Paul Heyman sent home

[Hawk 34 0]

Five years with one of the best minds in the business, ever, and it produced eight months of quality heel commentary, 3 months of good tv on Smackdown and a tremendous run in the minor league promotion that a tiny fraction of people saw (which was still the second best American promotion in that time period), a one-off PPV classic and a bunch of wasted airtime as a virtual mouthpiece for whatever "monster" they felt needed it and he spent the majority of that time being a voiceless "consult".

[luke-o 0]

We all know Smackdown is WCW anyway.

 

I thought that was TNA?

[mfn 0]

Five years with one of the best minds in the business, ever, and it produced eight months of quality heel commentary, 3 months of good tv on Smackdown and a tremendous run in the minor league promotion that a tiny fraction of people saw (which was still the second best American promotion in that time period), a one-off PPV classic and a bunch of wasted airtime as a virtual mouthpiece for whatever "monster" they felt needed it and he spent the majority of that time being a voiceless "consult".

Yep. That's Heyman.

[uhftv 0]

The problem was right from the start of the 1st scifi show when they had that horrible extreme battle royal. So either Vince comes up with crappy ideas and Heyman gets the blame when the idea bombs which would make Vince INSANE, or he rejects 98% of what Paul comes up with and so whatever's left is only marginally better than what Vince would agree with and still gets the blame despite not being able to do what he wants. Sounds like typical employees that are kept around just to be horsewhipped.

[haVoc 0]

Extremists divided on Heyman’s dismissal

 

December 4, 2006

 

 

Initial reactions by the ECW Extremists to today's announcement of Paul Heyman's dismissal seem split down tenure lines. The ECW Originals appear upset and in a state of shock, whereas the new breeds seem to have a more optimistic outlook.

 

"I'm shocked right now," said Tommy Dreamer. "I don't know what's going on right now."

 

Dreamer boasts the longest tenure with ECW and has known Heyman for over ten years. Fellow ECW Original, Stevie Richards was equally shocked by the announcement.

 

"I have no idea what to say, except whatever Paul decides to do eventually, I wish him the best of luck in future endeavors," said Richards.

 

While many of the ECW Originals were too shocked by Heyman's dismissal to react to the situation yet, Rob Van Dam had some very strong words to say. While the two have not always gotten along over the years, RVD clearly doesn't like the idea of Heyman not being a part of the brand.

 

 

"I think that without Paul fighting for the better direction to take ECW I fear that it's in for some horrible changes," said Van Dam.

 

It seems the Originals are wrestling with the idea of what an ECW without Heyman will mean. However, for those who have only been with Heyman and the brand since debuting on Sci Fi in June of this year, the future it looking bright.

 

"To quote a famous man, Hulkamania dies when Hogan dies, 'Woo' dies when Ric Flair dies, but when that man [Heyman] is gone and while he's gone, ECW will live on," said relative newcomer Elijah Burke.

 

"During a hurricane, some trees fall, others remain standing," explained Matt Striker. "During a hurricane, some houses fall, others remain standing. But the fishing is always better after the hurricane has passed."

 

In an industry where nothing seems constant, one ECW Original summed up what you can always count on.

 

"Well it just goes to show you, nothing ever surprises you in the world of [sports entertainment]," said Little Guido.

 

Credit: WWE.com

 

Gotta love how they edited Little Guido. Just can't use that dirty little word "wrestling."

[Annabelle 0]

vince is a moron. he just got lucky. right place, right time. now what is he? he's an idiot. vince's enthusiasm & entrepreneurial spirit fueled the inception of the company with wrestlemania, ect. that's when he was desperate to win over fans & become successful. the man hasn't done that in almost 20 years. he's self serving & spits in the face of the fans. anyone who makes up excuses, & attempts to rationalize how horrible a human being & business man he is is a moron. people (like myself) pump money into this assholes wallet. he's a total dunce. but goddamnit, i will buy that macho man dvd.

[justcoz 0]

This is really the best thing that could have happened in the business. I would have lost complete respect for Paul Heyman if he was still working for the company after last night. I think last night's PPV is going to be a real pivotal moment in the next saga of pro wrestling. The reference point kind of like the Montreal Screwjob was in the 90's. Vince and creative totally thought that their rewriting of last night's PPV was going to get over huge and when it didn't, when the fans in the arena turned on it, they blamed Paul Heyman for not being able to get the old ECW fans to accept the new vision of ECW. They blamed him for creating the vocal monsters who dare make the product look bad. Just like it wasn't their booking at the ECW taping at Hammerstein Ballroom. It was those disrespectful fans who didn't even give Batista and Big Show a chance! I think I read in the Observer that was another negative mark against Paul Heyman by management. It was his fault, not the bad WWE creative touches.

 

Heyman had little involvement in the booking of last night's PPV. I would venture to say that 90% of his show was rewritten and probably to spite him. I'm sure Paul Heyman didn't book CM Punk to job out first in the chamber. That was Stephanie's creative gem - likely to spit on Heyman for protecting the king of indies and getting him over when she saw nothing in him. Sabu was probably written out by WWE creative, Heyman probably had him looking semi-decent in the Chamber and since he's on management's shit list they didn't feel he was worthy. Tommy Dreamer probably went over in an extreme rules match. These are all just guesses but they seem logical. Also, if Heyman did book Lashley to get the belt, I'm sure he had him looking stronger in that match and WWE didn't feel it was 'strong enough' and came up with the Bob Holly idea to make it 'more impressive'.

 

I'm also wondering if Heyman's comment last night about 'the old ECW built on the backs of RVD, Sabu and Sandman being dead and this being the GLOBAL ECW, was fed to him by creative or said as his own way of making sure any diehards left knew that.

 

I'd love to hear something like RVD, Sabu, Tommy Dreamer, FBI and maybe someone like Punk or Lashley who benefitted in development from Heyman's guidance - refusing to work the taping tonight with some even asking for their release. I doubt it will happen but if this led some sort of mass talent exit, it would be beautiful.

 

TNA would be foolish not to hire Heyman but I'm still not sold as to this not being a work or amends being made and it being turned into an angle. I'm sure Kurt Angle, Rhyno and The Dudleys are all trying to phone Heyman tonight. Maybe even Russo who knows this 'the insiders' will eat this shit up and may not have any problem cowriting with Heyman?

[Guest samoapunk]

It's a sad day indeed. The rebirth of ECW wasn't even EC-Dub to begin with.

 

I hope some of the originals stick up for Paul as well. Maybe they can all re-unite in ROH and stick it to Vince the way he's stuck it to the ECW fans.

 

BTW, I also would like a Mcho Man dvd as well as a Jerry Lawler dvd.

[Hawk 34 0]

It's a sad day indeed. The rebirth of ECW wasn't even EC-Dub to begin with.

 

I hope some of the originals stick up for Paul as well. Maybe they can all re-unite in ROH and stick it to Vince the way he's stick it to the ECW fans.

 

Dreamer, Sabu, Guido, Balls? Fuck that, they can go to Ian's promotion or CZW, if it's even still around in 6 months.

[mfn 0]

This is really the best thing that could have happened in the business. I would have lost complete respect for Paul Heyman if he was still working for the company after last night. I think last night's PPV is going to be a real pivotal moment in the next saga of pro wrestling. The reference point kind of like the Montreal Screwjob was in the 90's. Vince and creative totally thought that their rewriting of last night's PPV was going to get over huge and when it didn't, when the fans in the arena turned on it, they blamed Paul Heyman for not being able to get the old ECW fans to accept the new vision of ECW. They blamed him for creating the vocal monsters who dare make the product look bad. Just like it wasn't their booking at the ECW taping at Hammerstein Ballroom. It was those disrespectful fans who didn't even give Batista and Big Show a chance! I think I read in the Observer that was another negative mark against Paul Heyman by management. It was his fault, not the bad WWE creative touches.

 

Heyman had little involvement in the booking of last night's PPV. I would venture to say that 90% of his show was rewritten and probably to spite him. I'm sure Paul Heyman didn't book CM Punk to job out first in the chamber. That was Stephanie's creative gem - likely to spit on Heyman for protecting the king of indies and getting him over when she saw nothing in him. Sabu was probably written out by WWE creative, Heyman probably had him looking semi-decent in the Chamber and since he's on management's shit list they didn't feel he was worthy. Tommy Dreamer probably went over in an extreme rules match. These are all just guesses but they seem logical. Also, if Heyman did book Lashley to get the belt, I'm sure he had him looking stronger in that match and WWE didn't feel it was 'strong enough' and came up with the Bob Holly idea to make it 'more impressive'.

 

I'm also wondering if Heyman's comment last night about 'the old ECW built on the backs of RVD, Sabu and Sandman being dead and this being the GLOBAL ECW, was fed to him by creative or said as his own way of making sure any diehards left knew that.

 

I'd love to hear something like RVD, Sabu, Tommy Dreamer, FBI and maybe someone like Punk or Lashley who benefitted in development from Heyman's guidance - refusing to work the taping tonight with some even asking for their release. I doubt it will happen but if this led some sort of mass talent exit, it would be beautiful.

 

TNA would be foolish not to hire Heyman but I'm still not sold as to this not being a work or amends being made and it being turned into an angle. I'm sure Kurt Angle, Rhyno and The Dudleys are all trying to phone Heyman tonight. Maybe even Russo who knows this 'the insiders' will eat this shit up and may not have any problem cowriting with Heyman?

I don't see Heyman going back. McMahon pretty much stole the attitude era from Heyman, then brought Heyman in after ECW folded probably only because he felt obligated to. He brought back ECW just to shit all over it.

 

How sweet of a 'FUCK YOU' would it be if Heyman did infact go to TNA and turned that son of a bitch around and made it into serious compitition for the WWE.

[haVoc 0]

Dreamer, Sabu, Guido, Balls, Richards, etc, quiting and going to ROH would be sticking it to Vince?

 

How will WWE ever recover from such a loss?

[Guest samoapunk]

This is really the best thing that could have happened in the business. I would have lost complete respect for Paul Heyman if he was still working for the company after last night. I think last night's PPV is going to be a real pivotal moment in the next saga of pro wrestling. The reference point kind of like the Montreal Screwjob was in the 90's. Vince and creative totally thought that their rewriting of last night's PPV was going to get over huge and when it didn't, when the fans in the arena turned on it, they blamed Paul Heyman for not being able to get the old ECW fans to accept the new vision of ECW. They blamed him for creating the vocal monsters who dare make the product look bad. Just like it wasn't their booking at the ECW taping at Hammerstein Ballroom. It was those disrespectful fans who didn't even give Batista and Big Show a chance! I think I read in the Observer that was another negative mark against Paul Heyman by management. It was his fault, not the bad WWE creative touches.

 

Heyman had little involvement in the booking of last night's PPV. I would venture to say that 90% of his show was rewritten and probably to spite him. I'm sure Paul Heyman didn't book CM Punk to job out first in the chamber. That was Stephanie's creative gem - likely to spit on Heyman for protecting the king of indies and getting him over when she saw nothing in him. Sabu was probably written out by WWE creative, Heyman probably had him looking semi-decent in the Chamber and since he's on management's shit list they didn't feel he was worthy. Tommy Dreamer probably went over in an extreme rules match. These are all just guesses but they seem logical. Also, if Heyman did book Lashley to get the belt, I'm sure he had him looking stronger in that match and WWE didn't feel it was 'strong enough' and came up with the Bob Holly idea to make it 'more impressive'.

 

I'm also wondering if Heyman's comment last night about 'the old ECW built on the backs of RVD, Sabu and Sandman being dead and this being the GLOBAL ECW, was fed to him by creative or said as his own way of making sure any diehards left knew that.

 

I'd love to hear something like RVD, Sabu, Tommy Dreamer, FBI and maybe someone like Punk or Lashley who benefitted in development from Heyman's guidance - refusing to work the taping tonight with some even asking for their release. I doubt it will happen but if this led some sort of mass talent exit, it would be beautiful.

 

TNA would be foolish not to hire Heyman but I'm still not sold as to this not being a work or amends being made and it being turned into an angle. I'm sure Kurt Angle, Rhyno and The Dudleys are all trying to phone Heyman tonight. Maybe even Russo who knows this 'the insiders' will eat this shit up and may not have any problem cowriting with Heyman?

I don't see Heyman going back. McMahon pretty much stole the attitude era from Heyman, then brought Heyman in after ECW folded probably only because he felt obligated to. He brought back ECW just to shit all over it.

 

How sweet of a 'FUCK YOU' would it be if Heyman did infact go to TNA and turned that son of a bitch around and made it into serious compitition for the WWE.

 

Is there any talk of Impact going to a 2 hour show? If they went 2 hours a week, they could compete, but with the way they have to cram everything in a 60 minute slot now just doesn't work for me. Especially with all of the talent they have. A 2 hour Impact with Heyman booking would however be very sweet indeed.

[Hawk 34 0]

Dreamer, Sabu, Guido, Balls, Richards, etc, quiting and going to ROH would be sticking it to Vince?

 

How will WWE ever recover from such a loss?

 

Staying in the company would be sticking it to Vince. In 2011, Vince, while limping over his walker will look at the roster and scream as loud as he possibly can

 

Stevie Richards? Who the fuck is Stevie Richards?!!

[foleyfanforever88 0]

Question: If you were Lashley right now, would you say anything to McMahon regarding the fact that putting the title on you was probably a horrible idea?

[SamoaRowe 0]

It wouldn't hurt WWE, but at least the message would get across. It would also make Tuesday night's weekly abortion seem even more pathetic if the one connection to the old ECW they have is RVD, who they are having fun burying week in and week out.

[mfn 0]

This is really the best thing that could have happened in the business. I would have lost complete respect for Paul Heyman if he was still working for the company after last night. I think last night's PPV is going to be a real pivotal moment in the next saga of pro wrestling. The reference point kind of like the Montreal Screwjob was in the 90's. Vince and creative totally thought that their rewriting of last night's PPV was going to get over huge and when it didn't, when the fans in the arena turned on it, they blamed Paul Heyman for not being able to get the old ECW fans to accept the new vision of ECW. They blamed him for creating the vocal monsters who dare make the product look bad. Just like it wasn't their booking at the ECW taping at Hammerstein Ballroom. It was those disrespectful fans who didn't even give Batista and Big Show a chance! I think I read in the Observer that was another negative mark against Paul Heyman by management. It was his fault, not the bad WWE creative touches.

 

Heyman had little involvement in the booking of last night's PPV. I would venture to say that 90% of his show was rewritten and probably to spite him. I'm sure Paul Heyman didn't book CM Punk to job out first in the chamber. That was Stephanie's creative gem - likely to spit on Heyman for protecting the king of indies and getting him over when she saw nothing in him. Sabu was probably written out by WWE creative, Heyman probably had him looking semi-decent in the Chamber and since he's on management's shit list they didn't feel he was worthy. Tommy Dreamer probably went over in an extreme rules match. These are all just guesses but they seem logical. Also, if Heyman did book Lashley to get the belt, I'm sure he had him looking stronger in that match and WWE didn't feel it was 'strong enough' and came up with the Bob Holly idea to make it 'more impressive'.

 

I'm also wondering if Heyman's comment last night about 'the old ECW built on the backs of RVD, Sabu and Sandman being dead and this being the GLOBAL ECW, was fed to him by creative or said as his own way of making sure any diehards left knew that.

 

I'd love to hear something like RVD, Sabu, Tommy Dreamer, FBI and maybe someone like Punk or Lashley who benefitted in development from Heyman's guidance - refusing to work the taping tonight with some even asking for their release. I doubt it will happen but if this led some sort of mass talent exit, it would be beautiful.

 

TNA would be foolish not to hire Heyman but I'm still not sold as to this not being a work or amends being made and it being turned into an angle. I'm sure Kurt Angle, Rhyno and The Dudleys are all trying to phone Heyman tonight. Maybe even Russo who knows this 'the insiders' will eat this shit up and may not have any problem cowriting with Heyman?

I don't see Heyman going back. McMahon pretty much stole the attitude era from Heyman, then brought Heyman in after ECW folded probably only because he felt obligated to. He brought back ECW just to shit all over it.

 

How sweet of a 'FUCK YOU' would it be if Heyman did infact go to TNA and turned that son of a bitch around and made it into serious compitition for the WWE.

 

Is there any talk of Impact going to a 2 hour show? If they went 2 hours a week, they could compete, but with the way they have to cram everything in a 60 minute slot now just doesn't work for me. Especially with all of the talent they have. A 2 hour Impact with Heyman booking would however be very sweet indeed.

I agree that TNA needs to go to a 2 hour show, that way the entire show won't feel as rushed. I thought that their 2 hour prime time special was a well booked show, and it didn't seem rushed at all. Give TNA 2 hours and Heyman and we might be able to enjoy wrestling again.

[Hawk 34 0]

Question: If you were Lashley right now, would you say anything to McMahon regarding the fact that putting the title on you was probably a horrible idea?

 

If I were Lashley, I'd shut my mouth and do what they say. He lucked out that Sapp left the contract offer on the table and by virture of being black and big, he tripped into that title reign.

[geniusMoment 0]

Dreamer, Sabu, Guido, Balls, Richards, etc, quiting and going to ROH would be sticking it to Vince?

 

How will WWE ever recover from such a loss?

 

Staying in the company would be sticking it to Vince. In 2011, Vince, while limping over his walker will look at the roster and scream as loud as he possibly can

 

Stevie Richards? Who the fuck is Stevie Richards?!!

2011? Walker? Do you know something about Vince's health that I don't?

[Thanks for the Fish 0]

Don't look know, but the spoilers sound pretty damn good on paper anyways...

[mfn 0]

Don't look know, but the spoilers sound pretty damn good on paper anyways...

nevermind. got it.

[razazteca 0]

vince is a moron. he just got lucky. right place, right time. now what is he? he's an idiot. vince's enthusiasm & entrepreneurial spirit fueled the inception of the company with wrestlemania, ect. that's when he was desperate to win over fans & become successful. the man hasn't done that in almost 20 years. he's self serving & spits in the face of the fans. anyone who makes up excuses, & attempts to rationalize how horrible a human being & business man he is is a moron. people (like myself) pump money into this assholes wallet. he's a total dunce. but goddamnit, i will buy that macho man dvd.

A Randy Savage sex tape featuring "divas" and various strippers would sell millions!

[uhftv 0]

Are we going to get to a point where the creative team is comprised mostly of people who have no wrestling background? ( i dont know maybe we're already there)

 

Eventually it'll just be the mcmahons sitting across the table from Grisham

[Scroby 0]

Don't look know, but the spoilers sound pretty damn good on paper anyways...

and makes me think Heyman will be back.

[randomguy 0]

The amount of press on WWE.com along with its tenor really makes it smell like a work.

 

Why would they quote RVD on WWE.com saying the thinks ECW will suck without Heyman?

[CubbyBr 0]

Please Dixie, if he really is fired just give him the book and total control. Please, just use Russo to write backstage promos or just have him give ideas. Please.

 

If nothing else PLEEEAAASEE get Don West the hell away from the announce table and have Heyman take his place.

[reign 0]

That's what I'm, talking about...TNA needs a whole lot of work but if Heyman still knows how to book well, cover weaknesses and lead the troops then he might be able to pull it off...TNA doesn't quite have the ego issues that WWE has yet so I hope it's a real possibilty that he winds up there.....

 

I swear that Vince is secretly trying to get TNA moving in the hopes that he can recreate the boom period of the 90's

[justcoz 0]

My uncle, who isn't on the internet at all, said the same thing about it almost being like Vince McMahon is giving people he doesn't want to deal with to TNA and saying, "do something".

 

I happen to think Vince Russo and Paul Heyman could work kind of well together. Russo ripped off Heyman and ECW whether he wants to openly admit it or not. He was watching ECW while working for WWF Magazine and shaking his head as to how bad the WWF product was in comparison and probably knew that certain aspects of ECW could help WWF reestablish themselves in the competition with Nitro.

 

So between the two of them... you have Russo who worked as Vince's right hand man throughout the WWF revival and Paul Heyman who has been working within the WWE structure for the past five years, knows their current creative process and their development system. If this is all a shoot - we know Heyman must have some very strong negativity towards WWE creative, Stephanie, Vince, Kevin Dunn and the whole system. It would be quite the middle finger for him to go to TNA, help mold them into a legitimate alternative to the WWE product, beat ECW in the ratings, hell I'd even talk Spike into moving TNA to Tuesday nights with a two hour show starting at 9pm. This way they are going head to head but not against Raw.

 

Wouldn't it be great if Heyman was going head to head with ECW?

 

wwe.com is doing a good job at masking the line between work and shoot with those website articles however

[cabbageboy 0]

I won't comment much on the ECW spoilers since who knows if Heyman was involved in the booking there or not. We might not tell for a couple of weeks what they are actually doing sans Heyman.

 

I keep hearing about the work/shoot aspects of this Heyman thing but here is one thing that keeps coming back to me: What is the point of this being a work? I mean, I fail to see how this would draw a single dime if Heyman was being fake fired. If he comes back suddenly leading a pro ECW Original faction it blatantly contradicts the previous storyline. I'm not saying this is a work or that it isn't, I just don't see the point if it is.

[haws bah gawd 0]

This probably should go in the December to Dismember thread, but I think now that Heyman is gone, its appropriate.

 

It never really set in with me that the old ECW is dead and buried until last night, sitting in the crowd at DtD. I finally had to accept the fact that I was sitting in a WWE crowd, and the only resemblence to the ECW of old was a few of the originals.

 

During the Stevie vs Rene Dupree dark match, instead of the typical YOU SUCK DICK and YOU CANT WRESTLE chants being directed towards Dupree (or really any heel for that matter), all I heard were the typical USA USA USA or <INSERT NAME HERE> SUCKS chants from the 10 year olds in attendance. There was a small SHES A CRACK WHORE chant that was attempted to be directed towards Melina, but it was soon drowned out by a nigh-pitched NITRO SUCKS chant. Nitro wouldn't even be wrestling and would still get the chant. You would have figured Striker would have gotten a good old SHUT THE FUCK UP chant during his promo, but instead all that was heard was STRIKER SUCKS. For fucks sake, there was even some tool at the show that kept holding up a DX sign.

 

I know thats nitpicky, but IMO a lot of the old ECW charm was the various chants that came from the crowds. This is now lost and replaced by the same old tired, done to death chants that have been screamed by WWE crowds for years. Out of all the people in attendance at the show, the section to the right of ours had a group of about 10 guys that attempted to get the crowd going with some old school ECW chants, only to be drowned out by the WWE fans.

 

The old ECW is dead and gone and this has finally sunk in with me. I was holding onto some hope because the extreme rules matches that are occasionally on Sci-Fi gave me happy memories of the old ECW, but even that is gone now for the most part.

 

Fuck you Vince. Here's to Heyman, god-willing, heading to TNA, lighting a fire under the ass of the creative team, and finally turning them into legit competition to WWE.

[RedJed 0]

The amount of press on WWE.com along with its tenor really makes it smell like a work.

 

Why would they quote RVD on WWE.com saying the thinks ECW will suck without Heyman?

 

Plus add the fact they quoted Burke saying the exact same shit Heyman said during his promo on the ppv last night too.

 

It also was kind of oddly strange in a worked sense that Heyman was shown crying last night for no apparent reason but for Show losing? Seemed out of place and made me think the company already had something up their sleeve as recently as last night to work something with Heyman into the product.

 

For all we know the meeting went well with Vince, Heyman spoke up, was heard, and is getting more creative freedom back and this is just some goofy start for Heyman back in power. And/or him coming back as a rogue outsider of sorts leading the disenfranchised "Original" guys on the roster like Van Dam, Sabu, Sandman, etc for the "power of the company" might be their idea what to do with Heyman with Show having to leave.

 

The timing of it all makes it very suspicious to say the least though, and makes me want to believe its not a work. I mean that show last night was not just bad but brutal, and knowing Heyman's legit passion for the brand, its very concievable this is legit.