X-Pac hating....

[eiker_ir 0]

i always wanted to know when did everyone started hating X-Pac and when did the "X-Pac Heat" originated?

 

i remember him being very over in 1998 and in 1999 i stopped watching (that year sucked) and when i came back in late 2000-early 2001, everybody just hated the guy.

 

He even had some good matches with Tajiri and Kidman during the Invasion but then he came back with the nWo in 2002 and i don't remember much from him after that.

[Hunter's Torn Quad 0]

It didn't help that from returning to the WWF in 1998 until he left in late 2002 that he made no changes to his character or style or moveset or anything. He was beyond stale, and people got sick of him.

[Dobbs 3K 0]

That was it...he was just stale. It was just like "hey, it's X-Pac". That was the whole point of his character for his entire WWF run. It didn't matter if he was face or heel.

[Guest Salacious Crumb]

I'd say when he turned on Kane and it really came out when he was teaming with Road Dogg and they were beating every up and coming team in 2000.

 

Though some of the hate has gone down after his run in TNA where he was actually motivated again.

[Some Guy 0]

I think the negative heat that he had was caused by him having the same gimmick for about 5 years, with virtually no evolution. he was the curly haired, crotch chopping hanger on as Syxx and then X-Pac. He never really changed even during the periods when DX was not a group and then he ended up in X Factor with Justin Credible and Albert. Now he was leading a group but largely using the same gimmick and the group sucked. And they had that horrible entrance music. He was just stale, very, very stale. People were sick of all the DX guys who didn't change with the business. Then they brought him back in nWo to play the same fucking character again, this time with short tights.

 

X Pac rode the wave of being a good worker and having very powerful friends, but always played their lackey. He was over by association, the association stopped and he didn't do anything different.

[Dobbs 3K 0]

One other thing that occured to me...his character never really grew up. He had a sort of "young punk" persona when he first turned heel in WWF, in like, 1995. His character was basically the same when he joined the nWo, and when he came to the WWF. You'd think at some point he would've developed into a more mature, veteran-type character, but it never happened. And he used the same moves basically the whole time (only real change was adding the X-Factor as a finisher).

[MillenniumMan831 0]

I wished he would shave that awful facial hair of his. He looked like he had a 35 year old face on a 13 year old body. Don't know what he's looking like now and I really don't care.

 

That's the thing about X-Pac . . . people just stopped caring once the D-X wave passed by.

[Youth N Asia 0]

When he stuck to his same boring style of kicks and boring moves over and over again. Didn't help matters that he was killing guys twice his size with ease. He just didn't look the part.

[BHK 0]

A motivated X-Pac was good, and could put on a ***+ match on a fairly regular basis. Specifically, I'm a very big fan of his match with Bret on Raw when he was the 1-2-3 Kid.

 

The problem was, his character became stale, and he became very unmotivated and started to work matches in the *-** range for years.

 

I've heard his recent TNA run saw him get motivated and working again, but I haven't seen.

 

Actually, this thread has inspired me *puts X-Pac in sig*

[Guest Trivia247]

didn't help matters much that when he did try to change to the X factor gimmick, that his theme sounded like something out a feel good album.

 

Thanks Uncle Kracker, Albert and Justin Credible needed to look as Hard as Xpac does all the time.

[Guest Mos_Def]

Why was X-Pac so hated early in the decade?

 

For one, he is a member of the Kliq, and Meltzer Rule #567 states that every Kliq member must be a Satan disciple, where their every movement must have some vicious diabolical plot behind it.

 

Secondly, the X-Pac hate probably had a lot to do with WCW going out of business in 2001. The Xpac hate was ratcheted up to an absurd level when WCW kicked the bucket. Since the Hogan’s Nash’s and Hall’s of the world were gone, Meltzer needed somebody to kick around and make out to be a smark heel in order to sell newsletters…(see Triple H)

 

To say that the reason X-Pac was so vilified was because he was “stale” is pretty suspect. Fuck, net icons like Benoit, Jericho and Guerrero have all been playing the same basic role since the mid to late 90’s.

 

If you are going to attack X-Pac’s moveset, then don’t dare call yourself a Ric Flair fan. Even if you’re not a Flair fan, the level of hate X-Pac was receiving for what was basically at that point an irrelevant mid-card character was bizarre to say the least. Its not as if he was dominating WWF television.

 

Most importantly, X-Pac’s “degeneration” as a wrestler had everything to do with the devastating injuries he suffered over his career. That was a point that was rarely acknowledged. Even through he lost a lot of his athleticism and high flying, he was still a very passable worker until his WWF release.

 

Pretty sad X-Pac was so thoroughly trashed given that he had a lot to do with changing the paradigm in wrestling in the 90’s. He wasn’t perfect, but god that was some weak ass lynch mob shit

[Hunter's Torn Quad 0]

Why was X-Pac so hated early in the decade?

 

For one, he is a member of the Kliq, and Meltzer Rule #567 states that every Kliq member must be a Satan disciple, where their every movement must have some vicious diabolical plot behind it.

 

Secondly, the X-Pac hate probably had a lot to do with WCW going out of business in 2001.  The Xpac hate was ratcheted up to an absurd level when WCW kicked the bucket. Since the Hogan’s Nash’s and Hall’s of the world were gone, Meltzer needed somebody to kick around and make out to be a smark heel in order to sell newsletters…(see Triple H)

 

To say that the reason X-Pac was so vilified was because he was “stale” is pretty suspect. Fuck, net icons like Benoit, Jericho and Guerrero have all been playing the same basic role since the mid to late 90’s.

 

If you are going to attack X-Pac’s moveset, then don’t dare call yourself a Ric Flair fan.  Even if you’re not a Flair fan, the level of hate X-Pac was receiving for what was basically at that point an irrelevant mid-card character was bizarre to say the least.  Its not as if he was dominating WWF television.

 

Most importantly, X-Pac’s “degeneration” as a wrestler had everything to do with the devastating injuries he suffered over his career.  That was a point that was rarely acknowledged.  Even through he lost a lot of his athleticism and high flying, he was still a very passable worker until his WWF release.

 

Pretty sad X-Pac was so thoroughly trashed given that he had a lot to do with changing the paradigm in wrestling in the 90’s. He wasn’t perfect, but god that was some weak ass lynch mob shit

That's a lot of sand in that there vagina.

 

For one, he is a member of the Kliq, and Meltzer Rule #567 states that every Kliq member must be a Satan disciple, where their every movement must have some vicious diabolical plot behind it.

 

Debate Rule #1: If you can't defend your point of view in a relevent manner, make an absurd statement to disguise that fact.

 

Secondly, the X-Pac hate probably had a lot to do with WCW going out of business in 2001.

 

He was disliked long before WCW went out of business.

 

The Xpac hate was ratcheted up to an absurd level when WCW kicked the bucket.

 

No, he was hated the same before and after WCW died.

 

Since the Hogan’s Nash’s and Hall’s of the world were gone, Meltzer needed somebody to kick around and make out to be a smark heel in order to sell newsletters…(see Triple H)

 

see Debate Rule #1

 

To say that the reason X-Pac was so vilified was because he was “stale” is pretty suspect.

 

If by suspect, you mean right on the money, then you might be right.

 

Fuck, net icons like Benoit, Jericho and Guerrero have all been playing the same basic role since the mid to late 90’s.

 

You are here.

 

 

 

The mark is here.

 

You'll notice that you're way off the mark.

 

If you are going to attack X-Pac’s moveset, then don’t dare call yourself a Ric Flair fan.

 

At least Ric Flair was having the same good to great match, depending on his opponent, every night.

 

the level of hate X-Pac was receiving for what was basically at that point an irrelevant mid-card character was bizarre to say the least.

 

Might his being irrelevant having something to do with the fact that was so stale and old, and was not connecting with the audience ?

 

Its not as if he was dominating WWF television.

 

The hallmark of staleness.

 

He wasn’t perfect, but god that was some weak ass lynch mob shit

 

Kind of like your weak ass pro-X Pac post. Except our arguments had merit.

[Nighthawk 0]

I'd heard he was supposedly one the best in the world when he was young. I would assume that stopped because of his neck injuries. I never saw him back then, myself.

[Jingus 0]

"Best in the world" is a stretch, but he was pretty damn good. Waltman, Jerry Lynn, Sabu, Al Snow, and RVD all came up around the same time in the midwestern indies, all working kinda similar styles. If you want to see a few decent old Lightning Kid matches, get your hands on a copy of the New Japan 1993 Top of the Super Juniors round-robin tournament, where he has pretty good little matches against Ohtani and Eddy.

 

I think X-Pac got so roundly hated for the following reasons:

 

1. Injuries did play a huge factor, as Waltman slowed down tenfold around 2000 compared even to his days as Syxx, plus he just couldn't bump and fly like he used to. This led to him often wrestling a heavyweight style, despite weighing maybe a buck-thirty at best.

 

2. Let's face it, nobody has ever been as weirdly sympathetic a babyface as pre-unmasking Kane, and it did piss off a shitload of marks when Pac turned on him and worse yet proceeded to beat him time and again in matches over the next six months.

 

3. Degeneration-X 3.0 (the McMahon-Helmsley Factime era) didn't help him any. The team of X-Pac and Road Dogg had zero chemistry together, and were always treated as worthless sidekicks to The Game, yet they still beat the Hardyz, the Dudleys, and E&C about a million times each. Fans didn't like these assholes, didn't like their matches, and were so tired of seeing them win every damn week.

 

4. X-Factor. Do I really need to specify?

[eiker_ir 0]

but i mean even as stale as his character was (basically the same for years) i though he always was at least a decent worker.

 

In the WWF there are alot of other guys who have been playing the same character for years, yet i don't remember anyone else getting this kind of hate by fans and internet fans combined. Are there any other examples of wrestlers with 'X-Pac heat'?

[Youth N Asia 0]

I really enjoyed his matches as Lightning Kid and 1-2-3 Kid. And as Syxx he did some pretty good stuff too.

 

I hate to say he went entirely in the crapper after he got hurt, but he did. And there was just nothing to his character after a while except beating up Kane, Bubba Ray, and other huge guys.

[alfdogg 0]

Are there any other examples of wrestlers with 'X-Pac heat'?

Randy Orton.

[DerangedHermit 0]

Fuck, net icons like Benoit, Jericho and Guerrero have all been playing the same basic role since the mid to late 90’s.

I'm especially looking at you, Chris Jericho

[Guest Mos_Def]

That's a lot of sand in that there vagina

 

Hold up a minute my man. If we were in person and we started having a conversation/debate about X-Pac or anything else for that matter, you wouldn’t start talking all greasy by insulting me and saying that I have sand in my vagina, because I would slap the shit out of you. So why do it behind a computer? Stop playing net thug just because somebody dares have a different perspective than your own.

 

If you’re as knowledgeable as you think you are then leave the 5th grade insults alone. Step your adult game up.

 

Debate Rule #1: If you can't defend your point of view in a relevent manner, make an absurd statement to disguise that fact

 

I’m lovin the debate pointers from somebody who answered everything with snotty one-liners with no support. Yep, there surely is nothing to the fact that Meltzer has been blasting the Kliq members with overreaching criticism for the better part of a decade. So and so is holding down so and so read about it in the next Observer!

 

He was disliked long before WCW went out of business

 

Long before??? By whom? Mind you we are talking about hate.

 

Was he hated when he was an up-and-comer in Japan and Global? Was he hated when he helped to revolutionize the business for lightweights during his early WWF run? Was it during his N.W.O Syxx-Pac days when he had one of the hottest selling shirts, only to have his neck snapped in half by Lex Luger. Was it when he helped put the WWF back on top with his day after Wrestlemania 14 promo? Or was it when he was part of the hottest baby face groups of his era in the late 90’s?

 

Might his being irrelevant having something to do with the fact that was so stale and old, and was not connecting with the audience

 

This is the only decent rebuttal. When everybody was dumping on him, I looked at Xpac as a midcard heel whose matches ranged from passable to good depending on the opponent. Because of injuries his best days were probably behind him. The guy who started this thread was right when he categorized it as Xpac hate. I just couldn’t understand why people hated him. Didn’t seem warranted.

 

your weak ass pro-X Pac post

 

See that’s you problem. You and your ilk are too wrapped up in being pro-this, or anti-that…I hate so and so. All this hyperbole and rhetoric doesn’t allow for any balance or perspective.

 

I’m not pro-Xpac. I just feel that he was a hell of promising talent in his earlier days who was betrayed by horrible injuries which made for a disappointing end to his career. I certainly don’t hate the man.

[alfdogg 0]

Hold up a minute my man. If we were in person and we started having a conversation/debate about X-Pac or anything else for that matter, you wouldn’t start talking all greasy by insulting me and saying that I have sand in my vagina, because I would slap the shit out of you. So why do it behind a computer? Stop playing net thug just because somebody dares have a different perspective than your own.

[Nighthawk 0]

Are you really Mos Def, hip hop superstar and acting sensation?

[Guest LooneyTune]

From 1998-2002, if you saw 1 X-Pac match, promo, or anything else you did, you could just imagine it 596 times more, because he never changed a thing.

 

I still remember Chris Jerichos promo from No Mercy 2000 (or was it Unforgiven), where he basically mocked X-Pac for not changing (and then was quesitoning why he still wore DX colors despite splitting up 3-4 months earlier).

[Guest Mos_Def]

In the WWF there are alot of other guys who have been playing the same character for years, yet i don't remember anyone else getting this kind of hate by fans and internet fans combined

 

Agreed. My point exactly, although I would probably emphasize internet fans.

[natey2k4 0]

I think it came when he was the only remaining member of DX... probably the least important to the group (minus Chyna)... and he was the last man of the group... Road Dogg I guess was there too.. but he got the face heat.. and then stopped showing up pretty much.

[Vern Gagne 0]

In the WWF there are alot of other guys who have been playing the same character for years, yet i don't remember anyone else getting this kind of hate by fans and internet fans combined

 

Agreed. My point exactly, although I would probably emphasize internet fans.

Those guys are either good at what they do. Like Kurt Angle, or Chris Jericho.Even those two have tweaked their characters over the years. Or talentless hacks like Bob Holly who no one cares about. The routine also grew old...X-Pac was receiving bad heel heat. Instead of making changes, and maturing (has mentioned earlier)he remained the same.

[Jingus 0]

And when he finally did change, it was for the worse. Remember the porn-star outfits he wore during X-Factor that made him look even skinnier than he was?

 

Lemme say again... X-Factor. You couldn't have a better prototype for designing a stable that the fans would shit all over.

[Nighthawk 0]

Pac really should have shaved his head for it. Would have seemed like he cared.

[Guest Fook_Theta]

One of the RoH boards "Why I watch" videos has 1-2-3 Kid jumping off the turnbuckle in a missile dropkick, getting caught by the Champion Bret Hart, and getting beat with the Sharpshooter. Bret grabs the title and then picks him up to presumingly hug and give him the face-to-face "Give him a round of applause folks."

 

Pretty awesome stuff. Not to mention the Razor Ramon getting beat on Raw by a jobber angle. Still have to put that in top ten(20?) Raw moments/angles. I haven't seen the entire thing since it happened, but I do remember being quite surprised at how well that was booked.

 

 

The even brighter side is that Sean Waltman now has a legit chance at redeeming his career and wrestling character. Maybe he'll pick up some inspiration from Raven on how to build a "third-dimensional character." Although it would be funny if he becomes apart of the New Flock in a tired rehash angle.

[Enigma 0]

"Hey X-Pac, 1998 called. It wants you back." -- Edge to X-Pac on a RAW in 2001

[Hunter's Torn Quad 0]

Hold up a minute my man. If we were in person and we started having a conversation/debate about X-Pac or anything else for that matter, you wouldn’t start talking all greasy by insulting me and saying that I have sand in my vagina, because I would slap the shit out of you. So why do it behind a computer? Stop playing net thug just because somebody dares have a different perspective than your own.

Quiet, you'll make him look like a hypocrite. Oh wait, he is.

 

And as for this little line:

 

Yep, there surely is nothing to the fact that Meltzer has been blasting the Kliq members with overreaching criticism for the better part of a decade

 

I guess you've chosen to ignore the praise he has for Triple H, who, and I might be wrong on this, was a member of The Clique ?