YO! TSM raps: John Cena in 2009

[Twisted Intestine 0]

But why can't he show up on Raw everyone once in a while?

 

He's not a wrestler anymore. Wrestling's his past, he's not involved in the business. WWE is the one who let his contract expire. He's trying to gain mainstream acceptance and establish himself as a leading man in Hollywood. Showing up in an arena that the mainstream media views with disgust doesn't help those matters. He's Dwayne Johnson now, no more The Rock.

 

If he wants to use his name value to promote "Race to Witch Mountain" to wrestling fans watching Raw, why not show up on Raw instead of just doing USA-made bumpers telling us to watch the trailer after Raw.

 

He called himself Dwane Johnson during those bumpers too.

 

He doesn't have to wrestle at all to show he still loves the wrestling business, but pretending it doesn't exist isn't a good way of showing that he still cares. It's like wrestling is some nerdy, unpopular girl that he claims to love when they're together in private, but ignores and denies knowing when he's with his popular friends.

 

Can you blame him though? With the Chris Benoit murder-suicide and wrestling's insane death rate, it's not something you'd really want to be associated with.

 

The Rock is ALWAYS going to be associated as a pro-wrestler. EVERYONE knows him as an ex-pro wrestler. Making an appearance or doing a match now wouldn't change anything at all. He'd still land the exact same movies he would otherwise. Nobody would say "Dwayne got famous being a wrestler but he hasn't wrestled in a few years so lets go see his movie" and then "Dwayne just had another wrestling match a couple of months ago! Eww let's not see his movie!"

 

I'm not saying he has to do it if he doesn't want to, I'm just saying it wouldn't effect how anyone (except John Cena) sees him.

 

As for the "Why would anybody want to wrestle when they can make movies", I already won that arguement last time this was brought up, so I'll leave it.

[Atticus Chaos 0]

It might affect his credibility as an actor. The rumours that he might have been wrestling may have played a role in Rourke's Oscar loss, and at the very least, it didn't help. Not that Johnson's going to be winning an Oscar anytime soon, but he has taken more serious roles in the past, and may want to do dramas again. Wrestling again would make him look like a novelty act, like Hogan, which seems to be what he's been trying to get away from.

[Twisted Intestine 0]

I believe it's possible for somebody to be taken serious as an actor and do some wrestling at the same time. Maybe it's you guys who have a complex about wrestling and think that anyone associated with it is a big joke. I also believe that "Rourke not getting the oscar because he might have wrestled" is complete bullshit and had nothing to do with weather he won or lost. Maybe his speach when he won that other award where he went off swearing etc. had something to do with it. Or maybe he was never going to win.

 

Really, I don't think the main stream you guys are talking about really care about wrestling enough at all one way or the other for it to matter to them if The Rock had another match or not.

[Atticus Chaos 0]

I believe it's possible for somebody to be taken serious as an actor and do some wrestling at the same time. Maybe it's you guys who have a complex about wrestling and think that anyone associated with it is a big joke. I also believe that "Rourke not getting the oscar because he might have wrestled" is complete bullshit and had nothing to do with weather he won or lost. Maybe his speach when he won that other award where he went off swearing etc. had something to do with it. Or maybe he was never going to win.

 

I think the main reason Penn won was gay marriage support, but Rourke said himself his people told him not to do it because they were worried it would affect his chances, and assuming they've been in the entertainment business for a while, they would know.

 

As far as serious acting and being a star in wrestling...look, if George Clooney showed up as a regular character on raw, people would probably regard him as a joke and wonder what he was doing and if he'd lost his mind, and at the very least his reputation would suffer. People in the mainstream don't take wrestling seriously at all. David Arquette only got away with it, because he was a B movie comedy actor anyway.

[JPopStarKami 0]

I don't think it would be a problem if the Rock came back for a final match or something. It's not like he'd lose credibility because as it's been said before he's known well as a former wrestler.

[bob_barron 0]

I don't think it would be a problem if the Rock came back for a final match or something. It's not like he'd lose credibility because as it's been said before he's known well as a former wrestler.

 

Dwayne Johnson had his final match. Wrestlemania XX is how he wanted to go out.

[goldengreek 0]

Didn't see it posted anywhere, but it looks as if the Cena/Rock issues that came up last year have resurfaced:

 

During last night's appearance on Jimmy Kimmel Live, John Cena said he has a problem with Dwayne "The Rock" Johnson because of the way he left pro wrestling. Johnson has stated that he loved the business but did not intend on returning when he became a movie star, and Cena said how that has affected wrestling fans when he is gone to film movies.

 

"He's obviously got his start in the WWE, gone onto movies, but in the process, the whole time while he was in the WWE, he just preached to our fans -- who are very loyal -- how much he loved the business," Cena said of Johnson. "He says he loves the business so much, but then just up and leaves. So here I am, I've done The Marine, I'm still working full-time for the WWE, I've got 12 Rounds coming out and everybody's asking, 'When are you leaving?'"

 

http://www.lordsofpain.net/news/wwe/1499.html

 

I wonder if Cena realizes that if him and the Rock were in the ring together for anything... Cena would be booed out of the building.

 

What a clown. When he accomplishes one tenth of what The Rock did then he can talk. Dude cant even get over as a face. If it wasnt for the 13 yr and younger fan base he would be a mid - carder.

 

Like posting record breaking merchandise sales (second only to Hogan, apparently), have a single WWE title run that's longer than all 7 of The Rock's combined, or managing to be just as good as The Rock (if not better) when it comes to the WWE main event style? Kayfabe or not, Cena has actually accomplished quite a lot, especially for the downturn wrestling took this decade.

 

Do you have documantation of proof of those record breaking merch sales or are you just fabricating that?

The Rock not having a long title run showed his willingness in putting people over. Cena's long title run turned people off. Its where the Cena hate started.

 

The rock can wrestle circles around Cena . Watch old tapes of The Rock when he first entered the WWE.

 

[bob_barron 0]

The Rock SUCKED when he first came into the WWF. It was terrible.

 

Cena's long title run turned people off. Its where the Cena hate started.

 

It did no such thing. Ratings and buyrates did not plummet during Cena's year long title reign.

[TheFranchise 0]

Rock doesn't get the credit he deserves for his wrestling. People lump him in the same class as Bradshaw and Nathan Jones, but he could have a good to great match with a number of people.

 

And you know what I miss?

 

His swinging around the shoulders DDT.

 

I believe it was actually called 'Laying The Smack Down'.

[goldengreek 0]

The Rock SUCKED when he first came into the WWF. It was terrible.

 

Cena's long title run turned people off. Its where the Cena hate started.

 

It did no such thing. Ratings and buyrates did not plummet during Cena's year long title reign.

 

Thats your opinion.

 

Just like Cena he had a broader moveset before the handcuffed them move with the same 5 moves.

 

The Rock was an extensive arial offence when he entered an Rocky Maiavia

[goldengreek 0]

The Rock SUCKED when he first came into the WWF. It was terrible.

 

Cena's long title run turned people off. Its where the Cena hate started.

 

It did no such thing. Ratings and buyrates did not plummet during Cena's year long title reign.

 

 

Yes they did.

[SamoaRowe 0]

Didn't see it posted anywhere, but it looks as if the Cena/Rock issues that came up last year have resurfaced:

 

During last night's appearance on Jimmy Kimmel Live, John Cena said he has a problem with Dwayne "The Rock" Johnson because of the way he left pro wrestling. Johnson has stated that he loved the business but did not intend on returning when he became a movie star, and Cena said how that has affected wrestling fans when he is gone to film movies.

 

"He's obviously got his start in the WWE, gone onto movies, but in the process, the whole time while he was in the WWE, he just preached to our fans -- who are very loyal -- how much he loved the business," Cena said of Johnson. "He says he loves the business so much, but then just up and leaves. So here I am, I've done The Marine, I'm still working full-time for the WWE, I've got 12 Rounds coming out and everybody's asking, 'When are you leaving?'"

 

http://www.lordsofpain.net/news/wwe/1499.html

 

I wonder if Cena realizes that if him and the Rock were in the ring together for anything... Cena would be booed out of the building.

 

What a clown. When he accomplishes one tenth of what The Rock did then he can talk. Dude cant even get over as a face. If it wasnt for the 13 yr and younger fan base he would be a mid - carder.

 

Like posting record breaking merchandise sales (second only to Hogan, apparently), have a single WWE title run that's longer than all 7 of The Rock's combined, or managing to be just as good as The Rock (if not better) when it comes to the WWE main event style? Kayfabe or not, Cena has actually accomplished quite a lot, especially for the downturn wrestling took this decade.

 

Do you have documantation of proof of those record breaking merch sales or are you just fabricating that?

The Rock not having a long title run showed his willingness in putting people over. Cena's long title run turned people off. Its where the Cena hate started.

 

The rock can wrestle circles around Cena . Watch old tapes of The Rock when he first entered the WWE.

 

Source: The Wrestling Observer

 

It's being reported that John Cena's 2008 merchandise sales were the highest single year grossing numbers in company history with the exception of Stone Cold Steve Austin and Hulk Hogan. This has to be considered a huge accomplishment considering Cena was out of action for a few months during 2008.

 

Just one example.

 

Okay, my bad, best sales since Hogan and Austin. Notice higher than The Rock's, at least.

 

And you really want me to go look back at Rock's early matches? Are you serious? You're talking about Rocky Maivia, smiling babyface who the fans shit all over? Compare that to Cena's first months where his weaknesses were covered up so well due to the performances he was having with Angle, Jericho, etc. Hell, I don't even remember Cena being as bad as people made him out to be until he hurt his leg at the 2004 Royal Rumble and they kept booking him in rediculous superman matches in the following months to cover for it.

 

I'm not saying you have to love Cena and be a fan of his, but you and lots of other Cena haters really amaze me in that you will not accept facts and reality.

[muzz 0]

Rock doesn't get the credit he deserves for his wrestling. People lump him in the same class as Bradshaw and Nathan Jones, but he could have a good to great match with a number of people.

 

And you know what I miss?

 

His swinging around the shoulders DDT.

 

I believe it was actually called 'Laying The Smack Down'.

 

One thing I always noticed and really liked about the Rock in the ring was how much sheer energy and effort he put in. I rate him very high for that reason alone.

 

 

[The Buzz 0]

The Rock is one of those guys like Sting, Warrior, Flair, Foley, and a few others that I could still mark for. It's a pity that the rumored Sting vs The Rock match that he supposedly pitched was denied. That would have made my day big time.

[garfieldsnose 0]

Evidence or not, goldengreek ain't biting. He wants people to come up with evidence but replies to posts with "That's your opinion" and "Yes, ratings and PPV sales did plummet with Cena at the top" when he has no factual evidence to support his statement, and even if he tried to get some he wouldn't find any because his point is completely irrelevant. Same shit, different day for this guy.

[Twisted Intestine 0]

"Ratings and buyrates did not plummet during Cena's year long title reign."

 

"That's your opinion."

 

Thread over.

[Wally Balls 0]

In regards to the arguement of "who's a better wrestler, Cena or Rock?", I agree that Cena was better in his early days than Rock, although I think Rock surpassed him when he put on that ladder match with HHH at Summerslam. The Rock is the superior wrestler in my opinion, based soley on the fact of how much he can get the crowd into the match. Cena is over, but he doesn't have the crowd eating out of his hand, at least not everyone. Take the pop The People's Elbow gets and compare that to the Five Knuckle Shuffle. It really isn't even close. The Rock is the superior 'entertainer', which is pretty much synonymous with 'wrestler'.

 

I like Cena, and I generally enjoy watching him whenever I happen to watch wrestling, but with a new movie coming out, as well as Wrestlemania, you'd figure he'd talk a little more about those things, and less about his bitter dislike and jealousy towards the more successful Dwayne Johnson.

[cabbageboy 0]

The main difference between the two guys isn't so much the in ring wrestling. The Rock was wildly fun but was hardly a technical marvel out there, doing a ton of moves sloppy I always thought (like his awkward belly to belly). The difference is on the mic. Cena just cuts the lamest promos, full of bad poop jokes, over the top delivery, and generally coming off like a Rock wannabe.

 

It's hard to truly know about Cena's PPV numbers and what it means since there are now 3 brands on every show, various title matches, and several top guys. So it's hard to really say "This one guy drew the money." Some of the time during Cena's run he wasn't even notable on the show, playing 2nd fiddle to the DX reunion or screwing around with guys like Khali.

 

If we're comparing him to The Rock in terms of PPVs and ratings, check out the year 2000. The Rock either main evented or was prominent that whole year and they did ratings in the 6.0-7.0 range that whole year (until Raw moved to TNN, then it dropped a bit) and every PPV from the 2000 Royal Rumble until WM X-7 did over a 1.0 buyrate.

[Spaceman Spiff 0]

The difference is on the mic. Cena just cuts the lamest promos, full of bad poop jokes, over the top delivery, and generally coming off like a Rock wannabe.

I'm not saying Rock wasn't great on the mic, but he had his share of really lame bits ("strudel", "pancakes", "who in the blue hell" are just 3 off the top of my head). People popped for them, sure, but let's not pretend these were any better than some of the stuff they make Cena say.

[Diamonddust 0]

In regards to the arguement of "who's a better wrestler, Cena or Rock?", I agree that Cena was better in his early days than Rock, although I think Rock surpassed him when he put on that ladder match with HHH at Summerslam. The Rock is the superior wrestler in my opinion, based soley on the fact of how much he can get the crowd into the match. Cena is over, but he doesn't have the crowd eating out of his hand, at least not everyone. Take the pop The People's Elbow gets and compare that to the Five Knuckle Shuffle. It really isn't even close. The Rock is the superior 'entertainer', which is pretty much synonymous with 'wrestler'.

 

I like Cena, and I generally enjoy watching him whenever I happen to watch wrestling, but with a new movie coming out, as well as Wrestlemania, you'd figure he'd talk a little more about those things, and less about his bitter dislike and jealousy towards the more successful Dwayne Johnson.

 

I think the People's Elbow is a good example. The Rock was able to make one of the simplest moves be one of the most anticipated spots in the match.

[King Cucaracha 0]

The difference is on the mic. Cena just cuts the lamest promos, full of bad poop jokes, over the top delivery, and generally coming off like a Rock wannabe.

I'm not saying Rock wasn't great on the mic, but he had his share of really lame bits ("strudel", "pancakes", "who in the blue hell" are just 3 off the top of my head). People popped for them, sure, but let's not pretend these were any better than some of the stuff they make Cena say.

 

Some of his stuff was REALLY bad. "How's your lips?" springs to mind. Coming out of the mouth of anyone else they'd have got the same reaction some of Cena's stuff does.

 

The difference is, The Rock was cool. He could get away with the jokes that bombed because he was cool. That and the delivery. Cena doesn't have that. He's a regular guy. That's his appeal. The Rock's appeal was that he was the guy everybody wished they were.

 

 

Anyway, I think Cena might have a point about being disappointed, as a wrestler, of Rock washing his hands of wrestling. And Rock is probably right to have done so. But I think the true point we shouldn't forget in all of this is this:

 

The Rock was an extensive arial offence when he entered an Rocky Maiavia

[haws bah gawd 0]

Facts are facts, but there's still something in Cena that's just making me not give 2 shits about him. Maybe it's the fact that he has been doing the same thing for the past 5 years, with little to no change, or maybe it's just his look. I really don't know exactly what it is. I hear his music and it's like "great, this guy again". It's the little things, like that goofy salute he always does in his entrance (at least Mysterio knew when it was time to let go of that "flapping his arms like a bird" part of his entrance), even his 5 moves of doom have worn thin with me. Just because the guy has outrageous merchandise sales doesn't mean everyone is obligated to like watching him perform.

[Art Sandusky 0]

Holy fucking shit, Trish is goddamn HOT now. I mean, she was already, but now it's a whole barrel of OMG. Good for her getting out of the business, 'cause no way Vince would allow the new look. Wowowow.

 

EDIT: Uh, to be on topic more, I agree with Haws Bah Gawd. I really thought I'd dig Cena more after a few years of him on top but something's just... lacking. He has moments of brilliance, but it's never sustained for an entire angle or promo.

[King Cucaracha 0]

Just because the guy has outrageous merchandise sales doesn't mean everyone is obligated to like watching him perform.

 

To be fair, I don't think anybody's saying you should like watching him wrestle. All people are saying is, don't pretend he doesn't have those merchandise sales just because you don't like him, ala goldengreek.

[Jobber of the Week 0]

Regarding all the Counter-Hate. "He busts his ass" "he puts on watchable matches and wrestles a lot, what's not to love?" etc etc etc

 

It's not that Cena is a bad wrestler. When he's not just Five Moves of Dooming his way through, he can put on a good match. The thing is that the wrestling would be as good or as bad regardless of how it's presented.

 

Cena from 2005 or so onwards has just been a living action figure. "Attitude" struck a tone with a lot of people by going out there and admitting that even good guys have their dark sides. This was deemed more true to life than the Hogan model, though Russoing it up with unbelievably stupid angles caused the final product to stop feeling at all "real" sometime in 1998.

 

It's not about what his wrestling is like, it's that he's a flawless puritan being of good and that is BORING. Is this what you truly find interesting? Why not just buy wind-up action figures, wind them up, and them on a march toward each other and see which one falls over first? Just pretend that Cena is GI Joe, Edge is Cobra Commander, HBK is that doll you borrowed from your sister, Big Show is your old broken Megazord that can barely move, etc.

 

I like characters to have a little depth. The most interesting Cena match in the past year on booking was Batista. There was a lot of word that Cena VS Batista had WM main event written on it. Why? Not because of any kind of long term booking or chemistry, but because even the guys with the book know that they're so highly protected that simply putting their crowd heat on the line might draw a buyrate.

 

I want Cena around, I just want the higher-ups to stop playing it so damn safe with him. It doesn't help that we know from the old "spoken rap entrance" days that Cena can do so much more than what he's doing.

[SamoaRowe 0]

Just because the guy has outrageous merchandise sales doesn't mean everyone is obligated to like watching him perform.

 

To be fair, I don't think anybody's saying you should like watching him wrestle. All people are saying is, don't pretend he doesn't have those merchandise sales just because you don't like him, ala goldengreek.

 

Exactly.

[Twisted Intestine 0]

Facts are facts

 

That's your opinion.

[The Niggardly King 0]

I can see where the old breed of "smarks" hates this new breed as it just used to be "Hey, this guy sucks and I don't like him!" and you'd find a bunch of people with the same opinion, and if someone did like the guy they'd bring up why and you'd never deal with facts & figures.

 

 

[Mike wanna be 0]

I agree with this:

The difference is, The Rock was cool. He could get away with the jokes that bombed because he was cool. That and the delivery. Cena doesn't have that. He's a regular guy. That's his appeal. The Rock's appeal was that he was the guy everybody wished they were.

This makes Cena the douchebag friend we all remember having who, whenever they find someone far cooler than them, they begin to badly emulate everything they do in hopes of being nearly as cool to the point where even if they do eventually do something cool you're hesitant to admit it because you're afraid the support will egg them on into continuing with another few months of shitty impressions and catchphrase spouting.

 

I also agree with this:

It's not about what his wrestling is like, it's that he's a flawless puritan being of good and that is BORING

Hell, just look at the Big Show/Edge contract signing where Cena weaseled his way in. That's a heel storyline if I ever saw one, the douchebag blackmailed a general manager into putting him into a World title match, and as soon as the contract was signed he proceeded to out his bargaining chip against the GM anyway for no reason other than to be a dick.

 

If that'd been Orton or Edge, we wouldn't hear the end of the "dastardly, heinous, reprehensible tactics" used by the "opportunistic/Ultimate Opportunist" until Summerslam. But because it's His Holiness we won't hear a peep out of anybody. Angles like this make me wish for Jesse Ventura to come out of retirement & get behind the color commentary mic.

[sluggo 0]

I miss rapper Cena. That character was so fresh, plus he wasn't talking all that stay in school Mr. Softy rap Rikishi did. He actually pushed the limits of his word play and ran down his opposition some times right in front of their face. Right now all we hear is blah blah blah at the ppv blah blah blah. Nothing you won't remember 10 minutes later. Rapper Cena had lines I still remember 6 years later. Much like Rock, I didn't give a shit how his workrate was, his promos were the highlight of the program.