UseTheSledgehammerUh 0 Report post Posted October 10, 2007 "John Cena's not a big phenomena" I'd venture he has sold more merchandise in this decade than any other professional wrestler. And agree on the WWE being stale and all the same. It's like they desperately NEED each show to be the same. Come on, seriously, is there one good reason why AAE is the GM on ECW? It's so random. But he's a non-wrestling bad-guy! Heel GM, that will be shocking! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Mecca 0 Report post Posted October 10, 2007 What a major swerve that was for HBK's music to play and Ted Nugent to come out like that... With ratings like that expect panic and Orton to be a very short champion, hey just like last time, his Raw title win bombed the ratings... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
cabbageboy 0 Report post Posted October 10, 2007 Orton is someone who can be part of a group like Evolution, or maybe even successfully tag with someone like Edge (who can do the real work), but Orton has never been and will never be THE guy who can carry a main event level feud for a company. Let's also consider this a bit. What the fuck has Orton really done kayfabe wise to be WWE champion? This past year he and Edge mostly got their asses kicked by DX in between their vaguely homoerotic antics. Then Michaels basically beat the crap out of both of them alone once HHH was hurt. Cena beat Orton's ass a bunch of times prior to WM, then Edge humiliated him and made him look like a moron. Orton jobbed at Backlash, and also jobbed clean to Edge as a punishment or whatever. From this point Orton starts giving people concussions, but really never BEAT anyone of serious note. Put HBK out of action, but didn't actually you know WIN that match. Put RVD out of action (and out of WWE) but Van Dam actually beat him in the match! During this Orton also attacked old farts like Dusty and Slaughter and a debuting rookie Cody Rhodes. Somehow this made him the #1 contender, despite not really going over anyone that was a serious contender. So he gets his big shot at SummerSlam and promptly jobs to Cena clean. Somehow he gets a rematch, not by actually WINNING a match or anything, but by attacking Cena's dad. Then at that PPV Cena's dad actually beats the holy hell out of Orton with his own goofy kick. Due to that non finish Orton gets another shot at the belt, and this time only gets it via forfeit because Cena is injured. Then he promptly jobs it to HHH in uneventful fashion, only to regain it after HHH has to wrestle 3 times in one night. Just read that and you'll see why few people would be interested in an Orton title run. The guy has been booked like a complete joke for so long that nobody buys it. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Scroby 0 Report post Posted October 10, 2007 There's a lot of things wrong with Raw, their World Title scene is pretty stale, either it's been the same champion for over a year, the same guys going after the title, or we (The fans) expect the same wrestlers to win the title. Raw needs new faces in that title scene and new faces, wrestlers who fans don't expect to win the title but actually want to win the World Title on Raw, should be winning the title instead of being jobbed to a guy whose failing hard as a champion, when it's pretty apprrant the fans would love the guy whose losing to become the champion. Another problem is when guys are actually getting over as a face or heel and the fans are really getting into the wrestler as a face or a heel (loving or hating him), they're pushed is stopped short and all of a sudden that person is either off tv, goes on a giant loosing streak, moved away from someone they're having a good program with, or they're let go. The Sandman is a prime example of how bad the WWE fucked up with letting him go. He was really getting over with the fans, and the entire time on Raw, he barely did anything, and he was still getting over. Hell, I honestly believe if they did some kind of Steve Austin gimmick push with the Sandman, he woud have been the most over wrestler on Raw, but he got let go. Raw really needs a facelift. They need to put new faces in the World title scene, they need new fresh faces as World title holders. Raw needs to push the mid-card title as well. The IC title scene also needs a facelift as well. They're are so many wrestlers on Raw who would be perfect in that area but are either kept off tv or have a quick feud with the IC title holder, quickly lose, and the entire thing is forgotten a week or two later. Remember when wrestlers used to CHASE after the IC title? Remember how important the IC title seemed when wrestlers would go after whoever the IC champion was? Raw needs stuff like that to happen again, make programs and wrestlers and EVERY title important again. That's a reason why I like ECW so much, there might be only one title but it seems EVERYONE is after it or two wrestlers are involved in a program that is getting enough attention and is actually being pushed enough to help get over and isn't just forgotten a week or two later. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
alfdogg 0 Report post Posted October 10, 2007 Kids are still out trick or treating. haha Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CBright7831 0 Report post Posted October 10, 2007 If there's one thing WWE has done this year is they have provided TSM make a lot of animated gifs - see Vince's limo blowing up, Orton kick to the head of Cena's dad, and Teddy Long's heart attack. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
sluggo 0 Report post Posted October 10, 2007 With Cena gone, I can honestly say I'm not interested in watching Raw. I mean with Cena around it was some element of surprise there i.e. him losing to Carlito and Khali. Then you got the love/hate the fans have for him which always made his matches seem epic. Plus I've been following the guy since his debut on SD. Does anyone remember Orton's first match on SD when he came out in those blue tights? It was a bad transition from Cena to Orton basically. What Vince should've done is had a tournament on the PPV and had the finals on Raw. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mfn 0 Report post Posted October 10, 2007 With Cena gone, I can honestly say I'm not interested in watching Raw. I mean with Cena around it was some element of surprise there i.e. him losing to Carlito and Khali. Then you got the love/hate the fans have for him which always made his matches seem epic. Plus I've been following the guy since his debut on SD. Does anyone remember Orton's first match on SD when he came out in those blue tights? It was a bad transition from Cena to Orton basically. What Vince should've done is had a tournament on the PPV and had the finals on Raw. Carlito? Really? And yeah.. Throw away a HUGE PPV match on free television. You might as well join the WWE writing team. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Black Lushus 0 Report post Posted October 10, 2007 yeah sluggo, that's not a very good idea... should have given it to Jeff Hardy...it would be something different, he's over huge, it could have worked for a couple of months. Just don't let him talk!!! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
CBright7831 0 Report post Posted October 10, 2007 yeah sluggo, that's not a very good idea... should have given it to Jeff Hardy...it would be something different, he's over huge, it could have worked for a couple of months. Just don't let him talk!!! PRAISE THE LORD!!!! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bobobrazil1984 0 Report post Posted October 10, 2007 I dont see why everyone's so hostile to the thought that Cena disappearing may have hit the ratings. He has, as I understand, been the champion for what, a full year now? For him to just disappear b/c of injury, and not lose the title, and have it be ping-ponged back and forht between hhh and orton... I can certainly see that turning off some people. Face of the company for a year. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Boxer 0 Report post Posted October 10, 2007 "John Cena's not a big phenomena" I'd venture he has sold more merchandise in this decade than any other professional wrestler. And agree on the WWE being stale and all the same. It's like they desperately NEED each show to be the same. Come on, seriously, is there one good reason why AAE is the GM on ECW? It's so random. But he's a non-wrestling bad-guy! Heel GM, that will be shocking! Just wondering about your sig, are you going to include Umaga and Orton? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
sluggo 0 Report post Posted October 10, 2007 With Cena gone, I can honestly say I'm not interested in watching Raw. I mean with Cena around it was some element of surprise there i.e. him losing to Carlito and Khali. Then you got the love/hate the fans have for him which always made his matches seem epic. Plus I've been following the guy since his debut on SD. Does anyone remember Orton's first match on SD when he came out in those blue tights? It was a bad transition from Cena to Orton basically. What Vince should've done is had a tournament on the PPV and had the finals on Raw. Carlito? Really? And yeah.. Throw away a HUGE PPV match on free television. You might as well join the WWE writing team. I was talking about their match before Summerslam when Orton caused Cena to get the back stabber and Carlito pinned him which came out of left field. I was talking about that type of surprise element. You know a lot of Cena haters tune in just to see if he gets his ass handed to him. and about the title match, my idea looks better than having HHH and Orton wrestle twice on the same PPV (of course it could've been a 3 stages of hell match) Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mfn 0 Report post Posted October 10, 2007 With Cena gone, I can honestly say I'm not interested in watching Raw. I mean with Cena around it was some element of surprise there i.e. him losing to Carlito and Khali. Then you got the love/hate the fans have for him which always made his matches seem epic. Plus I've been following the guy since his debut on SD. Does anyone remember Orton's first match on SD when he came out in those blue tights? It was a bad transition from Cena to Orton basically. What Vince should've done is had a tournament on the PPV and had the finals on Raw. Carlito? Really? And yeah.. Throw away a HUGE PPV match on free television. You might as well join the WWE writing team. I was talking about their match before Summerslam when Orton caused Cena to get the back stabber and Carlito pinned him which came out of left field. I was talking about that type of surprise element. You know a lot of Cena haters tune in just to see if he gets his ass handed to him. and about the title match, my idea looks better than having HHH and Orton wrestle twice on the same PPV (of course it could've been a 3 stages of hell match) No, your idea is terrible. If they were going to do the tournament thing, they would have done it at the PPV, and then had the finals at the PPV. Why just have a tournament with no pay off just to blow it off on Raw the next night? It makes absolutely no sense. The logical way to have done it would have been to have the tournament on RAW with the finals on the PPV, but that wouldn't have happened because Cena got injured on the RAW before the PPV. ------ Even as the biggest Cena hater on the board (more for his character and in ring ability than anything else), I came to terms a long time ago that Cena was never going to drop the title unless he got hurt, now look what happened. I will admit, the man can draw some heat, but I still hate him. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Atticus Chaos 0 Report post Posted October 10, 2007 Orton is someone who can be part of a group like Evolution, or maybe even successfully tag with someone like Edge (who can do the real work), but Orton has never been and will never be THE guy who can carry a main event level feud for a company. Has he ever been given the chance? And, before you say "last night's ratings prove he can't", you know, that's one week. Let's not totally bitch about the guys reign within the first 48 hours. Let's also consider this a bit. What the fuck has Orton really done kayfabe wise to be WWE champion? This past year he and Edge mostly got their asses kicked by DX in between their vaguely homoerotic antics. Then Michaels basically beat the crap out of both of them alone once HHH was hurt. Cena beat Orton's ass a bunch of times prior to WM, then Edge humiliated him and made him look like a moron. Orton jobbed at Backlash, and also jobbed clean to Edge as a punishment or whatever. From this point Orton starts giving people concussions, but really never BEAT anyone of serious note. Put HBK out of action, but didn't actually you know WIN that match. Put RVD out of action (and out of WWE) but Van Dam actually beat him in the match! Ever heard the term lose the battle win the war? In the RVD/Orton feud there's no doubt Orton came out on top. RVD may have gotten the win, but since his career was ended (kayfabe) he was definetly the ultimate loser. Same with HBK. He didn't get the pinfall but you know he did HBK serious damage, currently illustrated by the fact that HBK is now so eager to get revenge on him. If the HBK/Randy concussion thing was as irrelevent as you claim, why is HBK so mad about it? During this Orton also attacked old farts like Dusty and Slaughter and a debuting rookie Cody Rhodes. Somehow this made him the #1 contender, despite not really going over anyone that was a serious contender. So he gets his big shot at SummerSlam and promptly jobs to Cena clean. Somehow he gets a rematch, not by actually WINNING a match or anything, but by attacking Cena's dad. Then at that PPV Cena's dad actually beats the holy hell out of Orton with his own goofy kick. Kicking Cena's dad got him way more heat that if he had just beaten Hardy or Kennedy to become number 1 contender. Due to that non finish Orton gets another shot at the belt, and this time only gets it via forfeit because Cena is injured. Then he promptly jobs it to HHH in uneventful fashion, only to regain it after HHH has to wrestle 3 times in one night. Orton had wrestled twice that night, he wasn't fresh either when he beat HHH (clean). It was a lot more credible than any of Edge's MITB title wins. Just read that and you'll see why few people would be interested in an Orton title run. The guy has been booked like a complete joke for so long that nobody buys it. I don't think he's been booked great. But look at the other main eventers. Rey has been booked as a jobber who needs Batista to save him. Batista himself needs about 9 title shots to finally win, Khali was turned into a clown. CM Punk gets squashed by Daddy V, Booker jobs to HHH in eight minutes...etc. But no one's demanding they not be main eventers because of this. No, Orton hasn't been booked well, but who the hell has in WWE? Apart from HHH and Cena? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mfn 0 Report post Posted October 10, 2007 No, Orton hasn't been booked well, but who the hell has in WWE? Apart from HHH and Cena? NOT VAL VENIS~! jk. I don't know, I think Jeff Hardy has been booked somewhat decent. . . Also let's not forget Mr. McMahon himself! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
2GOLD 0 Report post Posted October 11, 2007 I'm going to blame the ratings drop on doughy Val Venis. Unless his new gimmick is he's the Ron Jeremy of the WWE, he's gotta hit a gym. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Black Lushus 0 Report post Posted October 11, 2007 I'm going to blame the ratings drop on doughy Val Venis. Unless his new gimmick is he's the Ron Jeremy of the WWE, he's gotta hit a gym. what's funny is that he looks more like a porn star now than he did when he first started. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
AntiLeaf33 0 Report post Posted October 11, 2007 I'm going to blame the ratings drop on doughy Val Venis. Unless his new gimmick is he's the Ron Jeremy of the WWE, he's gotta hit a gym. what's funny is that he looks more like a porn star now than he did when he first started. All he needs now is to grow a bushy mustache and it would be golden. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
