ESPN sucks, so do thread closers

[TheDevilAndGodAreRagingInsideMe 0]

I certainly can't think of any other reason why he has his job.

[Timmy8271 0]

Well I guess he wasn't suspended since he was on sportscenter last night.

[Guest "Go, Mordecai!"]

Sean Salisbury does a radio show in Chicago that nobody really listens to on AM 1000, the local ESPN affiliate. I read that on today's show, he called some woman from the Sun-Times and asked her out on the air. Sean Salisbury is just a weird dude, I guess.

[hyperchord24 0]

Jayson Stark is now calling out all the voters who didn't vote for Ripken and Gwynn and wants them to step forward and explain why. As if those who didn't owe something to the general public. Yeah sure, on paper, you really can't give a good reason why they shouldn't be in the HoF, but is getting 100% of the vote really that important?

[naiwf 0]

Ripken was a compiler known more for "The Streak" than his onfield prowess most of the time. He only had 2 200 hit seasons, 1 30 HR season, 3 100 run seasons and 4 100 RBI seasons, and for a guy known as a power hitting SS his .276/.340/.447 line isn't all that impressive. Gwynn had no power, a fairly low OBP for a career .339 hitter and scored a surprisingly low run total given the amount of times he got on. Is that good enough? Neither guy deserved to be the first unanimous HOFer in MLB history.

 

McGwire just plain didn't deserve to get in, juiced up or not.

[NYU 0]

But think about it. Who can look at the Hall of Fame ballot, see Tony Gwynn and Cal Ripken's names, say "You know, these guys don't deserve to be in the Hall", and then turn around and vote for somebody else? Who else on the ballot was more deserving than these two?

 

It's not about being the first unanimous Hall inductee in history. It is about asking if each voter was responsible with his ballot, choosing to go on the player's merits instead of some silly bias -- like the whole "steroid era" angle that one writer took which was just mind-numbingly stupid.

[cabbageboy 0]

I agree. These writers who just refuse to put a guy down on the first ballot are morons and adhering to some sort of old school code that has no basis in reality. I too heard that one guy ramble about the steroid era yesterday, as if Ripken or Gwynn have ever been accused of juicing.

 

I'm not saying either guy is an absolute top level HOF player, since both have some sort of hole in their game. I'd like to hear the rationale behind some of these guys not voting for say...Willie Mays.

[hyperchord24 0]

But think about it. Who can look at the Hall of Fame ballot, see Tony Gwynn and Cal Ripken's names, say "You know, these guys don't deserve to be in the Hall", and then turn around and vote for somebody else? Who else on the ballot was more deserving than these two?

 

It's not about being the first unanimous Hall inductee in history. It is about asking if each voter was responsible with his ballot, choosing to go on the player's merits instead of some silly bias -- like the whole "steroid era" angle that one writer took which was just mind-numbingly stupid.

If there's a concern of a silly bias, then why don't we just take the whole human element out of it. These writers are voters because they are the most knowledgable on the subject. The HoF is asking for their opinion on certain players.

 

I have this nasty habit of playing devil's advocate way too much. But can anyone say who's taken steroids and who hasn't with any sort certainty? Yeah, I know I'm going to get flamed for that.

[EVIL~! alkeiper 0]

Ripken was a compiler known more for "The Streak" than his onfield prowess most of the time. He only had 2 200 hit seasons, 1 30 HR season, 3 100 run seasons and 4 100 RBI seasons, and for a guy known as a power hitting SS his .276/.340/.447 line isn't all that impressive. Gwynn had no power, a fairly low OBP for a career .339 hitter and scored a surprisingly low run total given the amount of times he got on. Is that good enough? Neither guy deserved to be the first unanimous HOFer in MLB history.

 

McGwire just plain didn't deserve to get in, juiced up or not.

What is impressive however is that Ripken is the all time leader for home runs, extra base hits, and total bases by a shortstop. He was also an above-average defensive shortstop. The comment about having ONLY four 100 RBI seasons is comical, given that only five shortstops have had more such seasons, and the three eligible are in the Hall. How many shortstops have more than two 200 hit seasons? Five again. (Oddly, only Johnny Pesky is retired). 30 home runs? Again, only five shortstops have done that more than once. Two are retired, one is in. If you're going to use power numbers against a shortstop, you need to have some kind of a notion regarding context.

 

As for Gwynn, Nap Lajoie had a .380 OBP along with his .338 batting average. Criticizing Gwynn for only finishing 84th in runs scored is nit-picking. Have you seen some of those Padre teams he played on?

 

The unanimous selection is not some kind of gold star that even the greatest stars couldn't attain. It's the result of voting problems in the Hall's early days, and it is being propped up beyond its worth. There is no valid reason to find either Cal Ripken or Tony Gwynn undeserving of the Hall of Fame.

[bob_barron 0]

If there's a concern of a silly bias, then why don't we just take the whole human element out of it. These writers are voters because they are the most knowledgable on the subject. The HoF is asking for their opinion on certain players.

 

But if you don't think Ripken or Gwynn are Hall of Famers, then who is? Those people should be taken out back and shot

[hyperchord24 0]

Gwynn on the steroid era:

 

"In the late 1980s and early '90s, we had no rules," Gwynn said Tuesday on a conference call. "We knew, players knew, owners knew, everybody knew, and we didn't say anything about it."

 

If this doesn't cloud your opinion of EVERY player from the steroid era, then I don't know what will.

[naiwf 0]

Ripken was a compiler known more for "The Streak" than his onfield prowess most of the time. He only had 2 200 hit seasons, 1 30 HR season, 3 100 run seasons and 4 100 RBI seasons, and for a guy known as a power hitting SS his .276/.340/.447 line isn't all that impressive. Gwynn had no power, a fairly low OBP for a career .339 hitter and scored a surprisingly low run total given the amount of times he got on. Is that good enough? Neither guy deserved to be the first unanimous HOFer in MLB history.

 

McGwire just plain didn't deserve to get in, juiced up or not.

What is impressive however is that Ripken is the all time leader for home runs, extra base hits, and total bases by a shortstop. He was also an above-average defensive shortstop. The comment about having ONLY four 100 RBI seasons is comical, given that only five shortstops have had more such seasons, and the three eligible are in the Hall. How many shortstops have more than two 200 hit seasons? Five again. (Oddly, only Johnny Pesky is retired). 30 home runs? Again, only five shortstops have done that more than once. Two are retired, one is in. If you're going to use power numbers against a shortstop, you need to have some kind of a notion regarding context.

 

As for Gwynn, Nap Lajoie had a .380 OBP along with his .338 batting average. Criticizing Gwynn for only finishing 84th in runs scored is nit-picking. Have you seen some of those Padre teams he played on?

 

The unanimous selection is not some kind of gold star that even the greatest stars couldn't attain. It's the result of voting problems in the Hall's early days, and it is being propped up beyond its worth. There is no valid reason to find either Cal Ripken or Tony Gwynn undeserving of the Hall of Fame.

 

I wasn't saying that Ripken and/or Gwynn weren't worthy candidates. Someone asked for a reason why those guys might not have appeared on someone's ballot, and I listed them. Had a guy like Ripken retired at 35 instead of 40 he'd look a lot less impressive and some voters would rather see a dominant shorter (10-15 yr) career than a very good longer (16-20 yr) one. Gwynn was a great contact hitter with no pop and very little speed at the midpoint to tail end of his career. Gwynn scored under 1400 runs after getting on base almost 4000 times (39th in times on base and 84th in runs scored is a pretty big gap). That's pretty damned low, and by far the least number of runs of anyone with as many hits as he has. Would I have voted for both guys? Yes. Is it sacreligious that some guys didn't? No.

[2GOLD 0]

The only reason is someone saying they weren't exciting players to watch. Other than that, I cannot think of a logical reason not look at your ballot and vote for Gwynn and Ripken Jr.

 

I'm tired of this whole roid era crap, it's turned into a witch hunt and it needs to stop.

[Guest Princess Leena]

If you don't vote for Ripken or Gwynn, then who do you vote for? If one thinks there's should be a HOF with like 10 guys forever then I don't know if they should have any say.

[hyperchord24 0]

I'm tired of this whole roid era crap, it's turned into a witch hunt and it needs to stop.

Agreed.

[2GOLD 0]

If you don't vote for Ripken or Gwynn, then who do you vote for? If one thinks there's should be a HOF will like 10 guys forever then I don't know if they should have any say.

 

Maybe some of them are in the Steve Garvey fan club and refuses to vote for anyone else BUT Steve Garvey. It would explain all his votes.

[snuffbox 0]

I'm tired of this whole roid era crap, it's turned into a witch hunt and it needs to stop.

Agreed.

 

Yeah. People should be allowed to cheat until we actually see quads tear and bodies lying on the field. I want my baseball to be played by either robots or dudes who want to feel like used up racehorses. Plus, if we ignore steroid usage then retarded teenagers will be able to do it even easier...more home runs in high school ball, babay!

[Guest Princess Leena]

I picture many HOF voters being like Monty Burns in that baseball episode.

[CanadianChris 0]

These writers are voters because they are the most knowledgable on the subject.

Some baseball writers aren't even qualified to vote on the pregame spread in the press box.

[CanadianChris 0]

If there's a concern of a silly bias, then why don't we just take the whole human element out of it. These writers are voters because they are the most knowledgable on the subject. The HoF is asking for their opinion on certain players.

 

But if you don't think Ripken or Gwynn are Hall of Famers, then who is? Those people should be taken out back and shot

I can't wait to see the rationale of the guy who decides not to vote for Rickey Henderson in two years.

[Guest Princess Leena]

Rickey demands that Rickey be in the HOF.

[snuffbox 0]

Roger Clemens will probably end up with 80% of the vote whenever he comes up.

 

"These young'ns aint no Abner Doubleday, I'll tell ya what."

[CanadianChris 0]

Roger Clemens will probably end up with 80% of the vote whenever he comes up.

 

"These young'ns aint no Abner Doubleday, I'll tell ya what."

I'm sure some bitter old sportswriter in Boston or Toronto will not vote for him out of spite.

[Guest "Go, Mordecai!"]

That empty-ballot sportswriter was from the Daily Southtown, I guess. What a douche. Is there anything to like about the South Side other than the Museum of Science & Industry? And does that even count?

 

I can't wait to see the rationale of the guy who decides not to vote for Rickey Henderson in two years.

"Stayed around too long," which is probably coming from someone like Bob Ryan, who himself has stayed around too long.

 

Roger Clemens will probably end up with 80% of the vote whenever he comes up.

"Steroids, not pure, blah blah"

 

I want my baseball to be played by . . . robots

Okay, snuffy, if Football Robot starts suiting up for baseball during Fox games, I'm blaming you.

 

Gwynn on the steroid era:

 

"In the late 1980s and early '90s, we had no rules," Gwynn said Tuesday on a conference call. "We knew, players knew, owners knew, everybody knew, and we didn't say anything about it."

I'm glad Tony Gwynn came forth with this, because it probably sounded funny in his voice.

[snuffbox 0]

I like the sprawl of South Side lights as I ride through on the Greyhound at night. Actually stopping in the area, not so much.

 

If Baseball Robot happens...will I be All That Is Wrong With MLB?

[The Man in Blak 0]

[The Man in Blak 0]

Also, it seems that the Hall of Fame (and, really, baseball in general) is held as some utopian ideal of virtue by writers that are desperately trying to preserve the childhood innocence that they once had for the game, rather than an institution dedicated to preserving the history of baseball. Compare the reactions of announcements for the Baseball Hall of Fame to the Football Hall of Fame or even the reaction to the use of PEDs in each league.

[bob_barron 0]

In the span of an hour, the Bill Simmons chat became Insider only

[TheDevilAndGodAreRagingInsideMe 0]

 

I hated that game so f'n much...

[Vampiro69 0]

I picture many HOF voters being like Monty Burns in that baseball episode.

 

Smithers, this team will include Cap Anson and Mordecai "3 Finger" Brown.