, but I think it could work. Although, I wouldn't move Orton into the ME for at LEAST a year. I'd have him hold the IC title a couple of times.

Suckbag's WORTHLESS POWER~! will just hurt the IC title rather thn help anyone

[Conspiracy_Victim 0]

Well, call me crazy, but couldn't Jericho (if he stays heel, which is likely since his mic work is better that way) take over Evolution? Since WWE is so fond of having quasi-shoot angles, have Orton, Maven, and any of the others turn on HHH when he returns and is his usual overbearing self.

 

Then when the explanation comes up, have Orton say that someone has been telling them about how HHH REALLY is, and will let the group Evolve under someone who understands what they need to do to become true superstars. Countdown hits, Jericho comes out. Then you've got all the tiers covered.

 

Jericho = World champ material

Orton = Intercontinental (if they insist on it)

Jindrak & Cade = Tag team

Batista (maybe) = new Enforcer

Maven = uhh...he can be Paul Roma

 

As far as I know NO ONE outside of Titan tower thinks Orton is ready to be a main event player. This allows them to bring him along a bit more slowly.

 

Just a thought.

[clean rob 0]

Jericho = World champ material

Orton = Intercontinental (if they insist on it)

Jindrak & Cade = Tag team

Batista (maybe) = new Enforcer

Maven = uhh...he can be Paul Roma

This is a very bad idea, IMO. Just basically lumping together a bunch of rookies that WWE are trying to push with Y2J is not going to help anyone. Jericho is best off on his own, he's found a great little niche in the Highlight Reel and he's best sticking with that for now (I also reckon his promo stuff is better as a face, but that's by the by).

Too much green talent in the group means it'll be overcrowded and no-one will be able to get a decent push with the minimal amount of crowd interest they'll garner due to the lack of big names. Not to mention, where's Flair while all of this is happenening? He NEEDS to be in a stable like this, or what's the point of him being around?

Orton is making steady progress, keep him in Evolution with Flair for now (until this Legend Killer gimmick gets him over enough to take down Flair, a logical step if he's going for legends, yes?), Maven needs a heel turn so he'd better go in. Jindrak and Cade can either get over off their own backs or walk. If HHH is indeed off to turn face, a double turn with Goldberg and to have him join Evolution seems the only real option.

So: Flair; Goldberg; Orton; Maven. Between the 4 of them, they might be able to cover up each others weaknesses.

[Guest webmasterofwrestlegame]

If they are going to insist on a HHH face turn and Orton as a new leader of some sort of group, then Batista (on his return), should be the guy to destroy HHH (more believable) with Orton as the brains of the operation.

 

People wouldn't buy Orton as the guy who beats people up, but would as the manipulator I think.

[Guest Anglesault]

Jericho = World champ material

Orton = Intercontinental (if they insist on it)

Jindrak & Cade = Tag team

Batista (maybe) = new Enforcer

Maven = uhh...he can be Paul Roma

Jericho, four guys with no redeeming value whatsoever and MAVEN?

 

Heel. Group. From. Hell.

[CanadianChick 0]

Jericho should never be part of a group. It's not like his character at all. Did he even really have friends as a face? And even from this past Raw, his character doesn't exactly keep loyal to his friends (because he was cheating in the match).

[Use Your Illusion 0]

I'd rather see a heel HBK/Jericho team than a face HBK/HHH one.

Agreed.

 

HBK as the cocky heel is THE SHIT and Jericho would love to work with him considering they're bible buddies and all.

 

Makes sense, doesn't it?

 

And that, my fellow smarks, is why we'll never see it in WWE.

 

That is all.

 

UYI

[Guest Choken One]

Jericho should never be part of a group. It's not like his character at all. Did he even really have friends as a face? And even from this past Raw, his character doesn't exactly keep loyal to his friends (because he was cheating in the match).

Exactly, He was always putting himself over X whom was supposedly his best friend.

 

So why would treat those green rooks on a equal platform...

 

 

When Jericho was a face, He *kinda* had a respect relationship with Benoit but they never were "friends" that hung out or whatnot...

 

You got the impression they only talked about the sport and shit when they got together...you never got "hey we hang out and we like each other" feel...

[Guest Choken One]

I'd rather see a heel HBK/Jericho team than a face HBK/HHH one.

Agreed.

 

HBK as the cocky heel is THE SHIT and Jericho would love to work with him considering they're bible buddies and all.

 

Makes sense, doesn't it?

 

And that, my fellow smarks, is why we'll never see it in WWE.

 

That is all.

 

UYI

Then you have TWO characters that essistantly the same...

 

 

I would love if they did a 180 on the angle and Had Shawn's old cockyness slowly return and let Jericho reemerge as the Uber-Babyface the old fashion way...

 

 

It would *really* make the angle even *THAT* much better...

 

 

I like how WWE makes a point to keep the Shawn/Jericho simmering...knowing DAMN well they might have to use it down the line...Knowing if HHH gets hurt...They got a well built up angle in hand...

[Use Your Illusion 0]

You make a good point.

 

Jericho is LONG over-due for a character overhaul anyway, and using the same insult EVERY FUCKING RAW as though it is some unacceptable, racist slur or something is just retarded.

[Guest Retro Rob]

Didn't they already try Shawn as a heel when he first came back last year? Even if Triple H does turn face, he won't stay that way. Let's face it, in order for him to successfully turn he would need to get some kind of reaction from the crowd. He works as a heel because most fans really DO NOT like the guy. So what happens when he turns face? They will either boo or sit on their hands just like all of his other face runs since 1999. From there he will have no choice but to turn again or look like a complete idiot by killing his own character.

[Guest Choken One]

You make a good point.

 

Jericho is LONG over-due for a character overhaul anyway, and using the same insult EVERY FUCKING RAW as though it is some unacceptable, racist slur or something is just retarded.

I dunno

 

" Sanctimonious Son of a Bitch" might catch on...

 

Esp. how it's all for random reasons...

 

 

Shawn: For what he did to Bret

Austin: Wrecking the set...

 

All he needs to do is Throw back in the "It's a Conspiracy!" every once in a while...

 

Jericho must be happy...Knowing that with a kid on the way (like NOW) he can be careful and become Piper V. 2 and have limited Physical dealings if he were so inclined...

[Guest JMA]

Suckbag's WORTHLESS POWER~! will just hurt the IC title rather thn help anyone

I get it, I get it, you don't like Orton and think he's worthless. I don't. I think he's worth very much and WILL be a star someday. I'm a HHHater and all, but I don't think Orton should be blamed by association. I think he has OMG... POTENTIAL~! I think my stable idea would work if booked right.

[JasonX 0]

Suckbag's WORTHLESS POWER~! will just hurt the IC title rather thn help anyone

I get it, I get it, you don't like Orton and think he's worthless. I don't. I think he's worth very much and WILL be a star someday. I'm a HHHater and all, but I don't think Orton should be blamed by association. I think he has OMG... POTENTIAL~! I think my stable idea would work if booked right.

The hate towards Orton has also to do with the utter cluelessness and iron-handed obsession by the WWE brass towards controling who the audience cheers and boos.

 

The WWE are utterly obsessed with the notion that they can literally recreate the magic they had when Rock went from most hated man in the company to the heel that everyone paid to see get beaten. They totally forget the fact that this happened only because the fan response was actually acknowledged by the WWE. Rock as an up and coming 3rd generation babyface was hated so they turned him into an arrogant asshole heel who loved to mock the fans than now loved the arrogant and cocky Rock, which the fans ate up with spoons.

 

The WWE didn't help their own case when they killed off the "RNN Update" skits which did indeed get a possitive response because it was taking away heel heat for HHH. Note that Orton also got co-opted by HHH, who probably knows Orton is Vince's newest pet project and that he wants to keep Orton near him to make sure he looks good when Orton fails.

 

The WWE seem to be totally up their asses in regards to pushing and developing people fans want to see. If you get over on your own you are buried and pretty much denied ever getting any real push while anyone who honestly gets a connection with the fans gets their push castrated and their character gutted like Orton did.

 

Before Evo, Orton was been remade into being the good looking, narcistitc preppy/jock who comes from rich and famous parents who felt everyone loved him and was so utterly up his own ass in reguards to his feelings that greatness was his by way of birthright that Orton would react violently the first time he was denied and cry that he deserves special treatment do to his family connections and his personal attributes.

 

Now look at Orton. He's now a personalityless version of X-Pac only without the beard, long hair, and bronco buster move. He exists mainly as HHH's prag who for absolutely NO reasons stated has been selected to be HHH and Flair's heir apparent. Why should we care that HHH and Flair sees Randy as the future of the industry? Because Randy's name was randomly drawn out of a hat to determine which OVW wrestler gets the God-Push as HHH's mini-me? Or because Randy knows which dicks to suck backstage to get this plum spot?

 

With Rock, when he joined the Nation he was given a very logical and thought out reason to join. The predominantly white audiences at the WWF shows were screaming "DIE ROCKY DIE" at him on a regular basis for no good reason and that Rocky turned to Farooq and the Nation as a means to get revenge against whitey for attacking him in this cruel manner.

 

Where is Orton's reason? Why should we care about him and HHH? Especially since HHH and Randy are set to become rivals soon ala Rock and Farooq? Part of the fun of Rock and Farooq's feud was the fact that for months we saw Rock slowly usurp control over the NOD from Farooq because Rock had gotten accustomed to the good life since he joined the darkside. Even taking into account HHH's reasons behind hooking up with Randy (selecting him at random to be the future of wrestling and HHH and Flair's heir apparent) we have yet to see Randy doing anything to establish himself as an individual outside of Evo. Even worse, he's becoming nothing more than a Mini-HHH. complete with Legend Killer gimmick. Nor have we seen Randy utterly subverting Evolution towards being a tool to feed his own personal ego, HHH be damned. He haven't seen Randy so utterly hornswaggle Flair to the point that Flair is constantly telling HHH that he needs to stop thinking about himself and keeping the belt and existing solely to bail out Randy whenever he gets in trouble. We havent seen Randy giving Flair a group of hookers for the two of them to fuck while leaving HHH with an ugly fat hooker or to basically have to pay the big scary pimp a very, very, very large sum of money for the hookers that HHH won't even get to fuck.

 

In short, the WWE are trying to make everyone sheeps and cheer and boo who THEY want you to cheer and boo. They don't give a rats ass about givng us a reason to boo Randy Orton, they are just saying "YOU BETTER BOO RANDY OR ELSE!!!!". And in the end, this will do serious damage to Randy's career.....

[Conspiracy_Victim 0]

Jericho = World champ material

Orton = Intercontinental (if they insist on it)

Jindrak & Cade = Tag team

Batista (maybe) = new Enforcer

Maven = uhh...he can be Paul Roma

Jericho, four guys with no redeeming value whatsoever and MAVEN?

 

Heel. Group. From. Hell.

It was just an example AS. Yes it's a horrible horrible thought, but with the current state of the WWE they could have Jericho get amnesia and dress as the Shockmaster every week and it wouldn't really surprise me anymore.

 

SOMEONE in the group needs to be able to talk and if Flair's the one, great it'll give him something to do besides being HHH's little verbal blow-up toy.